RETRO - Marlin 444P "FINISHED"

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:39 pm

I've been debating this one in my head for maybe 3 months now !

I want a First Model 444 Marlin with the monte carlo stock and stright grip and 24" barrel to be made into a 18 3/4" barrel one similar to the later Marlin Model 444P .
I'd been looking for a First Model on Gunbroker and Auction Arms that was in need of help as opposed to cutting one of those I already had . Well the plan of finding another wasn't going so well so I looked over what I have !

The first of the circa 1966 rifles I have is the worst as far as blueing wear is concerned !

So I decided saturday to take this one for the chop job and reblue !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:42 pm

The first circa 1965 rifle I got had an awfull red tinted refinish job on the stock and forend .

So I decided to swap the stocks and put the nice original finiished stock from the 1966 rifle on my nicer 1965 rifle and refinish the red tinted stock for the retro rifle !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:47 pm

Sunday evening after dinner I swapped the wood on the two rifles and removed the scope , rings , base and hammer extension from the 1966 rifle before taking it in to the shop today .

This afternoon I decided to tackle the red stain on the stock and forend !

The stripper we used worked wonders so far !

Here are pics after the finish was removed . Evidently they put the red looking stuff over top the original finish !

Tommorrow I'll steel wool the whiskers off and start with the Tung Oil !
It's my ambition to get 12 coats on it as quick as possible and then possibly another coat every weel until I get to 20-24 coats !

The barrel should get cut tommorrow , as well as crowned and the sight holes drill & tapped for the front sight . Then hopefully the metal will be prepped and ready for the blueing tank on wednesday !

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:43 pm

All you need to do is add a suppressor, and you could really have fun...

Post by **Hobie** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:55 pm

Take that cheekpiece on down...

Jeff H · Post by **Jeff H** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:47 pm

Good looking walnut under that coat of paint there.

I would love to see this one as it progresses.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 9:49 pm

AJMD429 wrote:All you need to do is add a suppressor, and you could really have fun...

Thanks ,
But no thanks !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 9:52 pm

Hobie wrote:Take that cheekpiece on down...

You know I used to think this was the worst looking stock Marlin ever produced on a lever action !

But after shooting the heck out of the 17 I own that have stocks like this , I have to say this stock fits me better then just about all of the others they made !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 9:53 pm

Jeff H wrote:Good looking walnut under that coat of paint there.

I would love to see this one as it progresses.

Hopefully by this time next week I'll be ready to put it back together !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 9:56 pm

I've got a pair of these rifles that were made in 1965 . The one that "had" the red stock and another that someone had scratched their initials on the floorplate . WHile I'm getting the revamped 1966 rifle reblued I'm gonna straighten out the scratched on engraving job to the other 1965 rifle !

After that I have four or five that the Bullseye have fallen out of !
Think I may get them fixed as well this summer !

Mokwaw · Post by **Mokwaw** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:41 am

Let us know how that 18 3/4 shoots once you get it back together. I had the second model .444 (no monte carlo cheek piece). I bought it used from the original owner. When he showed me the terminal power those bullets had (turned a cinder block into dust) I didn't argue price, and took it home the same day. I never had the chance to use it on anything but groundhogs, but it was sure enough terminal on them, using 240 gr. hollow points.

smokenrust · Post by **smokenrust** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:12 am

I was thinking, 'to bad you just didn't buy a barrel of the length you wanted and then had the old barrel to either keep with the gun just in case you ever wanted to put the long barrel back on or a barrel to sell'.
I prefer the long barrel for my guns, they just feel more accurate for some reason.... and they get the noise farther away from the ears.

t.r. · Post by **t.r.** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:31 am

My 336A from the early 1950's has a raised comb as well. But curved lever and pistol grip. For scope use, the raised comb is superior. I like your rifle thus far and eager to observe the finished outfit.

TR

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:08 am

smokenrust wrote:I was thinking, 'to bad you just didn't buy a barrel of the length you wanted and then had the old barrel to either keep with the gun just in case you ever wanted to put the long barrel back on or a barrel to sell'.
I prefer the long barrel for my guns, they just feel more accurate for some reason.... and they get the noise farther away from the ears.

