22lr vs. 22mag

[rjohns94]

I'm interested to find out what the .22 mag does that the .22lr can't do? Where does this dimunitive giant fit in ones arsenal? the .22lr is certainly a plinking round and has to win hands down in the category, and can take plenty of small game cleanly. I'm guessing the .22 mag would be medium size game? longer range maybe? to keep this on topic, lets assume we are using these in a levergun, a 9422/m or something of that nature. What can one expect to be able to do with the .22 mag?? and just for fun, what of the .22mag j-frame revolvers? how would you rate them as a woods walking gun? game getter? defense handgun? I will let this one run out a while till I reveal the reason behind the asking. Lets just say I'm considering one.

[bdhold]

40-gr. seems to be the norm for both, so I think we're mostly talking about the effects of velocity on range and impact energy.
There are a couple of 45- and 50-gr. bullets available (Super-X, Federal Game Shok) and that is the biggest plus, since you effectively double the impact energy over a 40-gr. 22lr

[Hobie]

I have read several authors comment on the .22 WMRF's ability to kill out of proportion to its size OR to equal the .22 LR fired from a rifle when used in a revolver. I like it well enough but don't use it as one good old boy told me God intended for it to be used, i.e. to take deer out of season.

[86er]

I've told the tale of my friend Rob Swanson several times including here on the forum. Every year he goes to his grandfathers farm near Old Saybrook, CT and shoots a buck. Same spot under the tree, the deer is on the same trail or close to, and his "deer rifle" is an old bolt action 22 Magnum. He is still using one of the original boxes of ammo that came with the gun. He is not a shooter and not into guns or hunting besides this annual foray. He cannot conceive why there is anything wrong with his ways. He knows to shoot the deer when they come out of a little trail into a blueberry patch. The range is 40 yards or less. He aims very carefully and shoots tight behind the leg. The rifle/scope are accurate enough to put the bullet there. The deer usually run downhill toward the barn and fall over somewhere between 50 and 100 yards. The ammo is Western SuperX with 40 grain solids. That's what a .22 Mag can do. I have shot a few small animals with a .22 LR and my observations are that to get the same consistent effect on a deer the shot would have to be 1/2 the distance (20 yds or less) and absolutely precise, with a "high velocity" (1400 fps +) round using a solid and hitting the precise spot. I've shot and seen others shoot deer with .22LR with head shots and they went right down. I've used a 22RF on foxes, dik dik and reedbok with heart shots out to 50 yds using solids (these are under 60 pound animals). My observations lead my to opine that the 22 mag will surpass the 22 rf in any application beyond 50 yards and on anything over 25 pounds or so (with a torso shot). Inside of 50 yds the mag clearly has the edge with observable greater effect on critters. So I don't think you need the Mag for squirrels, rabbits, crows, and like sized stuff but the Mag shines on woodchucks, turkeys (where legal) raccoons and other critters.

[dr walker]

I have shot a few coyotes with both lr and mag. All of the shots were less than 50 yards. The magnum creates a greater wound than the lr. I would guess it is because of better bullets going faster. As far as shooting lil ground squirrels and prairie dogs, it is easier for me to make good hits past 75 yards with the magnum. I did not like the 22 magnum for killing tree squirrels or rabbits, it was too easy to make a mess.

Many country folk from south of the border regard the 22 magnum as a serious deer rifle with well placed head and neck shots.

