OT: Dogs running deer. Soap Box

LeverBar · Post by **LeverBar** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:25 pm

Read a post this morning that mentioned dogs running deer. The fellow shot the buck. I would have shot the dogs.

It reminded me of one of my peeves of domesticated animals harming wildlife.

(Some of you may take offense to the following.)
I'm an Oregon boy, except for an eight-month stint in North-Central Texas. While in Texas, I had access to good deer hunting.

One day while out with a Remington .270 bolt(sorry it wasn't a levergun) I heard a racket coming fast through the scrub oak. A doe ran out, tongue flopping, exhausted. Before my thoughts had solidified the scene, here came three speeding dogs--seemed to be all mutts, differing sizes and breeds, but all three delighting in the chase.

I didn't have to think about what I was going to do. I'd already decided years earlier when I had heard a dog chasing a deer in the bottom-land along the Willamette River near Corvallis that if I were to witness such a chase, I'd do my best to end it. (That chase never came past me--Darn!)

The Texas chase resulted in mighty fine shooting. Two shots=two dead dogs. I didn't have room enough in the open to get a third shot.

I have mixed emotions about shooting those dogs--but not what would normally be expected. I am sad that I didn't get the third mutt, and I'm quite pleased that I did nail those two other dogs.

Dogs that harass deer should be stopped. The owners should be aware of the antics of their dogs, and should not allow these chases.

--Just a bit from atop my soap box.--

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:39 pm

That is exactly the same decision made by myself and a friend years ago in AZ. We never had the occasion to do it, but our minds were made up.

Joe

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:47 pm

I have had every...EVERY... owner of any lease I have used, tell me to shoot any dog seen running deer, collar and tags or not, theirs or someone else's, no difference.

Feral and pack dogs are imminently dangerous. If they haven't caused trouble yet, they will.

DDude · Post by **DDude** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:47 pm

I can see your rationale for your actions but I can't see shooting the dogs for what they did. They did belong to someone and as such are property. The owner of the dogs of course has the responsibility to control his animals. Whether the owner(s) did or not is unknown.

When I was a kid of 7 years old we had a Germanshepperd/Husky mix critter. One night he managed to get out of his confines and go looking for porcupines (dog was big but not too bright). Instead he found a trap that belonged to a NY state trooper who had a cabin up in the mountains above our place. Said trooper knew this dog was ours, knew it was harmless, knew that it was our pet. Instead of doing the right thing and bringing it back to us, he decided to kill our dog. My brother (11 years old) found him the next morning. My brother wanted to go kill himself a NY trooper that morning. Can't say as I blamed him. My father fortunately realized that wouldn't be a good thing.

Post by **Hobie** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:48 pm

Where dogs on deer is illegal that is exactly the choice made in my family...

horsesoldier03 · Post by **horsesoldier03** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:31 pm

You may want to take the time to research hunting regulations before you go shooting someones dog. In Georgia, it is legal to hunt deer with dogs. Whether you agree or disagree is inmaterial, its LEGAL. If you shot my dog and I could identify you, I would ensure that you were prosecuted to the full extent of the law and you would definately be paying some money for a new dog as well. Go shoot a mans bird dog in any state that its legal to hunt phesant or quail with dogs (which is all of them to my knowledge) and see where it gets you. The dog is only doing what its natural instincts tell it to do although, some dogs are trained better than others. No need to go killing them out of your own ignorance!

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:32 pm

Feel the exact same way. Tho' it is the dog's nature to be thus. But, if you shoot someone's pet, remember: No good deed goes unpunished.

crs · Post by **crs** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:34 pm

Ditto of what FWiedner said.
I have even had Texas ranch owners tell me that if they learn that if I did not try to shoot any feral dogs or coyotes that I saw, not to come back to that ranch! These farmers and ranchers just do not like their game and stock being harassed by predators - period!
When growing up in a town in the Texas Panhandle, there was for a couple of years, a large pack of feral dogs that frequently ran amok in the edge of town and nearby ranches, causing some problems. They attacked people, pets, and stock. Local law enforcement encouraged the citizenry to shoot these dogs on sight, even though it was known that many were ranging out from houses in the edge of town. Between the folks, the ranchers, the oil field workers, and the government trappers, these pests were eventually eradicated.