Yeah you have a vaild point !

However you need to take into consideration I have SIXTEEN more rifles that are pretty much identiacl to the one we just chopped and they're all in 444 not to mention seven of the ones with a pistol grip and a 22" pipe also in 444

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:09 am

Well the barrel is chopped , the front sight holes redrilled and tapped , recrowned and polished awaiting the blueing tank tommorrow !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:12 am

And here are the stock and forend after two coats of Tung Oil !

I've put another coat on since taking the pics !

I'll take them home with me tonight since I won't be at the shop tommorrow . And hopefully thursday this thing can go back together !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:48 pm

Well I put the 7th or 8th coat of tongue oil on the stock and forend when I got home a bit ago !

Perhaps by the time I get to the shop thursday morning I'll have 15 or so coats on the wood !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:50 pm

I've got a Weaver K3 I think I wanna mount on this one to hunt with . But for original bullet testing I think I'm gonna go with a Weaver K6 or K10 .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:07 pm

I put another coat of Tung Oil on the stock after we finished dinner . If my memory is correct that makes an even dozen coats !

I'm gonna leave it alone for awhile now and maybe add some more later while it all together .

Got the word on the metal parts around 3PM today and ALL IS WELL and we'll be able to put it all back together thursday !

I have the base , thumb extension and a Weaver K6 with rings ready to take to the shop in the morning !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:22 am

The 1966 Retro 444P is almost done !

I still need to mount the scope !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:24 am

Closer shot of the blueing on the reciever sides !

And a closer shot of the bobtailed barrel !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:26 am

And finally closeups of the stock and forend !

Didn't come out to bad with 12 coats of Tung Oil !

smokenrust · Post by **smokenrust** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:14 pm

"However you need to take into consideration I have SIXTEEN more rifles" HOLY SMOKEN GUNS!!!

Seventeen 444's WOW! Thats more than all the Marlins & Glenfields I have and thats including the little old single shot22.
That project of yours is turning out looking purty nice. Barrel looks a little short now to me

.
I have been toying with the idea of stripping a rusty abused 30A and having the barrel and reciever chromed or silvered and having the lever, band, cover cap, loading gate, sights and butt plate parts gold plated and using oil on the wood. Won't make it shoot any straighter but then it does ok for that anyways. SnR

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:45 pm

That's a beautiful transformation...Very Cool

A well thought out working gun, If I do say so myself... I like the Monte Carlo straight stock.. Very practical !! the no frills natural finish you are doing...There wont be any flex in THAT barrel set up and very little to get snagged on.. Can't wait to see how she prints...

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:57 pm

Okay we finished lunch and I got my Weaver K6 on top and bore sighted for paperwork !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:00 pm

smokenrust wrote:"However you need to take into consideration I have SIXTEEN more rifles" HOLY SMOKEN GUNS!!! Seventeen 444's WOW!
SnR

Actually I have 25 Marlin's in 444 !
This one , 16 more that are of the same configuration as this one before I cut the barrel . Then seven with the shorter 22" barrel and pistol grip stock still with the barrel bands . And finally one that was made in 2001 that I've restocked with a fairly nice piece of wood in the monte carlo fashion !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:24 pm

Ben_Rumson wrote:That's a beautiful transformation...Very Cool A well thought out working gun, If I do say so myself... I like the Monte Carlo straight stock.. Very practical !! the no frills natural finish you are doing...There wont be any flex in THAT barrel set up and very little to get snagged on.. Can't wait to see how she prints...

Thanks !

I'm pretty happy with the way it's turned out so far . But the final determination will be in what it does on paper in the upcoming weeks !

When it had the 24" barrel I was shooting a Castboolits group buy 434-207GC in with 52 grains of H322 and it did nicely on paper at 100 yards and the three deer it killed this past season .

For this short barrel I think I'll go with a heavier bullet . I want something in the 350 range plus or minus 25 grains . However I wouldn't be adverse to shooting the Ranch Dog 432-265GC or 432-300GC in it if thats what it takes for it to shoot well .

2X22 · Post by **2X22** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 12:36 am

Awesome

Can't wait to see how she shoots with some cast heavy weights!

