Opinions on possible retirement to Ky or Tenn

mergus · Post by **mergus** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 12:14 pm

Gentlemen. in about 18 months or so, the wife and I will both be retiring from our full time jobs here in Vermont. As we can't afford to live here in retirement, we've made up our minds to leave for a less expensive state. 2 states that are on our radar are Ky and Tenn. We're looking to live a rural lifestyle, not in a town, but 45 minutes or so outside of one. We'd like a place with 5 to 10 acres of land so that we can raise some animals and do some shooting. We're scheduled to visit the Bowling Green area in August.

I would welcome any and all opinions on living in either state.

Mergus

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 1:48 pm

TN doesn't have a state income tax. Neither do several others,, but the "experts" are mixed on the "best".
http://money.usnews.com/money/retiremen ... y-taxes/11

http://www.kiplinger.com/slideshow/reti ... -retirees/

Given the choices, I'd still take Texas!

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 1:55 pm

Both are beautiful states topographically.
Both have lots of rural areas.
Neither has a huge city that skews the state's politics like some other states (i.e. Illinois).

BOTH used to have gun laws that really SUCKED. Tennessee required a different CCW license (and fingerprinting and fee and safety course) for each handgun you wanted to potentially carry, AND for each county you wanted to travel in. I read an article for Women & Guns (Second Amendment Foundation publication) about a nurse who crossed a corner of a county she didn't live in to get to a third she worked in, and she had to get SIX separate permits, only good for a year, for the two handguns she had. None of the fingerprinting or safety courses 'applied' to more than one permit.
I don't think Kentucky had CCW until relatively recently (Indiana was among the first so that is 'relative'), and then when they started it, they wouldn't recognize other state permits.

THE GOOD NEWS is that I know they are both much-improved, but you might want to check out the details.

Too bad 'gun laws' have to be a factor to consider when moving, but if you want to stay out of jail yet stay safe, they can be a BIG factor.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:06 pm

Washington (completely away from the liberal, and highly taxed I-5 Corridor) is ok. No State Income Tax. It is not a bad place gun law-wise. Shall issue, and completely legal open carry with no permit. I fear it's going to get worse, though. That idiot governor Jay Inslee wants to join OR, and CA in a one dollar+ additional tax on gasoline. For the children, of course. Come to think of it, stay away

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:15 pm

TN seems nice but it is FLAT , I've traveled the interstate that goes east and west across the state and it seemed to me once you got about 40-50 miles west of Bristol it was flat as a board .

I've never set foot in KY so I can't say yeah or ney on that one .

If it were me I'd suggest North or South Carolina over TN and KY .

I had inclanations a few years ago to find a cheaper retirement place in the US , now I'm okay with staying in central VA . Although it would be nice to have about 75 acres of hunting property and a cabin on the Eastern Shore of Maryland .

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:47 pm

6pt-sika wrote:TN seems nice but it is FLAT , I've traveled the interstate that goes east and west across the state and it seemed to me once you got about 40-50 miles west of Bristol it was flat as a board ..

Ya need yer "inclinometer" fixed!

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:25 pm

Griff wrote:
6pt-sika wrote:TN seems nice but it is FLAT , I've traveled the interstate that goes east and west across the state and it seemed to me once you got about 40-50 miles west of Bristol it was flat as a board ..
Ya need yer "inclinometer" fixed!

I suppose being from Texas it isn't flat to you .

But after living on the edge of the Blue Ridge most of my life , most of TN is FLAT to me .

Granted I like Maryland's eastern shore and it's flat as well . But what I like about the Eastern Shore is not in TN .

Dave · Post by **Dave** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:42 pm

I can't say about KY but have lived in TN a long time. TN has no state income tax and as long as you are east of the TN River it is hard to go wrong. West TN has more in common with MS culturally and topographically and is considered by many to be part of MS.

Nashville is a boom town now and is in Davidson County. Any of the counties surrounding Davidson may be what you are looking for Smyrna would be worth looking at. The real estate prices have not gotten crazy and it is hilly but not mountains.

wecsoger · Post by **wecsoger** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:49 pm

A life long resident of KY here, currently trapped in OH till I move back 'home' and retire.

Do your due diligence, but KY property, state, sales, etc., taxes are pretty retirement friendly.

