OT: Astronauts tracks on the Moon

[olyinaz]

Latest image from NASA showing the Apollo 17 landing site. Astronaut tracks, rover tracks, the lander, the rover, and equipment all visible.

http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5843 ... 7_area.jpg

Cheers,
Oly

[bdhold]

my, we're litter bugs...

great photo - thanks for the link

[rjohns94]

so why did we leave the LRV way over there? did it run out of battery power? kewl photo.

[Old Savage]

Computer generated??? How would you know. NASA ran a project at the local high school to set up a web site. It did not work when the time came. They told the kids to lie and just say it worked.

[Rusty]

Why do you think they call it NASA?


Never A Straight Answer.

[Ysabel Kid]

[Pitchy]

Heck a cell phone don`t work half the time so i`m to believe they landed on the moon.

[AJMD429]

Man, I seen tracks just like those down in the river-bottom in my brother's soybean field - do ya think there's been astronauts right down there in the horseweed and nettles...? COOL...!

[Aggiecubpilot]

A real treat for me this summer was to hear Eugene Cernan speak at Oshkosh; geez what a guy! A major topic of course was our halting shuttle flights, and both he, Jim Lovell and Burt Rutan were mighty unhappy about handing the keys to the Ruskies. And how right they are. After working so many years to get ahead of them we just let em take over. Sad days for us budget cuts or otherwise.

[FWiedner]

They probably parked the LRV over yonder so that it didn't get destroyed by the thrust of the departing ascent stage and resultant flying debris when it left the lunar surface.

It's an artifact that I'm sure NASA wanted to preserve.

Notice that the other experiments left behind are also placed a prudent distance from the abandoned decent stage.

[Borregos]

Interesting picture, thanks for the link.

[Cimarron]

Wait a minute, the earth is flat and the sun revolves around us. I know it's true 'cause it appeared to me in a dream!

[Old Savage]

This is interesting - I have always wondered why in many of the pictures the moon seems to extend for a about 60 to 100 ft in back of the astronauts. But this little film contains some historical facts I was not aware of.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=moon+lan ... 29,r:2,s:0

I live in the desert, it is flat but there is no place I have seen that looks like it ends shortly behind you other that a cliff.

[kimwcook]

Went and watched Apollo 18 last night with the wife. I won't print anything to spoiler the film, but let's say my heart was racing when it was done.

[FWiedner]

This is interesting - I have always wondered why in many of the pictures the moon seems to extend for a about 60 to 100 ft in back of the astronauts. But this little film contains some historical facts I was not aware of.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=moon+lan ... 29,r:2,s:0

I live in the desert, it is flat but there is no place I have seen that looks like it ends shortly behind you other that a cliff.

Well, that inspires confidence.

As far as Kubrik, I'm guessing Buzz Aldrin beat him to death for calling him a liar.

[scarville]

Nice picture.

When I worked in Aerospace I had the pleasure of meeting and briefly working with Neil Armstrong. He struck me as a man who was introverted, honorable, rather shy around people and scrupulously honest. He would make a lousy politician. Maybe he did lie about Apollo 11 or maybe he was brainwashed by the CIA but I doubt it. Very much.

[Old Savage]

60s bluff to intimidate the Russians who have admitted they could not solve some of the technical problems? National Security?

[Malamute]

Great picture of the landing site.

I didnt read it all, but haven't seen anything on the linked site that leads me to believe the conspiracy theorists have a point. Looks more like vague assumptions and a lot of false info, like trying to muddy the waters, rather than anything solid. The refutations are much more sound than the theories. Some of the "points" are just ludicrous.

[donw]

my grandpa, who was born in 1895, died 1975, never did believe in much more than "Tin Lizzies"... let alone men going to the moon...was it all staged?