RIHMFIRE · Post by **RIHMFIRE** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:52 am

Nice work...
Always wanted a 444.....
but now I know why I dont see any....
you have them all!

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:16 am

Good job. Ought to be right handy in the woods.

t.r. · Post by **t.r.** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:21 am

The quality of your handiwork is evident. BRAVO!!

TR

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:28 am

t.r. wrote:The quality of your handiwork is evident. BRAVO!!

TR

Thanks !

smokenrust · Post by **smokenrust** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 5:44 pm

6PT.,
here was one that you could have added to the collection and been what you were srtiving for....Almost. SnR

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewIt ... =236983916

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 6:11 pm

VERY nice

1886 · Post by **1886** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 6:16 pm

Very nice. I like the look of the early .444. 1886.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Fri Jun 24, 2011 6:35 pm

smokenrust wrote:6PT.,
here was one that you could have added to the collection and been what you were srtiving for....Almost. SnR

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewIt ... =236983916

No not exactly !
I had a pair of the actual "444P's" and sold them both . The stocks are to low on those things to feel good to me with a scope on top . Which is part of the reason I made this thing the thread is about . I prefer the stock on the original series of 444's over any of the othewr stocks Marlin's seen fit to put on them .

Without sounding like a wiseass I got exactly what I was striving for with the rifle in this thread . Wanted one with a 18 3/4" barrel , monte carlo stock and the barrel bands of the original style and this one has it ALL

rjohns94 · Post by **rjohns94** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 7:23 am

very very nice work. well done. anyone would be proud to own that one. good luck with it

Jeff H · Post by **Jeff H** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:36 am

WOW! Very, VERY cool!

smokenrust · Post by **smokenrust** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:48 am

"Without sounding like a wiseass", No, not when a fellow learns something new.
I never had the privelage to shoulder 25 Marlins muchless 25 of the same caliber and even less to own that many...(Now I am the w-a.)

But you on the other hand have had the privelage to heft, feel, shoulder and shoot many and do it tomorrow again since you do own them and you have find out what is comfortable and fits good, lucky man.

I didn't ever think that there was that much difference in those monte carlo stocks between the old and new, but now I know.
Best part is you have one that is exactly the way you want it. It still looks a little short to me.

Hope she'll be a good bullseye maker. SnR

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:13 am

smokenrust wrote: It still looks a little short to me.

The barrel on this one is the same length as the barrels on the Marlin 1895G , 1895M , 444P and 336D . Well actually mine's an 1/8" longer .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 3:46 pm

Well it's looking like the bullet that will be used in this rifle since the barrel chop will be the LBT 433-340GC I had Veral cut maybe a year or so ago . Have yet to use that one in a rifle to kill anything !

So my 1968 Target rifle will now be relegated to using the BRP/RD 432-375GC HP since thats the rifle I've been using to work up loads for the new bullet !

Also have a mold coming for a Lyman 429244 HP . Think I may try that one in my new Retro rifle

Post by **Chuck 100 yd** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 7:10 pm

Now that is SWEET !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 7:44 pm

Chuck 100 yd wrote:Now that is SWEET !

Thanks

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Jun 25, 2011 7:45 pm

Actually IMHO it should look better after I finish playing with it , remove the K6 and put a nice old Weaver K3 I have sitting on my shelf on top !

kenken0269 · Post by **kenken0269** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 7:42 am

Really nice. I would love to have a project like that some day. Make one like I want it. You have done a great job in my eyes. Whats next?

kenken

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 11:28 am

kenken0269 wrote:Really nice. I would love to have a project like that some day. Make one like I want it. You have done a great job in my eyes. Whats next?

kenken

Next thing I want out of the ordinary is going to be some kind of bolt action or single shot bench rifle .

Have thoughts of a Ruger #1 in 223 WSSM or quite possibly 22BR !

Or maybe and older 40X action in a PPC or BR .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 7:09 pm

Just finished loading some stuff for this rifle using the LBT 433-340GC and H322 , Varget and RL-7 . Now if I feel motivated when I wake up in the morning I'll take it to the range and see whats what !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:45 pm

Finally made it out this afternoon to the range with the retro 444P !