[Leverdude]

I've told the tale of my friend Rob Swanson several times including here on the forum. Every year he goes to his grandfathers farm near Old Saybrook, CT and shoots a buck. Same spot under the tree, the deer is on the same trail or close to, and his "deer rifle" is an old bolt action 22 Magnum. He is still using one of the original boxes of ammo that came with the gun. He is not a shooter and not into guns or hunting besides this annual foray. He cannot conceive why there is anything wrong with his ways. He knows to shoot the deer when they come out of a little trail into a blueberry patch. The range is 40 yards or less. He aims very carefully and shoots tight behind the leg. The rifle/scope are accurate enough to put the bullet there. The deer usually run downhill toward the barn and fall over somewhere between 50 and 100 yards. The ammo is Western SuperX with 40 grain solids. That's what a .22 Mag can do. I have shot a few small animals with a .22 LR and my observations are that to get the same consistent effect on a deer the shot would have to be 1/2 the distance (20 yds or less) and absolutely precise, with a "high velocity" (1400 fps +) round using a solid and hitting the precise spot. I've shot and seen others shoot deer with .22LR with head shots and they went right down. I've used a 22RF on foxes, dik dik and reedbok with heart shots out to 50 yds using solids (these are under 60 pound animals). My observations lead my to opine that the 22 mag will surpass the 22 rf in any application beyond 50 yards and on anything over 25 pounds or so (with a torso shot). Inside of 50 yds the mag clearly has the edge with observable greater effect on critters. So I don't think you need the Mag for squirrels, rabbits, crows, and like sized stuff but the Mag shines on woodchucks, turkeys (where legal) raccoons and other critters.

I'm not saying I approve or disapprove of a 22mag for deer. But in the state of Connecticut hunting deer with rimfires is illegal and center fires have a 6MM minimum.

[Blaine]

Back in Kansas, about 40 miles west of Leavenworth where I was stationed in '72, I was talking up an old rancher about fishing his lake. I had a six-pack and after drinking and talking awhile, he showed me his smokehouse. Must have had five or 6 whitetail does in there. He'd crawl up a apple tree before dawn, and wait. OSOK head shots with his old .22 Magnum.

I don't plink with my SingleSix mag cyl or the 9422M, but it "hits" about like a .38 special or a little better and about the same damage, and more penetration. It's my house rifle...

This looks interesting: KelTek 30 shot auto .22mag

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/pmr30.htm

[Rusty]

In my part of the country, south Fla. It is the .22 mag. that is known as the poachers rifle. It is a more certain killer than the .22LR and only one shot is needed. Few people pay attention to a single shot, even in the middle of the night. A single shot tends to draw a "was that a gunshot?" statement by most people, then if they don't hear anything else they forget about it.

I've been thinking for a while that I'd like to have something like a S&W M63 in a .22 Mag. But I want it with plain Jane sights none of that Hi Viz stuff a lot of revolvers are using today. I was thinking that if I firelap a LR barrel enough it would relieve it enough that the .224 bullets wouldn't cause any problems when I rechamber it to the Magnum round.

[Nath]

Just got in from a rabbit shooting session with my 9422 and shot from 15yds to 177yards.

The 15yd shot I missed The 177yd shot connect after 3 sighters. Gun is scoped 2-7x.

No wind. Sub sonic ammo.

Nath.

[Sixgun]

A .22 mag. in a rifle is a snappy bugger. Doubles the practical range of a .22lr. I think the cartridge is great if your NOT into handloading as IMHO, there's a bunch of cartridges, when handloaded to the proper specs will outclass it 10-1, with more penetration, ooomff, less noise, at half the cost . Keep in mind here, I'm not talking about an '06 or a 338 mag. I mean comparable small cartridges in the same type of rifles---32-20, 357 mag. etc.

In a short handgun? waste of time. Too much noise with not much more speed than a 22 lr. I'd much rather have a 38 snubby. 6-8" barrel??--now we are back to "if your a handloader".

I guess I'm biased a bit. I just have the opinion that anything .22 caliber is easily beaten with wiser choices. Anything 17 caliber should never have been invented.

