Original 1886 half cock

[Huntermb]

I've got an original 1886 in 45-70. She was made about 1895. She is in great shape and shoots really well but the rifle won't go to half cock. I've taken it apart and the hammer looks fine, not worn, it stays in full cock no problem but it won't half cock. Anyone got any suggestions of what to check/look at on it?

[Hobie]

I've got an original 1886 in 45-70. She was made about 1895. She is in great shape and shoots really well but the rifle won't go to half cock. I've taken it apart and the hammer looks fine, not worn, it stays in full cock no problem but it won't half cock. Anyone got any suggestions of what to check/look at on it?

Look at the half-cock notch. Likely broken.

[Huntermb]

That's the thing, it's not. The half cock notch is better than the full cock one. I even found a picture of an original 86 hammer online to compare mine to and it looks the same.

[ArcticGoose]

Hard to tell without one right next to it to compare. However, maybe someone has cleaned up (repaired with a file or re-cut) the half-cock notch and removed a little too much material. That might explain why it looks better then the other notch. Just a guess, but who knows.

[Rusty]

Check the sear to see if all is well there.

[geobru]

Is the trigger spring keeping the sear up against the hammer?

[71fan]

I had one of similar vintage (also 45-70) where the half-cock was only about 1/16" from the fire position. It didn't even come all the away off the firing pin, and you could barely tell it hit half-cock. I didn't like it. I got some pictures of some other '86 hammers and my half-cock notch was in a slightly different position, for whatever reason, and the tip was slighty flattened (where it should have been a sharp point).

I have since sold the rifle, and never got pictures of the hammer. But I still have pictures of a proper hammer. If you PM me I'll email you a few pics, if you're interested.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

That's the thing, it's not. The half cock notch is better than the full cock one. I even found a picture of an original 86 hammer online to compare mine to and it looks the same.

It sounds like you have had the hammer out. Did you take the trigger out to see how the nose fits in the 1/4 cock notch?

If it does fit, the problem could be someone removed some metal from the trigger nose. Folks have done that because the receiver/bolt had too much up/down play to a point the hammer was following the bolt. The hammer followed the bolt because it wasn't pushed back/down enough to catch the sear notch.

That was most likely 71fan's problem too.

[Huntermb]

That's the thing, it's not. The half cock notch is better than the full cock one. I even found a picture of an original 86 hammer online to compare mine to and it looks the same.

It sounds like you have had the hammer out. Did you take the trigger out to see how the nose fits in the 1/4 cock notch?

If it does fit, the problem could be someone removed some metal from the trigger nose. Folks have done that because the receiver/bolt had too much up/down play to a point the hammer was following the bolt. The hammer followed the bolt because it wasn't pushed back/down enough to catch the sear notch.

That was most likely 71fan's problem too.

My situation is very similar to 71Fan. After looking at it again my halfcock seems to be sitting right at the full fire position. I had the trigger out and the hammer and trigger mesh perfectly at the half cock notch. When I reassembly the trigger group and hammer outside the gun it engages both notches the way it should. It sounds like mine is doing what you have described. It works perfectly on full cock and fires like it should yet the half cock seems to be too far forward. Does this mean I need to get a new trigger?

[Hobie]

That's the thing, it's not. The half cock notch is better than the full cock one. I even found a picture of an original 86 hammer online to compare mine to and it looks the same.

It sounds like you have had the hammer out. Did you take the trigger out to see how the nose fits in the 1/4 cock notch?

If it does fit, the problem could be someone removed some metal from the trigger nose. Folks have done that because the receiver/bolt had too much up/down play to a point the hammer was following the bolt. The hammer followed the bolt because it wasn't pushed back/down enough to catch the sear notch.

That was most likely 71fan's problem too.

My situation is very similar to 71Fan. After looking at it again my halfcock seems to be sitting right at the full fire position. I had the trigger out and the hammer and trigger mesh perfectly at the half cock notch. When I reassembly the trigger group and hammer outside the gun it engages both notches the way it should. It sounds like mine is doing what you have described. It works perfectly on full cock and fires like it should yet the half cock seems to be too far forward. Does this mean I need to get a new trigger?

Wouldn't that be a new hammer?

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

That's the thing, it's not. The half cock notch is better than the full cock one. I even found a picture of an original 86 hammer online to compare mine to and it looks the same.

It sounds like you have had the hammer out. Did you take the trigger out to see how the nose fits in the 1/4 cock notch?

If it does fit, the problem could be someone removed some metal from the trigger nose. Folks have done that because the receiver/bolt had too much up/down play to a point the hammer was following the bolt. The hammer followed the bolt because it wasn't pushed back/down enough to catch the sear notch.

That was most likely 71fan's problem too.

My situation is very similar to 71Fan. After looking at it again my halfcock seems to be sitting right at the full fire position. I had the trigger out and the hammer and trigger mesh perfectly at the half cock notch. When I reassembly the trigger group and hammer outside the gun it engages both notches the way it should. It sounds like mine is doing what you have described. It works perfectly on full cock and fires like it should yet the half cock seems to be too far forward. Does this mean I need to get a new trigger?

Wouldn't that be a new hammer?

New trigger. The nose needs to be a bit longer/taller. But, if there's still a lot of up and down movement in the bolt/receiver when the bolt is back the hammer may not be pushed down/back enough to get over the taller trigger nose. The thing to do is find a new 86 or 92 trigger, they use the same one, and compare it to yours. If the new stock trigger is taller/longer then I bet someone shortened it because of the bolt/receiver slack.

[Huntermb]

Thanks Nate, I'm going to be away for the weekend but when I get back I'll take the trigger out of one of my 92's and see how they compare. I'll keep you updated. thanks

[Huntermb]

Well Nate was bang on. Took the bubba'd 92 apart and sure enough the trigger was longer. Stuck it in the 86 and it works perfectly. Thanks again Nate.