PS While riding with a college friend and his dad on their South Texas ranch, he and I had to give his dad the wrong .222 ammo (.222 mag that would not load into their .222 varmint rifle) to keep him from shooting some bird dogs that were ranging into his pasture with cattle in it. He had given the hunters permission to hunt a particular pasture, but they were hunting both sides of the fence line and almost had their dogs shot for not doing as they were told. That old man was furious and would have shot anything or one that crossed him at that moment. Fortunately, we avoided the canine massacre and they got off with a scolding and being run off the ranch, never to be allowed to return.

azzhandler · Post by **azzhandler** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:51 pm

sorry guys , but if I ever caught a man shooting any of my dogs , there would be 2 holes to dig, i would stand up for my dog, now if my dog was killing domesticated livestock on someone elses property, it would be a different story, I run coonhounds and beagles and sometimes young dogs just cant resist a good deer chase, if the shoot on sight attitude is good enough to use on dogs, it surely should be ok to use when all the teenage boys, come around chaseing my daughter, not much difference in my eyes,

WCF3030 · Post by **WCF3030** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:57 pm

A dogs owner needs to have the common sense and responsibility to control and train his dog. Making sure if its off the leash to stay on his property or to keep that dog on a leash.
Not to use the excuse of "hey its not legal to shoot a dog chasing a deer so I can let him do what he wants".
That person dose not deserve to own an animal.
A dogs "nature" is to be part of a pack, a pack has a Alpha leader(dogs owner) control your pack or it might be done for you.

On that same note a outdoors man needs to make sure of a situation before he takes action and then to be smart enough to keep his actions to himself.

canonsix · Post by **canonsix** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:57 pm

I my opinion the most dangerous animal(except man) in the bush, is a group of feral dogs.I have and will again kill them when necessary, and I do not believe that their is anyone who love dogs more than me. Your definition of what constitutes feral may differ from mine my2c . Doug

RSY · Post by **RSY** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:58 pm

It's just a fact of life in rural Texas: Loose dogs usually get the same treatment as coyotes.

I will call to a dog, though. If it comes, I will keep it and look for the owner. If it acts wild, well...

scott

horsesoldier03 · Post by **horsesoldier03** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:13 pm

Dont get me wrong, I am originally from Texas as well and beleive me I have put plenty of lead in feral dogs and coyotes. Hell they dont even have to be chasing a calf or chicken at the time! My mom and dad still cant keep a chicken coup full of chickens. However, if you read the other story it didnt sound like a pack of feral dogs, it was two beagles. Beagles are avid hunters and commonly used for deer and being deer season I am sure the were probably pushing that deer towards their owner when he intercepted it. Apply your logic and see where it gets you the next time you see 2 Britneys or Shorthairs that you come across while out hunting during bird season and see if you dont find one ticked off hunter.

gcs · Post by **gcs** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:35 pm

It's pretty easy to tell a legitimate hunting dog, on the other hand, mixed breed, pit and shepherd crosses in areas NOT legal for running deer are up to no good, ESPECIALLY when caught in the act.
Good owners or bad, these dogs create a lot of problems and many are dangerous to people to boot.

Granted, some folks are just shoot crazy, but a reasonable man using his God given common sense and discretion can usually figure out what to do.

Then, just shut up and move on.

stretch · Post by **stretch** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 6:40 pm

A good friend of mine shot his own dog after he caught
it killing sheep. I've got little patience for dogs runnig
deer, and less still for the owners of such animals.

Sharptop · Post by **Sharptop** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:00 pm

Well, since I made the post that is referenced, let me describe the scene more fully and offer my thoughts.

Our lease is about 700 acres in a fairly rural county that's growing. The lease looks like a cowboy boot with the toe cut off. Ridges and bottoms, some gradual, some fairly steep. A tough place to hunt. The easy part is killing a deer, try getting it out! On the north entrance is a cul de sac with about 15 houses on 3-15 acres, on the west another lease, on the east a few estate type places with 10-30 acres or just woods. To the south a small gentleman cattle farm, 400-500 acres. This is about 10 miles from the nearest town with these type subdivisions or old home places sprinkled around and rough ridges and valleys constituting the rest.

