Have any of you "done it"

[madman4570]

I know not only New York State is the only state that does not allow bordering states residents to CCW into their state.
Also, I know some states don't allow "any" CCW in their state or some if allowed you almost have to be related to a Gov big shot.
And some states like NJ have the kludged "no HP ammo of any kind???
And also was told many counties in Pa presently are not at this time giving out non-resident CCW either!

When you live in an area that part of the town is in one state and the other part is in the other------------
What's the best solution? (and no not move )

Any of you guys use a single barreled shotgun shortened legally to say an OAL of 27"(with the barrel being 19"of that length)
You could carry the thing pretty darn easy/when in a car it could be broke open(unloaded)right next to you hiding under your little camo mini blanky and a few shells right at hands reach.

The time to grab a shell(or two)stuff one in the chamber and slam it shut would be pretty darn fast.
It could also be carried (loaded)in a small 28" mini bag with the one end having a pouch that you could reach directly in and Boom(for that close up defense situation if your life depended on it in that certain situation needed.
They would come apart super easy(pull forearm off/move lever/its apart)and same to assemble(so could be carried that way in a 20" duffel bag/or small take down case etc.)
They have for the size incredible power(.454 casull/.500 Smith type)and in states outlawing HP ammo(how bout 3 60 cal 320gr hardened balls at 1100fps coming out of one shell?

Bottom line----any of you guys use em?
At least in NYS (except NY city and such) was told by the Top powers to be in Albany,NY that if the gun has over a 18" barrel and is over 26" OAL when measured from center line along of the barrel(Its absolutely Legal)?????????
Which also is what the Federal Law mandates.(just play it safe and go some over that)

What's your thoughts??? Good/Bad/Indifferent?

[Pete44ru]

FWIW, my CCW permit is good nationwide, since it was issued in 1776.

The shotgun idea works just great (I used to convert quite a few for low-income city dwellers, once upon a time).
I always run a strip of 1/2" wide white cloth (not paper) medical adhesive tape down the top of the barrel as a low-light sight.



Federal Law mandates a minimum smoothbore bbl length of 18", with a minimum OAL of 26"; State/Municipal law may vary.

.

[TomD]

Google Brooklyn special. Another Jeff Cooper development.

http://www.gunweek.com/2007/feature0701.html

http://gunrightsmedia.net/showthread.php?t=407382

[Lastmohecken]

The original Brooklyn Special was a Winchester 94 trapper in 30/30, in which Cooper wrote was brought to his shooting ranch to a attend a rifle class he was putting on. The guy was from NY so Cooper coined it the Brooklyn Special.

The 30/30 might have too much penetration for an appartment building in the city, as might 00 buckshot, but I have found the 30/30 to generally be more reliable then the average pistol cartridge leveraction, when it came to feeding through the action of an off the shelf rifle.

However my Browning 92 in 44 mag works slick enough for me to trust, as does my Winchester 94 in .357 mag, but I have had a few Marlins, and Rossi's that were more reliable when being used as a baseball bat. So, all I am saying is if you decide to get a Brooklyn Speical for protection, shoot it plenty to check for relliability, and don't switch pistol ammo brands or styles without checking the new ammo out with the rifle chosen.

So, in some ways, the 30/30 is superior, because generally, in off the shelf weapons, a much bigger precentage of the rifles will work out of the box, with about any brand of ammo chosen, but of course you would still need to shoot it to be sure. And the 30/30 would also put off more recoil and blast, and hold fewer shells in the mag.

As a side item, I have a friend that took a motorcycle trip from Arkansas to Alaska, thru Canada, and figured out that with proper paper work, he could carry a shotgun on his bike, so that is what he did. I believe he carried a 12ga singlebarrel Mossburg with a pistol grip and 18+ barrel. He said he had no problems entering Canada from the lower 48, and no problems in Alaska, but did have a little bit of a problem getting back into the lower 48 with it, but did get it worked out.

[Lastmohecken]

FWIW, my CCW permit is goood anywhere in the lower 8, since it was issued in 1776.

The shotgun idea works just great (I used to convert quite a few for low-income city dwellers, once upon a time).
I always run a strip of 1/2" wide white cloth (not paper) medical adhesive tape down the top of the barrel as a low-light sight.



Federal Law mandates a minimum smoothbore bbl length of 18", with a minimum OAL of 26"; State/Municipal law may vary.

.

Yes, just a plain old singleshot shotgun with a maybe an ammo carrier on the stock would be be about as good as anything else, for defending the home. And could be either left unloaded, or left loaded for 20 years with the hammer spring at rest, and a piece of tape over the barrel to keep obstructions from getting in the barrel, and you would probably have a gun that could always be relied on to to work.

[Blaine]

As an aside....I can open carry in Seattle (much to everyone's annoyance) but, my 4" folder will get me arrested, or even shot should I have it out cleaning my fingernails....

[Lastmohecken]

As far as CCW carry goes, I am glad I live in the south, where my CCW is honored in pretty much every state all around me and then some.

[Rusty]

A 19" barrel on an H&R Topper shotgun even with the standard factory stock is pretty handy. I'm not sure I'd even want to cut down the stock as I've seen so many do.

[jhrosier]

Not a lever action, but the Kel-Tec Sub 2000 carbine might be a good choice.


It is available in 9mm or .40S&W and takes commonly available handgun magazines. It folds down to just over 16" long (will fit in a brief case).
As it is a rifle, there should be no problem transporting it in the USA but it might not be allowed in Canada.