I've shot tons of "stuff" over the years and with the exception of the 69 gr. jacketed designed for the .22 centerfires, nothing 22 impresses me.-------------------Sixgun

[Hobie]

I've told the tale of my friend Rob Swanson several times including here on the forum. Every year he goes to his grandfathers farm near Old Saybrook, CT and shoots a buck. Same spot under the tree, the deer is on the same trail or close to, and his "deer rifle" is an old bolt action 22 Magnum. He is still using one of the original boxes of ammo that came with the gun. He is not a shooter and not into guns or hunting besides this annual foray. He cannot conceive why there is anything wrong with his ways. He knows to shoot the deer when they come out of a little trail into a blueberry patch. The range is 40 yards or less. He aims very carefully and shoots tight behind the leg. The rifle/scope are accurate enough to put the bullet there. The deer usually run downhill toward the barn and fall over somewhere between 50 and 100 yards. The ammo is Western SuperX with 40 grain solids. That's what a .22 Mag can do. I have shot a few small animals with a .22 LR and my observations are that to get the same consistent effect on a deer the shot would have to be 1/2 the distance (20 yds or less) and absolutely precise, with a "high velocity" (1400 fps +) round using a solid and hitting the precise spot. I've shot and seen others shoot deer with .22LR with head shots and they went right down. I've used a 22RF on foxes, dik dik and reedbok with heart shots out to 50 yds using solids (these are under 60 pound animals). My observations lead my to opine that the 22 mag will surpass the 22 rf in any application beyond 50 yards and on anything over 25 pounds or so (with a torso shot). Inside of 50 yds the mag clearly has the edge with observable greater effect on critters. So I don't think you need the Mag for squirrels, rabbits, crows, and like sized stuff but the Mag shines on woodchucks, turkeys (where legal) raccoons and other critters.

I'm not saying I approve or disapprove of a 22mag for deer. But in the state of Connecticut hunting deer with rimfires is illegal and center fires have a 6MM minimum.

Any statements regarding use of the .22 Mag on deer are not to support an illegal act, only to report the result.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

Yeah, that .22 Magnum is loud as he11 in a handgun. I've got a Smith 648 and an AMT Automag II and they are both very loud. I think the target firearm for the .22 Magnum is rifles and the powder they use is still doing a lot of burning by the time the bullet leaves a handgun.

I gave my son an HK 300 for his birthday serveral years ago ... it's a .22 Magnum autoloader. It shoots very well and can probably reliably take moderate critters out past 125 yards.

I think the bullet choice and extra velocity really sets the round apart. FMJs for clean punch through, 40 grain JHPs for moderate expansion, and 30, 33, & 34 grain JHPs for explosive expansion. There's also the 50 grain Federal for a little extra oomph at longer distances. The big downside is, of course, the cost. I shoot the Winchester 40 grain JHP ($10/50) and 34 grain Supreme JHP ($13.50/50) most of the time. Thought the Winchester stuff is harder to come by these days.

User Resbum over at RFC did a pretty good dissection of factory loads and potention load modifications. Lot of pictures.

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/sh ... 755&page=2

[Lawyer Daggit]

22 LR- plinking and rabbits

22 magnum- consistent pest eradication. I know some farmers who use nothing else- even using the little round (as I have on many occasions) on feral pig. While devastating on rabbit, the little round offers no margin for error on larger game and when used must be used for a short range surgical strike to the brain or similar.

I have used it for brain shots on stationary boar at short range where the pig has been 'clean'. I would never use the round on a pig where the part of the animal I intend to shoot (head) is encrusted with mud as the bullet would just cause a surface wound.

Ethically I had a struggle before using the gun on pig and decided to, as they are a major pest and target of opportunity on Australian farms and the farmer would be displeased if I passed up a shot.

Over the years I would have taken about thirty or so pig with my 9422 magnum with a 100% success rate- after following the above rules and hundreds of others have been taken with 222 or 223- for the same reason- its what I had with me when the opportunity arose.

I would not use a 22 LR or 9417 on pig unless it was still suckling and therefore very small.

I have never used it on deer- nor would I as ranges are longer and the round is not legal for this purpose here.

[Paladin]

The Chief of Police in Moorefield WV was shot in the chest with a single six in .22 Mag from 10 ft. The solid bullet stopped jut under his skin in his back. Frank lived with no permanent injury. I carry a .22 Mag with 50 gr. gold dots in a revolver with no lack of faith in it during the summer.