There were no other non-trespassing hunters on my end of the lease and doubt that these dogs were let loose to chase deer for the pot. While deer hunting is legal in other parts of Georgia, it is now so highly regulated as to be impossible unless you have a very large landowner group wanting to do it. Link: http://www.gohuntgeorgia.com/Assets/Doc ... 4-2-17.pdf

I had heard the dogs yipping on and off for a few hours but was surprised when the buck bolted up to me. After I shot it the dogs appeared from my back and stopped. I could have easily put my scope on them and blasted away. What I saw were two beagle looking pets with collars who barked at me when they were surprised by my presence and took off in the opposite direction.

I am first a hunter and would shoot the deer, but if coyotes or some of the feral chow-mix type dogs that the white trash accumulate in their yards in great abundance around here without rabies vaccines, collars, etc. had appeared I would have shot them. I wouldn't have felt particularly good about it because I don't like to kill animals unless I am hunting them and am going to eat them, but doing that would fit in my moral code. Everybody has a distinct set of values which may shift a little bit over time, but unless you are losing it, tends to remain fairly stable.(My belief). Thus was my value system in place.

I guess that I am a softie to a degree. I cried when Old Yeller died and when my Cocker Spaniel Missy Moo got bit by a rattlesnake back in 1969 when she was 13 when we were picking blackberries and she moved in front of me right before I stepped, or when my first dog, a boxer whose name I do not recall was run over 2 days after we brought him home when I was 1&1/2(my first memory), and it would break my heart to shoot some lovable family pet whose disfunctional owners had not found their ambition as certified dog trainers had yet to be realized. What kind of a jackass would I be if I drove out of our lease and saw little Johnny out searching for his beagle, Jiffy, who crawled under the fence through the hole made by Biff, the next door owner's beagle mix who was a recent shelter dog rescue? Etc.

It never entered my mind to shoot the two beagles.

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:00 pm

If you don't care to control you own dog(s) don't be surprised and don't be a ******* cry-baby if someone else is forced to do so.

Hunters who allow their uncontrolled pack to range onto other people's land without the permission of the land owner are POACHERS.

If dogs, including hunting dogs, threaten or harrass your livestock it is legal to shoot them. If their (former) owners invite themselves onto your property while armed to whine about it, well...Texas "Castle" law covers that too.

Junior · Post by **Junior** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:54 pm

Hunting deer with dogs in Louisiana is legal. Shooting a dog chasing a deer is illegal. In fact, shooting a dog chasing a deer in Louisiana could be fatal. That's worse than illegal. . . .

horsesoldier03 · Post by **horsesoldier03** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:58 pm

Some of them just aint gittn the point junior. Not even sure if they read the original thread!

kasTX · Post by **kasTX** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 8:59 pm

I didn't have to think about what I was going to do. I'd already decided years earlier when I had heard a dog chasing a deer in the bottom-land along the Willamette River near Corvallis that if I were to witness such a chase, I'd do my best to end it.

Wow. I am not sure how to say this without it sounding like a personal attack, but do you really see everything as that black and white? I certainly hope not, especially where firearms are involved.

Don't get me wrong, there are definitely problem dogs out there (my parents had a very serious problem with dogs killing their sheep, and were fully prepared to shoot them if they had the chance, and I was prepared to help them), but there are also first time offenders who may not have the opportunity or the inclination to do it again. Telling them apart may not be easy either.

Now, whether you agree with the above or not, consider the scenario given in the original post (a running deer breaks out of the brush with dogs in pursuit, hunter shoots two of them), but taken a little bit further:

A.) After the second shot, the owner of the dogs emerges from the brush in hot pursuit of his dogs which had accidentally gotten loose. Hearing two shots, and seeing another person with a rifle pointed in his direction, raises his own rifle and shoots the first hunter dead.

B.) After the second shot, the owner of the dogs emerges from the brush in hot pursuit of his dogs which had accidentally gotten loose. Hearing two shots, and seeing another person with a rifle pointed in his direction, freaks out, runs away, and calls the police. Hunter is taken to jail for reckless endangerment.