I have one and find it to be reliable and adequately accurate. It is made mostly of plastic but seems rugged enough for serious consideration.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/rifles/sub-2000/

Jack

[Lastmohecken]

There is a downside to having a CCW License. If I lived in or had to travel through an area like NY City, or Chicago, I would perfer not to have a CCW License, because if you get stopped, and they run you DL they will know that you have a CCW in your home state, at which point they are going to ask you if you have a gun, and they just might think it's reason enough to search for one, so in this case you had better not take any chances and carry one illegaly.

All I am saying is if I felt I had to have protection in a area like that, I rather not have a CCW License showing up on my record, when they run my DL. Because if you are clean cut, with no prior comvictions, and you are not being a jerk, or fit a given profile, then then the most you will get is a speeding ticket and be on your way, and the question of having a firearm will not come up, but if you have a CCW, the question will come up, espacally in an unfriendly state for gun owners. I prefer to just stay the heck out of those unfriendly states.

[Lastmohecken]

Not a lever action, but the Kel-Tec Sub 2000 carbine might be a good choice.


It is available in 9mm or .40S&W and takes commonly available handgun magazines. It folds down to just over 16" long (will fit in a brief case).
As it is a rifle, there should be no problem transporting it in the USA but it might not be allowed in Canada.

I have one and find it to be reliable and adequately accurate. It is made mostly of plastic but seems rugged enough for serious consideration.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/rifles/sub-2000/

Jack

Yeah, but the worst thing is that gun just looks bad, and if I ever had to use it, and had to go to court over the outcome, I believe the jury would be more inclined to rule against me, after seeing a mean looking weapon like that on display, heck even I might if I was on a Jury, although I would be more friendly toward it then most non gun owners, and I guarantee you, the jury that gets chosen won't be a bunch of good ol boys that like to shoot in the first place.

[madman4570]

That sub-2000 is harder than heck to get right now.
My buddy said he can't even get any in as of late.

Somewhere I thought I read that with a rifle(maybe being 9mm/40S&W they get around the rifle thing?)the min 26" OAL has to be
when measured with stock fully in??? Not sure???

Anyhow, yes that is one cool little protector.(I want one)the 40S&W one.

Thanks!

[jeepnik]

Never owned a single shot. But "The Perfect Jeep Gun",



has got me thinking of putting together "The Perfect Truck Gun". I'm thinking of making my old Franchi Model 48 20 ga into the "Perfect Truck Gun". I already have a 20" barrel from the days when I was pretty broke and had a barrel cut down for home use. It breaks down with just the twist of the end cap, and if I do something similar with the butt stock, it would fit into a right handy package. The large gauge would be more suitable for "urban" challanges.

[jhrosier]

...)the min 26" OAL has to be
when measured with stock fully in??? Not sure???..!

The length is not a factor as the gun folds near the front of the trigger guard and cannot be fired when folded.

Jack

[madman4570]

Jack,
Does that butt stock also fold in and any idea if so what OAL length?????
Just showed the wife----------Now she wants one
Gave me the green light to get two!
Might have to try someone other than my buddy?

And a lot of guys on here already know how I love Kel-Tec from having my tiny P32
In fact I know someone that I want to get something nice for Christmas that just graduated College.
Put it in a briefcase saying"all College Grads need a decent briefcase when he unwraps it.
While he is starting to open it,I will say ya,there's some office supplies inside like no big deal to cover the extra heft thing.
Then when he opens it---Wham---I'll slap him on the back and say-------------Gotcha BIT##

I did that last Christmas with getting him a $20 Chinese Air rifle in the box(could tell by his eyes when he opened it he was thinking WTF)
I went on how nice that Chinese gun is Let him stew on that for about 20 mins.
Then said, Oh sh## I have a case that goes with that? Let me get it.
Came back and he was just staring at that $20 airgun he did say----aiming it---It's nice.
I said-----See if it fits in the case?
He slowly seeming to be not too excited opened it-------------------And,
Sitting inside was a Mint Springfield Armory M1 garand with a red bow around it.(he has always wanted a Garand bad)
I slapped him on the back and said----------------Gotcha Bit##
He had tears in his eyes and just sat and held it for 2 hours!
So,yep----maybe 3 are in order!

[jhrosier]

madman,

The Sub2000 folds only as shown. The buttstock does not extend or retract.
The folded length is 16-1/4". (info on their website is wrong)
It will use one of: Glock, S&W, Beretta, or Sig mags.
The frame for the Glock mags is unique. The other frame can be changed to use either a S&W, Berreta or Sig mag by buying and changing the mag catch, if your needs change.
The gun can be locked in the folded position with a special key, so no trigger lock is needed to stay safe and/or legal for transport. The mag can remain in place while the gun is folded or unfolded but no round can be chambered while doing so.
The factory supplied mags are 10 rounders but larger capacity mags can be used where legal.

I have not been to a gunshow recently but they were selling for $325-350 the last time that I checked. Kel-tec stuff seems to always be hard to find. It has been that way for as long as I remember.

Jack

[MrMurphy]

That's because they do production runs, 1 gun a a time.

Small guns are the market right now, so they're building baby .380s and 9mms as fast as they can. You won't see many SU-16s or Sub 2000s around, they're just not building them.

[OD*]

The original Brooklyn Special was a Winchester 94 trapper in 30/30, in which Cooper wrote was brought to his shooting ranch to a attend a rifle class he was putting on. The guy was from NY so Cooper coined it the Brooklyn Special.

And he referred to Marc Heim's 16-inch iron-sighted lever gun in caliber 44 Magnum as his, "Kansas City Special."