[J Miller]

Yeah, that .22 Magnum is loud as he11 in a handgun. I've got a Smith 648 and an AMT Automag II and they are both very loud. I think the target firearm for the .22 Magnum is rifles and the powder they use is still doing a lot of burning by the time the bullet leaves a handgun.

<snip>

One cylinder of 22 Mags from my Colt Peacemaker convertible back in the early 70s contributed to much of my hearing loss. Back then nobody talked about hearing protection. Gun stores didn't even stock the things. I agree a rifle is the way to go with the .22 Mag. Pistols are fun, but rifles are serious.

Joe

[m.wun]

I bought a 17hmr five years ago and if I was to do it again I would buy a 22mag...

[2ndovc]

My Grandfather used his Savage .22 mag for pest control around the farm as much as he used his
'92 .25-20 with near equal results.

I love my little CZ bolt action .22 mag for walking trails, picking red squirels from the hemlocks
and cleaning out the "porkey pines" from around the cabin.

jb

[cshold]

Yeah, that .22 Magnum is loud as he11 in a handgun. I've got a Smith 648 and an AMT Automag II and they are both very loud. I think the target firearm for the .22 Magnum is rifles and the powder they use is still doing a lot of burning by the time the bullet leaves a handgun.

<snip>

One cylinder of 22 Mags from my Colt Peacemaker convertible back in the early 70s contributed to much of my hearing loss. Back then nobody talked about hearing protection. Gun stores didn't even stock the things. I agree a rifle is the way to go with the .22 Mag. Pistols are fun, but rifles are serious.

Joe

I know what your talking about Joe,
WOW! they sure do make a deafening crack.
Though I have found my New Frontier shoots
a might better with the 22 mag. cylinder.
If I understand right the barrel's are cut for the mag.

[FWiedner]

I believe that I have mentioned in previous conversations that I used to have an uncle who raised 11 kids and never once bought meat from a store. He had a .22Mag and used it. Did this for maybe 30 years. He's gone from this plane now but his last hunt was maybe 6 or 7 years ago.

In spite of his demonstration of the utility use of the .22Mag, I've never found a place for one in my line-up. If I know I'm going to hunt beyond where my .22 can be effective (for me and what I hunt about 50 yards) I step it up to a .223.

[.45colt]

Several years ago I had the bug for a small lever but not a .22. all the time spent here paid off in a big way when I got a Marlin 32-20. what a great rifle/calibre.

[L_Kilkenny]

There is no doubt that a .22M is more powerful than a .22LR. But in my opinion the gains are questionable whne it comes to the cost of an additional gun and the additional cost of ammo. In a handgun I flat out dislike the .22M. In handguns, both rounds are small game capable (.22M handgun has similer balistics to .22Lr in a rifle) so why deal with the extra cost and blast. But in a rifle the .22M outperforms traditional .22LR loading by a substantial amount. The only problem is it's still not big enough for coyote hunting IME (vermin control is a differnet matter, I'll shoot vermin with whatever I have on me). But the .22M is much better on coon and fox with better range.

Now let's go above and beyond traditional .22LR loading and move up to rounds like the CCI Velocitor. With it's 40gr HP moving at 1400+ fps it cuts a good deal into the advantage the .22M has. I did some numbers a couple years ago:

Here's some numbers based on 3" maximum point blank range (MPBR):

CCI Velocitor: MPBR=104 yards Zero=89 yards 1435/183@muzzle 1110/109@MPBR
CCI Maxi-Mag: MPBR=129 yards Zero=112 yards 1875/312@muzzle 1302/150@MPBR
CCI Maxi-Mag+V: MPBR=137 yards Zero=121 yards 2200/322@muzzle 1320/116@MPBR
CCI Stinger MPBR=111 yards Zero=96 yards 1640/191@muzzle 1130/91@MPBR


Energy wise the Stinger (as expected) brings up the hind end, The Velocitor and the +V are about tied (at their MPBR) and the Maxi-Mag (again, as expected) is the king. The Velocitor still has almost 3/4 (72.6%) of the energy of the 40gr. Maxi-Mag at their perspective MPBR's.