Maybe "Aim, Fire, Think" isn't the best strategy after all?

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:03 pm

As with Cats, which I rescue or kill as situation warrants, so with Dogs.

Dogs running Deer is Illegal in Indiana. Period.

Dogs running Squirrels, Rabbits or 'Coons is not.

Sometimes the season overlaps.

As a Dog Owner, you have a choice. Control your dogs, OR

Get a $5,000 fine and lose all your gear & hunting license for running deer

OR

Get your dogs killed.

Seems like a simple equasion to me.

LeverBar · Post by **LeverBar** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:09 pm

Sharptop,

That's a beautiful buck you have. I'm not faulting you the least for harvesting it.

You seem to have had your head and your heart in the right place.

Where dogs running deer are concerned, I might not cut as much slack as you do. We are all different and every situation is different.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:46 pm

A few years back, after a large and 'ritsy' subdivision was built nearby, the river froze during a flood, and there were thousands of acres of iced over 2-3 foot deep water over the fields. In our field alone, 6 or 8 deer were chased onto the ice, which broke, yet the packs of collared 'pets' let out to go potty or whatever didn't sink through the ice, and surrounded the deer, chewed on them, and left them to bleed to death and die.

Now I know that it's "what dogs do," but NOT ON MY PROPERTY.

There is a big difference between a suburban non-fenced yard, where neighbors or dogs may often cut across your yard en route to a legitimate destination, and shooting them would not only be unsafe, but would mean shooting a pet just a few hundred feet from its owner, which just ran after a frisbee or a cat, and a rural area, where the 'yards' are hundreds of acres, and contain livestock and vulnerable wildlife.

If some yahoo goes hunting with dogs on my neighbor's property, that's FINE, but NOT ON MY PROPERTY. If the dogs "just can't help it" because "they can't read signs" then the guy hunting with his dogs picked too small a property, or can't control his dogs. We used to have problems with people who went coon hunting on a 5-acre plot next door, and of course always the dogs ran onto our land, scaring and occasionally mauling our livestock. When the owners were angry at their dogs being shot, we told them they shouldn't turn a coon dog loose when it can't run more than three hundred feet without being off the property it is supposed to hunt on. OWNER'S FAULT.

If you want your dogs to be safe, hunt on property sizeable enough that they won't leave it. You wouldn't run coon dogs in the grass area inside an interstate cloverleaf without expecting they might get run over, now would you...?

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:51 pm

Whoa! Hot topic! I LOVE dogs. Common sense here guys.

1.) You see a healthy looking dog in the woods just running around. There are houses within a half mile or so--'ya leave him alone or try to return him. I have done that.

2.) Your hunting (or whatever) and you see a mongrel or other nasty looking dog hot on the heels of a deer. You shoot 'em....period. Done that too.

I spent half my life in the woods and I forgot how many dead deer I have seen with their hamstrings ripped out. Sometimes their bellies were opened up. This is done while the deer are alive. 99% of the time, its feral dogs. Yep, its natural for these dogs to do that and its the same reason we all shoot coyotes and other predators. We protect the weak.
.348 Winchester---4 dogs
.33 Winchester---6 dogs
.22-250---4 dogs

pharmseller · Post by **pharmseller** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 2:30 am

Sixgun wrote:Whoa! Hot topic! I LOVE dogs. Common sense here guys.

1.) You see a healthy looking dog in the woods just running around. There are houses within a half mile or so--'ya leave him alone or try to return him. I have done that.

2.) Your hunting (or whatever) and you see a mongrel or other nasty looking dog hot on the heels of a deer. You shoot 'em....period. Done that too.

I spent half my life in the woods and I forgot how many dead deer I have seen with their hamstrings ripped out. Sometimes their bellies were opened up. This is done while the deer are alive. 99% of the time, its feral dogs. Yep, its natural for these dogs to do that and its the same reason we all shoot coyotes and other predators. We protect the weak.
.348 Winchester---4 dogs
.33 Winchester---6 dogs
.22-250---4 dogs

Hey Sixgun,
What load did you use with the .348?