[Old Savage]

Like the Kennedy assassination, what they told us was the story I certainly do not believe is true. Those who challenge the points of those suspicious of this are largely name calling from what I see. Many of the pics appear to be fakes from I would think most dealing with natural light photography I would think. I personally know very well one of the astronauts that held the space walk record and a number of people question his take on known normal reality situations. Secrecy reigns in the govt. if you choose to believe the story you have been told ...? many of the younger group that were in grammar school when this happened seem to take it as an article of faith.

So almost a full day in 224 degree heat in the suit and the lander??? Now how would you protect against that. Cooling, insulation??? They can't seem to do much less demanding projects right now. It's a small world after all .....

[Malamute]

I dont recall any name calling on my part.

I went, looking with an open mind, and the light questions are what disturbed me the most in the contentions of fakery, I don't see the supposed issues as the problems the detractors say they are, it seems they arent familar with photography and light to me. It would take hours to discuss the questions they bring up, but the vast majority that are supposed issues are not at all to me, as one that looks at light and does some photography. One shadow looks weird, but we dont have an overall picture of the scene. The "light isnt supposed to be like that" question that were brought up are far less beleiveable than the more likely possibilities of things we can't see, like the light on the bottom of the container the guy is holding. It looks like a plate on the bottom of a rod coming off the container, and it looks like it's turned sideways, catching light, and looks quite normal to the shot. Stars don't show? Yeah, a camera can only do so many things at once, like the background fading away (and the stars not being in focus at the same time as the foreground), to get the depth of focus needed to make every part of a shot be in focus, they'd have to stand perfectly still for a long time to get every part to expose, then the stuff that was lit well would wash out. Shadows are different lengths by a tiny amount? (not at all the hge amount they are supposed to be) Uneven ground changes shadow lenth tremendously with a low light angle. Can see the top of the guys head? I guess it's not possible he was leaning slightly, it must be a conspiracy. Such things detract so much credibilty from the whole discussion that I can't it seriously at all. The vast majority of the "questions" raised about the pictures fall into the same catagory to me. To supposed the whole thing was a fake based on the pictures is vastly more of a stretch than to believe they actually did it. After reading the contentions of "issues" with the pictures, the questions that were brought up make the whole detractor postion far less believable to me. Sorry if it didnt strike anyone else that way, but it very much does me.

Dust shows clear tracks very well in many cases. Some in my driveway are clear for several days, with good detail. Dry as a bone. Sorry, had to laugh out loud at that one.


Fred, I very much like you, and your posts always interesting, we just don't agree about this.

[KirkD]

I visited with Col. James Irwin several times. He struck me as a man of integrity, whose relationship with God was the highest priority in life. He often spoke of his moon trip in great detail. He was the kind of man that, if this whole thing was false, but he was told to pretend it happened, he would simply shut his mouth and refuse to say anything about it. He certainly would not continue to happily talk about it and make up all sorts of details that were never part of the official story. My little sister's ex was heavy into this conspiracy and one evening he brought over photos that he said proved the Americans never landed on the moon. Actually, they boiled down to only one. Fortunately, I had the exact same photo as it had been published in the 1960's before the conspiracy theorists got their hands on it. The conspiracy folks had photoshopped an extra astronaut into the photo the ex brought over, and they had done it badly. The sun angle was totally wrong for the extra astronaut they had photoshopped in. Comparing the two photos side by side, it was obvious that the 1960's photo was the original and the conspiracy theorists' photo had been doctored. As I went through his evidence, I could see that nothing stood up.

Incidentally, one of the lunar crew left a laser reflector on the moon on one of those trips. When I was doing a physics degree in the 1970's anyone in the world with the right instruments could bounce a laser off that detector and measure the exact earth to moon distance. If there were no astronauts on the moon, who put the laser reflector there?

[foxtrapper]

Like the Kennedy assassination, what they told us was the story I certainly do not believe is true. Those who challenge the points of those suspicious of this are largely name calling from what I see. Many of the pics appear to be fakes from I would think most dealing with natural light photography I would think. I personally know very well one of the astronauts that held the space walk record and a number of people question his take on known normal reality situations. Secrecy reigns in the govt. if you choose to believe the story you have been told ...? many of the younger group that were in grammar school when this happened seem to take it as an article of faith.