MPBR spread is only 33 yards.

Is a Velocitor equal to a .22mag? Heck no. Is it close enough to keep me from buying a .22M? Tune in later. I can't even decide.

LK

[rjohns94]

here in the great state of Pa, we are not allowed to use a centerfire pistol or rifle caliber on small game. rimfire only. If I could use a 32-20 or something similar, I would. In fact, I would use .38 wadcutters out of my '92 and just be done with this. I have never had a use for a .22 mag, never shot one in my life (though I have had extra cylinders for .22lr pistols in this caliber). That was right up until I traded into (in a convoluted way, a S&W j frame air lite in 22 mag. That got me thinking, about a .22mag lever. I am perfectly content with the .22lr for squirrels and bunnies, but was thinking maybe the .22 mag for fox, ground hogs, and turkey. Note, each of those can be taken with the '92 I have now so no real need for the .22 mag, but I was considering it.

[Hobie]

in the great state of Pa, we are not allowed to use a centerfire pistol or rifle caliber on small game

I have never understood that.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

... a S&W j frame air lite in 22 mag.

That is going to be the king of loud guns right there. I find it deafening our of a 6" barrel. No telling what that little thing will sound like.

[bdhold]

in the great state of Pa, we are not allowed to use a centerfire pistol or rifle caliber on small game

I have never understood that.

the logic is probably to keep down the range of random stray bullets. Not saying it makes a lot of statistical sense, but it's likely the argument behind the reg.

[3leggedturtle]

Just shot my Henry 22mag at 25, 50 and 100 yards. Its nice to hold dead on for all 3 ranges. One thing i noticed on the mag is if you shoot 10 shots fairly fast the barrel get real warm. The dirt thrown up on impact is subsatantially more than a 22lr of any type. Other nice thing is the Super-X and CCI 40gr JHP's all shoot to the same point of impact.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

You should forget about the .22 Magnum and step up to the .22 Jet in a Smith 53. That way you can make use of your .357 Magnum shell holder AND you can take out the rampant Chupacabra if need be.

[Sixgun]

You should forget about the .22 Magnum and step up to the .22 Jet in a Smith 53. That way you can make use of your .357 Magnum shell holder AND you can take out the rampant Chupacabra if need be.

McNut Job,
I had a Model 53 and experimented with it to a fair degree. To say the least, it was troublesome. IF everything was perfect (no oil in the cylinder, clean gun, etc), it was OK. Oil always seemed to find its way from the hand area, under the star, wherever, and tie the gun up. A dozen rounds shot and the gun would bind up or once again tie up the cylinder with cartridge setback due to dirt.

I finally did get it working somewhat OK but I had the reduce the loads to .22 mag velocity. Big deal--I got rid of it--too much ag.--------Sixgun

[tman]

here in the great state of Pa, we are not allowed to use a centerfire pistol or rifle caliber on small game. rimfire only. If I could use a 32-20 or something similar, I would. In fact, I would use .38 wadcutters out of my '92 and just be done with this. I have never had a use for a .22 mag, never shot one in my life (though I have had extra cylinders for .22lr pistols in this caliber). That was right up until I traded into (in a convoluted way, a S&W j frame air lite in 22 mag. That got me thinking, about a .22mag lever. I am perfectly content with the .22lr for squirrels and bunnies, but was thinking maybe the .22 mag for fox, ground hogs, and turkey. Note, each of those can be taken with the '92 I have now so no real need for the .22 mag, but I was considering it.

crazy,ain't it i'd love to hunt small game with a rossi 92 16" barreled .357, loaded with .38 wadcutters. i also feel that the velocitier negates the .22 magnum, unlesss you like splitting hairs.