Quinn

Bogie35 · Post by **Bogie35** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 4:29 am

The best dog I've ever known got out of the fence one night and was poisoned by a neighbor just for kicks. The only reason I didn't put a bullet in his head was because I wasn't "absolutely" sure he did it...only "99.9%" sure. That guy ended up dying a horrible death from cancer. Good. He deserved it. And may he rot in hell.

Now, as far as dogs running deer...it's bad. One day, my dad was still hunting. He hears dogs approaching. A doe steps out, looks at him, then falls over dead. Probably a heart attack. It was sad. My dad wasn't certain that the dogs were feral...only 99%, so he didn't shoot them. That's one of the many reasons I love my dad.

Dogs are hunters by nature, and not all dogs in the woods are "feral". And not all dogs in the woods have irresponsible owners. And deer are not "man's best friend"...dog's are. No deer has ever waited on my porch for me to get home. Please keep in mind that some dogs in the woods have a little boy or girl back home who will be devastated when the dog doesn't return.

I didn't kill that guy because I wasn't SURE. Please don't kill a dog unless you are SURE that it doesn't belong to a child.

Humbly,
bogie

Old Shatterhand · Post by **Old Shatterhand** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 4:50 am

A bit OT: do you americans use hounds for deer hunting? Here in Sweden we do so. But only "slow" dogs as bassets, dachshounds, drevers (dachsbrackens), beagles and small terriers are allowed, as the purpose is to keep the deer slowly moving, not to chase them hardly. Fast hounds which follow too fastly and hardly are illegal.

Interesting to read about feral dogs and their roaming in the forests. It must be a quite unpleasant problem.

Old Sh.

Drever and roe deer.

horsesoldier03 · Post by **horsesoldier03** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 5:27 am

Hunting with dogs is allowed in the south. Hunting with dogs is just as much a sport as any other, however many argue the point. Many in the western part of the US frown upon it, however, they have different terrain. In the south, we have alot of swamp land, and land that is covered in thick brush. A person cannot get into it many times its so thick. They frequently use dogs on deer and hogs to help push them out. Feral dogs do occur, however they tend to have a short life span in the wild. Normally they are restricted to mutts and mongrels that once were someones pet that got out of the CUTE stage.

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:23 am

pharmseller wrote:
Sixgun wrote:Whoa! Hot topic! I LOVE dogs. Common sense here guys.

Hey Sixgun,
What load did you use with the .348?

Quinn

Pharmseller, my old standby--53 IMR 4895/200 Hornady
33 WCF----42 gr. IMR 3031/200 Hornady
22-250---35 gr. IMR 4895/53 g. Sierra BRHP

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 10:37 am

I see that most people are dug in as to what they would or wouldn't do.

In Washington State it's illegal to run deer with dogs. I feel you need to control your animals. If I know it's my neighbor Bob's dog, I'm not going to shoot it. If it will come to me I'll take it to him and tell him he needs to keep an eye on his dog. I'll at least tell him he needs to contain his dog it I can't get a hold of it. If it's an obviously feral pack of dogs I'll do my best to take as many of them out as I can. People in my area dump a lot of dogs and they can get down right dangerous if they aren't taken care of like they should of been in the first place.

pricecw · Post by **pricecw** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:37 pm

This might be a regional thing, but here in Idaho the law states that a dog running big game can be shot on sight by a law enforcement. Also note, if it is your dog, you can be prosecuted for it.

(B) Any person who is the owner of, or in possession of, or who
harbors any dog found running at large and which is actively
tracking, pursuing, harassing or attacking, or which injures or kills
deer or any other big game animal within this state shall be guilty
as provided in section 36-1401(a)1.(F), Idaho Code. It shall be no
defense that such dog or dogs were pursuing said big game animals
without the aid or direction of the owner, possessor, or harborer.
(C) Any dog found running at large and which is actively tracking,
pursuing, harassing, attacking or killing deer or any other big game
animal may be destroyed without criminal or civil liability by the
director, or any peace officer, or other persons authorized to
enforce the Idaho fish and game laws.

Further, in Idaho, your dog is property, the most you can recover from someone is the documented value of the dog. But remember, if you try and get that value from someone who shot your dog chasing deer, you would probably be charged with the above law. Also, any dog chasing or harassing livestock can be shot on sight.

