Wasted 4 hours trying to mount a Marbles tang sight

[OD#3]

I was all fired up to get this thing installed on my Browning 1886 SRC. I don't have a #21 drill bit and 10/32 tap, but I confidently mounted it with the tang screw and marked the spot for the top hole. Then I eagerly rushed off to town to purchase a #21 bit and a 10/32 tap. Four hours later I still hadn't found a single place in two towns that sold #21 drill bits singly. I found a few large drill bit sets that included a #21, but I didn't want to spend $80 on a whole kit--I just wanted one stinking drill bit. One store had every tap imaginable, yet every drill bit they had was a fractional. I even briefly a complete tap and die set that came with what it said was the appropriate drill bits. But although it included a 10/32 tap, all the drill bits in the kit were fractionals as well. I came home frustrated and empty-handed, and I appreciate the opportunity to rant about it a bit here.

On another note, I chose the Marbles over the Lyman because of the windage adjustments. But I wonder how much of an advantage that is going to be after all, since the wings (don't know what else to call them) that flank the firing pin on the back of the bolt also flank the tang sight post when fully the bolt is fully to the rear. It doesn't look like there's going to be much room for windage adjustments without causing the back of the bolt to strike the tang sight post. Has that been a problem for anyone else here?

[Griff]

Gosh, runnin' all over town to find the correct tool. WHERE have I heard that before? As my wife is ever so quick to remind me, "... haven't you heard of a PHONE?"

And everytime I complain about it to my best friend... he sez, "... wife? What's a wife?"

[Eye-Bite!]

I was all fired up to get this thing installed on my Browning 1886 SRC. I don't have a #21 drill bit and 10/32 tap, but I confidently mounted it with the tang screw and marked the spot for the top hole. Then I eagerly rushed off to town to purchase a #21 bit and a 10/32 tap. Four hours later I still hadn't found a single place in two towns that sold #21 drill bits singly. I found a few large drill bit sets that included a #21, but I didn't want to spend $80 on a whole kit--I just wanted one stinking drill bit. One store had every tap imaginable, yet every drill bit they had was a fractional. I even briefly a complete tap and die set that came with what it said was the appropriate drill bits. But although it included a 10/32 tap, all the drill bits in the kit were fractionals as well. I came home frustrated and empty-handed, and I appreciate the opportunity to rant about it a bit here.

On another note, I chose the Marbles over the Lyman because of the windage adjustments. But I wonder how much of an advantage that is going to be after all, since the wings (don't know what else to call them) that flank the firing pin on the back of the bolt also flank the tang sight post when fully the bolt is fully to the rear. It doesn't look like there's going to be much room for windage adjustments without causing the back of the bolt to strike the tang sight post. Has that been a problem for anyone else here?

Yepper! Kinda like going to the Auto Dealer because they have the only Proprietary software to fix their product. They create the product line and now you need to buy their tools.

[Alphawolf45]

I've never seen a hardware store sell numbered or letter or metric sized drills.. Anything that isn't common has to be ordered.. Can usually find anything like that very reasonable on Ebay..Saves a lot of time and burning gas to just order from Enco, MSC or get'em on Ebay.

[Sixgun]

The hole drilled does not have to be exactly .159 (#21 drill bit) You could have bought a standard 5/32" which measures .155. Or you could have gone a few thou over. ( Remember a FEW thou, not 15 or 20).

Most times the thousandths in inch is printed on the packaging. Sometimes not. Just last week I bought $45 worth of drill bits at the hardware store and the biggest measured .110.---------------Sixgun

[M. M. Wright]

That 5/32 drill will probably make a hole that is about .160 if you just drill it without piloting it first. The tang on that Browning is plenty tough though so like 6 says 4 or 5 thousandths over will make it easier to tap. When you order your drill bit, buy a little can of Tap Magic. Wonderful stuff.

[Sixgun]

That 5/32 drill will probably make a hole that is about .160 if you just drill it without piloting it first. The tang on that Browning is plenty tough though so like 6 says 4 or 5 thousandths over will make it easier to tap. When you order your drill bit, buy a little can of Tap Magic. Wonderful stuff.

Yea, good addition M.M. And how about this one? Buy at least 3 drill bits as the first one will probably get dulled up going through the case hardening (sometimes) and the second usually breaks as we sometimes don't always pay attention to how hard we are holding down the handle on the drill press.................which by the way is the only way to drill into a gun. I never could hold a regular drill at the proper 90 degree angle. ------------------------6

[Mescalero]

Few people can.

[Pete44ru]

.

Just my $0.02, but you've wasted your time/energy.