Let me begin by saying the only bullet I shot in the gun was the LBT 433-340GC cast from straight wheelweights water dropped and sized at .432" and lubed with Thompson's Blue Angel .

I loaded 10 rounds with 50 grains of Varget and used that to check scope setting at 50 yards before trying 3 of those at 100 yards for a 2 1/2" group . Two were touching and the 3rd was out !

Next I tried 45 grains of RL-7 and 3 of these measured 2 1/2" also at 100 yards and again 2 were touching and the third was out .

After that I tried 46 grains of RL-7 at 100 yards and 3 of those were 2 3/4" .

Then I tried the lighter load of H322 48 grains . Three of those at 100 were 2 7/8" . So I figured 49 grains of H322 would be all over the place , but I shot them anyway . Those three measuered 1 1/8" !

Next trip looks like I'll try 51 grains of Varget . Might also try 52 grains of Varget if I can get it and the bullet inside the case to suit me !

Wanna try 45 grains of Rl-7 again and perhaps 44 grains !

And with the H322 I'll try 49 again and possibly 50 grains !

May also try IMR8208 with 50 and 51 grains for kicks !

damienph · Post by **damienph** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:16 pm

I really like your short barreled 444. I am surprised that you didn't like the regular comb on the 444P, mine works well for me with a scope. I am a HUGE fan of the XTP bullet (in several calibers and weights). I have had good luck with the 240 and 300 grain XTPs in my 444P. Mine seems to shoot best with either H335 or H4198 for either bullet. I've tried RL7 but I cannot get it to group as well. I also have used the Hornady 265 JSP but really prefer the 300XTP.

Again, that is one fine looking rifle.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:49 pm

damienph wrote:I really like your short barreled 444. I am surprised that you didn't like the regular comb on the 444P, mine works well for me with a scope. I am a HUGE fan of the XTP bullet (in several calibers and weights). I have had good luck with the 240 and 300 grain XTPs in my 444P. Mine seems to shoot best with either H335 or H4198 for either bullet. I've tried RL7 but I cannot get it to group as well. I also have used the Hornady 265 JSP but really prefer the 300XTP.

Again, that is one fine looking rifle.

The first 444 I ever owned was a 444P ! I had a very nice load for it ! The no longer made Nosler 250 grain Partition with 52 grains of XMR2015 ! At the time I had a LEupold Vari XIII 2.5-8x on top .

The monte carlo stock on these earlier rifles fits me better with scopes then the stock on any of the Guide Gun type Marlin's .

I went thru most all of the jacketed bullets about 5 years ago shooting deer with them all just so I could say I did LOL's !
For me the two best jacketed 444 bullets were the afore mentioned Nosler 250 grain Partition and the Swift 280 grain !

In all actuality the Honrady 265 is a pretty darned good bullet , but some other folks on another forum kinda tainted that bullet for me ! They were of the type that believed whatever they said was gospel and no one else could ever be correct if it didn't agree with them !

Without sounding like one of them I think I've shot about as many different bullets as anyone in a 444 jacketed and cast alike ! And no that does not make me an authority however I have done it and will continue for a while longer provided I stay on this earth

FWIW , I also have a standard Marlin 444 just for shooting 400 grain cast bullets . I bought this gun used last summer . It was made in 2001 going by the seriel number . Anyway this rifle has some pretty decent but not great factory wood . The same day I bought this rifle on Gunbroker I went to "Macon Gunstocks" website and picked out some more figued wood that was pistol grip with amonte carlo so the gun would feel more like my older First Model 444 !

Couple pics of my 2001 444 rifle after it was restocked !

In those pics it has a 70's era Weaver 2-7 that didn't hold up ! Think it's previouse life on a SKS with brass battering it did it in before I got my hands on it !

Here are two pics of the same rifle with one of the new Redfield 3-9's ! This scope has held up very nicely to all my heavy loads to date !

And here are a couple pics with the factory stock the day I recieved the rifle !

Gun came with a Leupold 2-7 shotgun scope which I sold on Gunbroker for a fair price . Also sold a friend a less then perfect Marlin 1893 I had in 32 Special and I ended up with nothing except the cost of the custom wood in this gun . The guys at the shop inletted , finished etc for me for free since I do certain PC things for them LOL's !