--Carl

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:50 pm

Old Shatterhand wrote:A bit OT: do you americans use hounds for deer hunting? Here in Sweden we do so. But only "slow" dogs as bassets, dachshounds, drevers (dachsbrackens), beagles and small terriers are allowed, as the purpose is to keep the deer slowly moving, not to chase them hardly. Fast hounds which follow too fastly and hardly are illegal.

Interesting to read about feral dogs and their roaming in the forests. It must be a quite unpleasant problem.

Old Sh.

Drever and roe deer.

That's Beauty O Sh.

If it were Legal, and done with integrety here as done there, I would have no problem.

I'm all for multiple forms of Hunting.

But I despise Owners who let their animals run "free" (wild/feral).. Not the Animal's fault, but there it is.

I consider a free-ranging dog no better than a Coyote or Wolf.

I do like controlled Hunting Dogs tough.

BenT · Post by **BenT** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 4:36 pm

Around here you see a neighbors dog chasing deer . You go let the neighbor know. If it continues , well usually the whole neighborhood is shooting for it. In the county I live it is a felony to shoot someones pet.

A couple years ago a neighbor came over to tell me he seen my dog chasing a deer. I shocked him when I said " why didn't you shoot it" That dog wasn't working out around the farm very well. In fact I kept him on the porch at night. Untill one morning it wanted out at 4 in the morning. I could see why. The neighbors dog was waitng at the door ready to go . So as long as the neighbor let his dog run there was no way I would ever train this one to stay put. So I gave him away to a retired farmer to help herd cows.

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:00 pm

I live on a lake and people dump dogs here all the time. They run in packs and are dangerous. I try to use common scence on whether to kill or let them go. If they are aggressive towards me or my animals, they are dead! I see them around my hunting lease and on Army Core Land. A mean dog has no good use and needs to be put away. A dog is by nature a predator and so am I. They have better vision, smell, hearing and speed than I do, but I have a gun. If you want a mean dog, for what ever reason, keep control of him or her.

horsesoldier03 · Post by **horsesoldier03** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:55 pm

North GA, Marlin 1894 44.mag w/ Winchester white box 240 grain JSP. Shot once running away and it reversed and ran back at me and hit it again. Either shot would have done it. Two beagles chased the deer right by me and appeared on its trail after I shot it. They had collars on, barked at me and took off. I guess they are someone's pets but I couldn't hardly get mad at them. Same thing happened last year when a blue tick hound chased a nice 7 pt by me on a different lease.

The paragraph above is the original post that inspired this one. If you notice, the incident occured in N Georgia where hunting with dogs is legal. Just thought I would copy it over here so that we are comparing apples to apples.

Lastmohecken · Post by **Lastmohecken** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:44 pm

I have killed a lot of dogs, and I like dogs. When I was young man, deer were run with dogs a lot, but eventually, when the bigger farms got broken up over the years, and lots of out of state people and city people started buying up these smaller parcels of land, confrontations happened between land owners and dog hunters of all kinds, deer dogs, coon dogs, fox hounds, etc.

Now days it's a lot harder to hunt with dogs then it was 30 or 40 years ago, and these new weekend gentleman farmers, etc don't have much tollerance for dog hunters. Unfortunately, dogs can't read no=hunting signs and will follow game a good ways, as a result nowdays it's not legal to use dogs during deer season in my area anymore. This is probably for the best, as most everyone is a trophy hunter these days, hunts from a tree stand and doens't want the deer desturbed too much.

Wild dogs are something else, and if you are in the cattle business, as I am, you don't want you cattle run through a fence, or a baby calf killed, I have had both happen to me, more then once. And if you have ever spent over a half a day getting cattle back up and fences fixed, you will not hesitate long, in reaching for a gun, if dogs are chasing your cattle.

But a man needs to know where he is standing, because it is still legal to hunt furbearing game and even deer with dogs in certain areas. And I won't shoot a neighbor's dog, unless they have demostrated their lack of responsibility by keeping a bunch of dogs running loose, terrorizing the neighborhood.

A couple of years ago, I had problems with my Mexican neighbors who lived down the road, they used to keep a pack of dogs running loose, and several other neighbors had already called the law on them because their dogs liked to chase cattle. I eventually ended up shooting one of their dogs, chasing my cattle, and and would have killed more, but the other dogs hit the brush before I could get on them.

