30-30 solids - got some questions.

[goon]

Sorry if this has been covered but I haven't been having much luck finding any info with the search. I just don't quite have it figured out yet.
Anyway, does anyone know where I can find some really hard cast bullets or some jacketed flat nose bullets for the .30-30 that will give maximum penetration?
Any leads would be appreciated.
Also, I'd like to hear your experiences with heavier, hard bullets in this caliber.

[Malamute]

What exactly do you want to do with them?

Most of the commercial cast bullets are cast pretty hard, too hard in many peoples opinion.



The factories used to load full jacketed 30-30 bullets years ago, but they haven't been around since the early 60's I think. you may turn up some old component bullets or ammo somewhere if you keep your eyes open. I'd like to have a few myself for having around when toting the small caliber gun around up on the mountain.

[gundownunder]

Give these guys a go.

http://www.rpgfirearms.com.au/WESTCASTINGS.htm
Westcastings USA
Phone +1(909) 788-9155
Fax +1(909) 788-1775
Cell +1(909) 288-3078
westcastingsusa@aol.com

A lot of the blokes over here use Westcastings, they're hard, and over here they're cheap, and they're also accurate
The gold match bullets are guaranteed to 1700fps but can be driven up to 2000fps without leading.

[jd45]

Leadhead Bullets are 22, I think, on the Brinell hardness scale..........that ought to do what you want. Their website is ProShootPro.com, but they're in the States. Kansas, I believe. Don't know if that's a concern to you or not. And I'm cutious as well, as to what you'll be using them for, if you don't mind telling. jd45

[Duff L Bagg]

Try these


http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=790975

[goon]

Leadhead Bullets are 22, I think, on the Brinell hardness scale..........that ought to do what you want. Their website is ProShootPro.com, but they're in the States. Kansas, I believe. Don't know if that's a concern to you or not. And I'm cutious as well, as to what you'll be using them for, if you don't mind telling. jd45

Really, right now I don't have an actual use for them.
In my area the biggest threat I'm likely to encounter would be an angry black bear.
But the truth is that I've always gotten along with blackies better than I get along with my own family.
I see them, they see me. Then I give them the right of way and they take it or they give me the right of way and I take it. Or we both just sort of divert ourselves off another direction and neither of us is really all that inconvenienced.
I've actually felt kind of priviledged to see them in the woods when I've been hunting or hiking. I don't hunt bears and I'd never take a shot at one unless it was threatening me or someone else.
Regardless though, a 170 grain SP would do just fine on them.

But some day I might head farther west or to Alaska. I've kicked it around a lot. I know that some of you guys do have large brown bears in those areas. A 30-30 wouldn't be ideal for defense against one of them, but if your bullets penetrated far enough I imagine the 30-30 would probably do well enough.
So that's kind of why I want to experiement a little with a solid.

I also like the idea of casting my own bullets. I may try that some day but I'd like to see how my micro-groove barrel behaves with them first. By most of the accounts I've read, it will probably be OK if I use bullets that fit the bore very tightly. But before I invest in the stuff to start casting, I'd like to find out.

So I guess that's why I want to try them.

Duff - have you tried the A-Squares? They look like they might just work but I don't want to invest that much $ in a box of bullets that won't feed properly through my rifle.
But they do look like they have potential.

And thanks for the leads guys.

[Duff L Bagg]

No sir I have not tried them. I just happened to see them on clearance last night and were still fresh in my memory when you ask about 30 cal solids. I wish that I could tell you more about them.

[goon]

Hmmm....

[Tycer]

Lessee, you're going to spend the money on a trip to AK and think you might encounter a bear. And if that bear spots you first. And your shot is rushed and close. And....

Methinks it's about time for you to buy a 45/70.

Cheap insurance. And loads of fun.

[Griff]

Lessee, you're going to spend the money on a trip to AK and think you might encounter a bear. And if that bear spots you first. And your shot is rushed and close. And....
Methinks it's about time for you to buy a 45/70.
Cheap insurance. And loads of fun.

Ditto.

[Modoc ED]

The factory .30-30 Winchester Super X 170gr Power Point will kill anthing you are likely to run across where you are. They penetrate well and expand well. I've killed elk with that load in one of my .30-30s.

I use a .30-30 for most of my hunting and every once-in-awhile one of my .444 Marlins.

