30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Welcome to the Leverguns.Com Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here ... politely.

Moderators: AmBraCol, Hobie

Forum rules
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.

Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Post Reply
JohndeFresno
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 4559
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2007 1:52 pm

30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by JohndeFresno »

Shooting Times, September 2011, starting at pg. 48, has first hand accounts of bears being successfully and quickly taken with Hornady's latest all metal (California legal) wonder:
.30-30 Monoflex 140 gr. plastic tip bullet
2,465 fps Muzzle (per Hornady, 24 in. barrel)
1,889 ft. lbs. ME (per Hornady)
Hornady's answer to Barnes' FTX line

Pros:
1) The bullet reportedly functions well in any 30-30 *
2) Per article: Consistent, dramatic expansion, no separation
3) Good penetration - see article
4) Streamlined bullet and flex tip provides 2.20 inches at 100 yards
5) It's California legal for hunting!
6) Bullets are now available as a component.
7) Allegedly, 140 gr. jacketed load data will work for this bullet.
Either the article or Hornady site (don't remember now) claims that you can use existing 140 gr. (jacketed) ballistics with this bullet for loading purposes. As stated below, I'd start cautiously.

* In this article the 464 Mossberg levergun is used ($535 list); as opposed to the Hornady LeverEvolution bullets that seem to demand the newer Marlins with their unique rifling.

Cons:
1) Die hard traditionalists will hate all copper, rubber tip missile!
2) Bullets (components) are about as expensive as Barnes types
3) Load data not yet published at Hornady site or elsewhere,
although it is stated that you can use load data for similar
140 grainers. I'd start cautiously, since all metal bullets are
a bit different in how they grip the barrel (friction) and so on.

This bullet certainly has my attention. The article is well written, not the common rah-rah, "everything is perfect" fare that you get with a lot of gun mags whose writers are rewarded with favors from the companies that they are covering(!).

Instead, you have a write-up of the actual hunts in which this bullet is used. Like 86er's outstanding "African Odyssey" stories posted earler at this site, the author gives a detailed account of what the bullet did in the game. It is worth the price of the Shooting Times mag on the stands if you are not a subscriber.
madman4570
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 6747
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:30 am
Location: Lower Central NYS

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by madman4570 »

Yep, That's about right (2465fps w /140gr)at the muzzle, that's what the 7MM Mag is doing (2482fps at 400 yards) with same weight GMX bullet. Bear Killer?????????????
Good lord, let's stick to deer before someone gets killed :o

And did I say I still love the 30-30(though I do like my .35 Rem better?)
But real is real!
Don McDowell

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by Don McDowell »

Those bullets sound interesting. I haven't read that magazine yet, altho it is setting by my chair.
They should put yet another new twist on the cartridge that made all the bigbores go obsolete . :wink:
JohndeFresno
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 4559
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2007 1:52 pm

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by JohndeFresno »

madman4570 wrote:...Bear Killer?????????????
Good lord, let's stick to deer before someone gets killed :o
Madman, you have to read the article:
1) Bears dropped pretty quick due to penetration. cohesion and expansion, even with angling shots!
2) The author was no fool - he was shooting from a tree stand; and -
3) If the bullet can take bears, even marginally, methinks it is a pretty cool, powerful round. But I wouldn't rely upon it, either, when I have a .45-70, .270, and .30-06 to choose from - should I ever get the opportunity to hunt Mr. Bruin.
Don McDowell

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by Don McDowell »

Read the article, gunwriters don't know much about what they write these days do they? Almost didn't finish it when in the second paragraph this guy goes on about how the 30-30 was the transistion cartridge between Keith and the 45-70 and Oconnor and the 270 :shock: :roll: Good lord where do they get these guys :(
Anyway there's never been any trouble with a 30-30 taking bears before and with the penetration offered by these monolithic bullets surely won't be any trouble in the future.
JohndeFresno
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 4559
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2007 1:52 pm

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by JohndeFresno »

Don McDowell wrote:...this guy goes on about how the 30-30 was the transition cartridge between Keith and the 45-70...
In defense of the writer, and taking in the context of his paragraph, I believe he used these two calibers as extreme examples on both ends of the Slow/Big - Small/Fast age old argument, as commonly and hotly debated by hunters and gun buffs.