Then I had another problem with their dogs chasing my motorcyle, when I rode by their house, I tried to talk to them about it but got nowhere. One day I hit a dog on my motorcycle and nearly crashed, finally I started packing a Ruger Single six with birdshot, and just started shooting anydog that came into the road, when I rode by. I didn't kill any of them, but I eventually got them more or less trained to leave me alone, but later on one big dog wanted to actually head me off, everytime I rode by, and I actually ended up killing the bike right in front of their house and shooting the dog in the face over the top of the handle bars at point blank range.

I figured they would call the law on me for that one, but they didnot, probably because they had already been in trouble with the law over their dogs and wanted no more attention from the law. But right after that, they did start keeping their dogs up, and have ever since. So I guess they finally got the point.

Nowdays, the Ruger Single Six, gets to stay home in the safe and I am allowed to ride my Harley to town without having to shoot my way out to the pavement.

Marlin .35 · Post by **Marlin .35** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:46 pm

What JUNIOR said, also applies to Mississippi!!!Be careful in these states!!!! Art

coyote nose · Post by **coyote nose** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:00 pm

Where I live there are NO responsible dog owners, as a result dogs run all over the place, any time of the day, they bark non stop, any time of the day, I have seen them running deer while deer hunting. Of course I cant shoot them, I'd get my butt hauled to court by the people that make excuses for the dogs (...doing what comes naturally and all that BS I can't stand). Heck, in America today you molest a child and the libs will make excuses for you. Harm rover and they will destroy you. This post really hit a nerve with me. Until i moved out to the country I was neutral about dogs, now I can't stand them. Sorry, but that is what dog owners have done to me. I let several people hunt on my property, but one of my rules is "..if you use 4 legs to hunt, it aint hunting". I allow no-one to brings their dogs on my property, at least that way I am not adding to a huge problem. Heck, just last week I had to get my rifle ready (1906 Winchester pump 22) because 2 dogs were threatening me back in my woods. Didn't have to shoot, fortunately. Probably saved myself tons of money in legal bills. Whew! I have vented!

ScottT · Post by **ScottT** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:21 pm

FWiedner wrote:If you don't care to control you own dog(s) don't be surprised and don't be a ******* cry-baby if someone else is forced to do so.

Hunters who allow their uncontrolled pack to range onto other people's land without the permission of the land owner are POACHERS.

If dogs, including hunting dogs, threaten or harrass your livestock it is legal to shoot them. If their (former) owners invite themselves onto your property while armed to whine about it, well...Texas "Castle" law covers that too.

This is where I come down. I have and will continue to kill any strange dog I see when I am hunting. If the owner did not care enough to control his dog, I will stop its running around permanently. If my hunters don't want to shoot a dog that they see running stock or game, they won't be coming back.

Swampman · Post by **Swampman** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:46 pm

Shoot, shovel, and shut up.

dbateman · Post by **dbateman** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 10:18 pm

here in AU thay hunt with dog like ridgebacks rottwheelers staghunds dobermens thay hunt pigs scrub cattel and buffelo thay tend not to train the dog becose thay get killed buy the game thay hunt and get lost .anyting that can drag down buffelo is dangerus if I see a dog with no onwer its dead

LEAR TO CONTROL YOUR DOGS!!!!!

coyote nose · Post by **coyote nose** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 11:15 pm

The saddest part of all of this, at least to me,is that there are a LOT of people, including some fellow levergunners, who seem to value a dogs life more than a human beings life.

I guess it is the age we live in....

dr walker · Post by **dr walker** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 11:37 pm

I keep writing and deleting, so I guess I am undecided on this issue.

I have killed feral dogs.

And I have felt horrible for killing a neighbors pet.

I'll probably kill other feral dogs, there seems to be many of them.

But I hope to never kill someones pet, even if it is legal and justified.

Swampman · Post by **Swampman** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 7:52 am

"a LOT of people, ......... seem to value a dogs life more than a human beings life."

It's a sign of the age we live in Romans Chapter 1 vs 22-26

Bunny hugging