FWIW, I shot/hunted with my Marble's tang-sighted .45-70 Winchester/Miroku Model 86EL for 5 years with only the tang screw holding it fast................

It never lost zero or had other issues - although I made sure to check the tang screw's tightness prior to using the rifle (every time).




.

[J Miller]

Umm, seems everyone has forgotten about Brownells { http://www.brownells.com/ }. You need it, they got it.

Beats the heck out running around. As for the phone, it seams nobody at stores any more want to be bothered to answer or give correct info on phones. Maybe that's just Illinois, I don't know.

Joe

[AJMD429]

Just the tang screw plus a little epoxy would work even though it might be considered tacky.

Agree about the alternate drill sizes. Get a chart off the internet on equivalent sizes (or a good hardware store should probably have such a chart).

MUST have Tap Magic. I don't know what it does but it's sure different than just using regular oil...I guess that's why they say it's "magic".

[El Chivo]

I got a bunch of taps from Midway after the last gunsmith debacle, so at least I'll be prepared.

[olyinaz]

Few people can.

But oh how we like to think we CAN!!

Signed,
Bubba

[olyinaz]

As for the phone, it seams nobody at stores any more want to be bothered to answer or give correct info on phones. Maybe that's just Illinois, I don't know. -- Joe

Joe is sure right about that. It would have taken at least an hour to call all over town and it would have been painful. This way at least you got out some and might have stumbled upon a gun shop (or two) in the process.

[jnyork]

.

Just my $0.02, but you've wasted your time/energy.

FWIW, I shot/hunted with my Marble's tang-sighted .45-70 Winchester/Miroku Model 86EL for 5 years with only the tang screw holding it fast................

It never lost zero or had other issues - although I made sure to check the tang screw's tightness prior to using the rifle (every time).




.

What he said. Forget the D&T, you dont need it. I shot silhouette for years with an 1886 in .33WCF, only had the tang screw holding the sight, never a problem. You might put a little epoxy under the sight base and put some blue loctite on the screw if it really makes you nervous . I presently have 4 other leverguns with the sight mounted the same way, plus I know several other people I shoot with have the same setup. Just go shoot it and quit worrying.

[OD#3]

I never expected so many replies; thanks everyone! I've boogered up a firearm or two or three...in my younger days trying to make-do with improper tools (using a hand drill in place of a drill press was one of many foolish stunts) and-or making and modifying parts instead of using the correct replacements. These days, unless I'm working on something like a Colt New Service where some replacement parts are almost impossible to obtain, I try to follow the manufacturer's instructions to the letter. Hence, my reluctance to use a fractional bit even if there are only a few thousanths difference between that and a #21. But having never needed numbered bits before, I was too naive and expected to find them at any well-stocked store.

Thanks for the heads-up on Tap Magic.

I've lurked here quite a while and noted with interest the several recommendations about just relying on the tang screw. I'd wondered if the curved mating surface was enough to stabilize the site laterally given a good tight tang screw. I suppose it is worth at least trying it out on the range before I start drilling through the word "Browning".

Thanks everyone.

[KirkD]

I've been trying to hold the drill at 90 degrees for years. Never been successful even once.

[Pete44ru]

I've been trying to hold the drill at 90 degrees for years. Never been successful even once.

FWIW, Kirk - That's a two 6-pack job, fer sure. . .



.

[piller]

You can get a decent drill press for a very reasonable price at Harbor Freight and it is always better than holding a drill by hand.

[44-40 Willy]

I used a drill press and a hair bigger bit when I drilled and tapped my Rossi 62 Octagon 22 for a Marbles sight. It's been on there for about a dozen years now with no issues.

And about not being able to get good info out of a store when calling them on the phone. What happens a lot with me is they say "Yeah, we got it". But when I go down there, they don't have it, but try to sell me something else.

[Chuck 100 yd]

I buy all my drills and taps for gun work from brownells. a 6x48 tap is about $3.00 with no minimum order and they will ship parcel post to save $$$, not UPS @ high cost.

I also order several at a time ( both drills and taps) because I like to use a new drill and tap for any work. I have a couple dozen in a box that have been used on 1 or 2 holes. I get several accumulated and take them to the gun show.
Also buy carbon steel taps and avoid high speed steel. If broken, a carbon tap can be smacked with a small punch and the pieces removed if a high speed tap is broken in a hardened gun part.... Well all I can say is GOOD LUCK on getting it out. I have sent pieces to New Line Guns and had them removed with an EDM machine ( taps broken by others and brought to me to fix)and that can get very expensive.