If you're going to Alaska, take something bigger than the .30-30. Sure, bears have been killed in Alaska with a .30-30 but that would not be my first choice. Tycer made a good recommendation -- .45-70 and the .444 Marlin would also be a good choice along with the .405 and the .450 Marlin.

Penetration is good but shot placement is better.

[86er]

If you're going to buy cast bullets, why not support one of our forum Sponsors found on the home-page www.leverguns.com and take advantage of their generous discounts we are offered?

[Slick13]

The factory .30-30 Winchester Super X 170gr Power Point will kill anthing you are likely to run across where you are. They penetrate well and expand well.

And I think they have as much "power" as your going to be able to get out the .30-30. Out of my carbine I've seen velocities near 2200 fps. Will probably never get near that reloading.

~Michael

[O.S.O.K.]

I would suggest the 150 grain Barnes TSX for what you're describing. They penetrate like a 170 but shoot flatter.

That, or stick with 170 grain gas checked hard cast bullets at 2200 fps - easily acheived with handloads. Laser-Cast makes a good one that you can afford to practice with - (a little secret, buy their standard 170 grain cast bullets and crimp the gas checks on yourself - saves a bunch - I recommend the Lee .310" sizer die set for this).

[Bluehawk]

I would not recomend the 30-30 if you were going to go to Alaska and look for a bear . Id take something a little more substantial MY choice woud be 45/70 in a lever gun 338 Win ina bolt or single shot.
That said If you cast yrou own the RCBS 30-180GC actualy comes out at about 190 to 195 grains depending on the alloy It shootw well in two of my three 30/30s Maybe allof them I havnt tried them in one They pentrate extremely well and will do the job if needed. Also every test I have read has said the Barnes TSX FP 150 has out penetrated any bullet tested . ONly one deer has beenshot in my presence with the barnes it it was extremely too much penetration did not expand at all on a broad side shot on a large buck

[goon]

I agree on the .45-70 and a Stainless guide gun is on the wish list.
But I have a 30-30 and I have no intentions of getting rid of it. If anything, I'll get another and have it cut down to 16". Or maybe just get another one and let it alone - I actually like the way they handle at this length.
Anyway, I figure that since I plan to always have a 30-30 around, I might as well have some ammunition loaded for it that makes the fullest use of its potential in case something would happen where I'd need to use it.

As for AK, I've read a lot about it and it appeals to me, but I'm not sure I'll be going there yet.
But I still do want a Guide gun.
I looked at one again today.
It called my name.
And if I do go there, I won't be looking for a bear. I don't have any desire to hunt them. I just think it's prudent to have a plan to defend myself against them if necessary (.45-70) and a back-up plan in case something happens to first plan (like some 30-30 ammo loaded with solids).

[Malamute]

While it wouldn't be on my list as a bear gun either, the 30-30 seems to work OK with regular loads and head shots up close. Don McCullough has mentioned Ralph edwards, who wrote the book "Crusoe of Lonesome Lake". He lived in BC Canada in the 40's-50's, and said he stopped counting the grizzlies he killed with the 30-30 and a remington auto rifle in 35 Rem cal. He tallied up 50 bears before he stopped counting.

[goon]

While it wouldn't be on my list as a bear gun either, the 30-30 seems to work OK with regular loads and head shots up close. Don McCullough has mentioned Ralph edwards, who wrote the book "Crusoe of Lonesome Lake". He lived in BC Canada in the 40's-50's, and said he stopped counting the grizzlies he killed with the 30-30 and a remington auto rifle in 35 Rem cal. He tallied up 50 bears before he stopped counting.

Thanks.
I asked about Alaska on another forum I belong to and one of the AK natives mentioned that he's seen a lot of brown bears killed with the 30-30 and that the 30-30 is also pretty common in some areas. You would think that if it was that inadequate the people who are using them would replace them with something else.
Also, thanks for the lead on the book. I think I'll look for it on Amazon or at the library. Looks like it might be an interesting read.
Something else that got me thinking about a solid bullet in the 30-30 is the reputation that the 30'06 and .303 British have on larger animals with heavier bullets. I've never shot anything larger than a whitetail so this is all based on stuff I've read here and there, but it would seem to me that a solid 30 caliber bullet is going to do the same job regardless of what the cartrige is that gets it there.

And thanks to everyone else for all the leads - looks like I have a pretty good place to start my little project.