So almost a full day in 224 degree heat in the suit and the lander??? Now how would you protect against that. Cooling, insulation??? They can't seem to do much less demanding projects right now. It's a small world after all .....

Gotta ask since you think conspiracy with JFK and the Moon landing.......... how about 9/11?

[Old Savage]

9/11, good question, but more wondering about the points brought up by the people who think it was. I am always wondering just what are the actual facts about anything. My work in chiropractic for over 35 years is involved with the same sort of investigative idea with results from that that are surprising with what would look like "somewhat mysterious" results caused by interference with nerve circuitry in various individuals that were not recognized or dealt with by what you might think of as the standard medical model.

Reloading is an example as is rifle accuracy. Many opinions - some of which you will find to be true and some not. Investigating what works and works repeatedly.

Now, if the govt. is involved they are always concealing something.

Piece of landlocked property in NJ I own that was valued at $100 then increased to $50,000 now back to $5,000. No one in the system will admit openly that there was a mistake or be willing to correct it.

Why, what do you know?

[Old Savage]

Malamute - certainly wasn't talking about you - what I have read as the effort to brand as "conspiracy theorists" anyone who questions information is in itself usually an attempt at pejorative and the attempts I read there briefly and at other times to debunk the debunkers are have usually been heavy on attack and light on explanation. There is a photo with etched cross hairs on the lens that the astronauts have somehow managed to stand in front of with them saying oh those lines disappear on light backgrounds - really - there is a lot of that.

Kirk's info is interesting. What I do not do that many others do is just believe something because it is popular or that the govt. says so. I am interested in the facts and a lot of it is up in the air. The official Kennedy explanation certainly false. Moon landng ???? 9/11 what are the facts.

Kirk has used authorative association and man of God honesty and their view of some photos without being specific and while there is no one I would tend to trust more than Kirk and his opinions those methods don't stand high in the sources of truth hierachy and he knows that and this certainly is no attack on him.

Whenever there is one of these it attracts a lot of people and views and what I see many debunker debunkers doing is picking on the easiest and then trying lump it all together.

The moon landing for many falls into the YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE THIS category. Believe means you assert that it is true and i do not have the info to do that and I see many things to doubt. It does seem a little unlikely that they solved all the problems and carried those missions out repeatedly without mishap and they have not bothered to go back.

And Mal - just saw this one - there is certainly no need for you to agree with me on this. I will look back at the dust tracks thing.

[olyinaz]

I visited with Col. James Irwin several times. He struck me as a man of integrity, whose relationship with God was the highest priority in life. He often spoke of his moon trip in great detail. He was the kind of man that, if this whole thing was false, but he was told to pretend it happened, he would simply shut his mouth and refuse to say anything about it. He certainly would not continue to happily talk about it and make up all sorts of details that were never part of the official story. My little sister's ex was heavy into this conspiracy and one evening he brought over photos that he said proved the Americans never landed on the moon. Actually, they boiled down to only one. Fortunately, I had the exact same photo as it had been published in the 1960's before the conspiracy theorists got their hands on it. The conspiracy folks had photoshopped an extra astronaut into the photo the ex brought over, and they had done it badly. The sun angle was totally wrong for the extra astronaut they had photoshopped in. Comparing the two photos side by side, it was obvious that the 1960's photo was the original and the conspiracy theorists' photo had been doctored. As I went through his evidence, I could see that nothing stood up.

Incidentally, one of the lunar crew left a laser reflector on the moon on one of those trips. When I was doing a physics degree in the 1970's anyone in the world with the right instruments could bounce a laser off that detector and measure the exact earth to moon distance. If there were no astronauts on the moon, who put the laser reflector there?

Thank you Kirk.

Oly