Mr. Cooper always loved .40 plus, and especially .45 slugs; Mr. O'Connor went for the hyperfast (in his time) diminutive .270 Winchester. We all know that the 30-30 isn't extremely fast, nor is it large and heavy - it's kinda "Mr. Inbetween;" and like both of the other calibers, it is a hunting cartridge that has been used for a long time.
Don McDowell

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by Don McDowell »

To each his own I suppose, but being that the 30wcf was around 20 years prior to the 270, and is the cartridge that started the big bore bp rounds into the world of obscolesence....
User avatar
Canuck Bob
Senior Levergunner
Posts: 1830
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:57 am
Location: Calgary, Canada

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by Canuck Bob »

African hunters report a SD of 300 as appropriate for outstanding penetration on Dg. Thats 200 gr for a 30 caliber and 400 for a 444. 180 gr is the standard for good whack in 30 cal rifles 300-350 is big medicine in a 444. A 140 grain bullet in a 30-30 was once a small deer and coyote combo bullet and now through the magic of pot metal bullets and plastic it is a bear bullet. The problem in my eyes is that with lead going away the heavy weight bullet will get so long millions of current weapons will not be able to stabilize them. The industry needs to convince us that the new140gr is the old 180gr.

The 30-30 is a fine deer/blackie bottom power range round with sturdy 170gr for a rifleman based on a century of success. The 308 with a 165-180 gr is real dandy for bear and with the heavier bullet even with a moose tag. Ken Waters sees the 300 Savage as a good measuring stick for deer and bear mid power range, the 30-06 has always been considered one of the ideal all-arounders closing in on the top power range. Closer the better within reason of course. That works with 170 grains and good placement in a 30-30. I like the Nosler partition for the 30-30. Never used one in a 30-30 but years ago we had good honest bullets like the Silvertip and the premium was the Partition.

I get my real advice same as you. Ask these guys who often have decades of constant testing and hunting under thier belt.
User avatar
FWiedner
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 8862
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2007 9:50 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by FWiedner »

Sounds interesting.

I'll have to pick that issue up and see if the write up can convince me.

:wink:
Government office attracts the power-mad, yet it's people who just want to be left alone to live life on their own terms who are considered dangerous.

History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
madman4570
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 6747
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:30 am
Location: Lower Central NYS

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by madman4570 »

OK,
If not Brenneke then--------
http://www.dixieslugs.com/photos.html
Check out the results. I like the Terminator or (Xterminator)they would do for Bear.
Also---------The Dixie IXL-DGS is .730" and weighs 870 grs. It is designed for rifled barrels and .729"/.730" bore smoothbore with cylinder chokes. The velocity in the loaded rounds is 1200'/" from 20" 12 gauge 3" Hastings rifled barrels. Dixie designed his slug as requested by experienced shooters in Alaska.
User avatar
Blaine
Posting leader...
Posts: 30495
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:22 pm
Location: Still Deciding

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by Blaine »

30wcf is enough gun, if we are enough gunner :wink: I will be matriculating to .284 this year to save my shoulder a bit. I think I'll be loading my 45-70s down, too.
The Rotten Fruit Always Hits The Ground First

Proud Life Member Of:
NRA
Second Amendment Foundation
Citizens Committee For The Right To Keep And Bear Arms
DAV
User avatar
Sarge
Levergunner 3.0
Posts: 864
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2008 10:54 am
Location: MO

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by Sarge »

What's needed for the 30-30 is a 180 grain FMJ with a big flat meplat. That would solve any penetration deficiencies where heavy game is concerned, it would likely rivet a bit at the nose on impact. Trick bullets are not the answer.
People were smarter before the Internet, or imbeciles were harder to notice.
tman
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 3243
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:43 pm

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by tman »

Thanks for the info. Another round to add to the 30-30 arsenial. we are living in a golden age of firearms and ammunition :D
tman
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 3243
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:43 pm

Re: 30-30 (lever safe) Bear Killer by Hornady

Post by tman »

Would be neat if Hornandy would load the 140 with their magical powders along with a 190 hardcast with same powders in a .307WCF. Might give a .308 WCF bolt a run for the money :idea: :?:
Post Reply