Stay more than 45 away from Louisville, it's a major population center. South of there is E'town, Fort Knox (and Knob Creek, home of the machine gun shoot) and there's a lot of pretty country till you hit Bowling Green.

Do research and crank your travel on I-64 towards the east, you've got Frankfort (ho-hum) and Lexington, the other major population center. Great hospitals, great university, great places to eat. A lot of postive economic things are happening there so you've got arts, entertainment, basketball, etc.

Lexington is a part of the Lexington/Winchester/Nicholasville/Georgetown sprawl so look at your maps. Again, the more than 45 minute rule applies here too.

East of Lexington is, well, not much there, there. On I-64 next not-so-big community is Mount Sterling, then at the far end, Ashland. The latter has seen hard times, even Ashland Oil headquarters has moved to Lexington.

*All* of the locations I mentioned above, once you stay away from the major centers you can find the property you want. Lexington and south and east terrain gets much hillier so you to get your level 5 - 10 acres you may have to buy 30. But it varies, there's serious hills in the far east end of the state, but beautiful rolling terrain around Lexington.

Check out the Maysville area, rolling hills, farms, Amish presence. If I recall, there's milk/dairy farm for sale down between Maysville and Flemingsburg

I think you'll be pleased with the property values. If you have your own income, checking out the economically depressed areas will get you some great buys on abandoned farms.

As far as TN, I've just driven through it. A lot. Knoxville area, rolling hills. West, there's flat. East of Knoxville, you've got touristy areas, Gatlinburg and Pigeon Forge. East of there, serious hills. I mean really, really serious.

Feel free to post or PM if any questions.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 6:44 pm

Just musing - don't forget Indiana.

We have a low cost of living, probably the best 'gun laws' in the nation aside from Alaska and Vermont (and in some ways probably better, as the predominant local culture is a 'gun culture' except in Indianapolis, Bloomington, Gary, and perhaps Evansville - even those places are pro-gun paradise vs. many entire states).

We DO have 'hills' if you are south of U.S. 40 or I-70.

Anyway, you might give Indiana some though, too....

Larkbill · Post by **Larkbill** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 8:06 pm

Lots of good suggestions. We have a bunch of powerplant customers in that area and I get through there a lot.

Southern Indiana, from 30 miles north of I-64 to the Ohio, lots of nice small towns, but my favorite is Corydon. Boonville is another good choice.

KY. Between I-65 and I-75 south of the Bluegrass Parkway. I'd look hard at Danville and Sommerset and surrounding areas. Further south hillier, north more rolling, the horse country.

Tn. Agree on west. If I were headed there I'd like the Nashville area, but that's mainly because my best friend since 7th grade lives there. On the lines you are looking for I like the valley that US 27 follows from Red Bank to I-40. Spring City has a lot going for it, and I like the looks of Soddy-Daisy.

Ray Newman · Post by **Ray Newman** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 9:44 pm

In ’01, we made an interstate move upon retiring. Some of the below you may already considered.

What the Squeeze and I did was make numerous trips at different times of the year to areas that we considered. After looking at several, we found possible sites for relocating. We then took a map of the area(s) and drew a 30 mile diameter circle around each area. Then we looked if there any doctors, dentists, emergency medical service, fire departments, etc., within that circle. Some potential areas were scrubbed as they were lacking in one or more of these services. Same with shopping areas. No use living in a rural area if you need to drive 25+ miles to go to the store or are at the mercy of the local high priced markets, filling stations, etc.

I strongly suggest this as the older we become, medical services become more important and it seems that doctor and dental appointments become more frequent. And gasoline will not get any cheaper.

Also suggestion considering handicapped access in a future home. If you are building, it is relatively easy to make a bathroom, kitchen, bedroom accessible. In older homes or trying to do a renovation, handicapped access is extremely expensive or just cannot be done. For ‘zample, I have a good friend who has a split level house. His wife developed a problem in her legs and it is becoming tiring and more burdensome to go up and down 1-3 steps to go from the garage or the laundry room, etc.

If you hire a moving service, obtain as many bids as possible. Some organizations have discounts with certain movers.

If possible, have a 3rd party view any seriously considered sites. Sometimes unbiased eyes see things that the buyer does not.

Also don’t believe everything the seller or the realtor tell you. It is in their best interest to sell. Drop by the local merchants and filling stations and ask about the area, crime rates, etc. Same with local law enforcement. Know of a gun club member bought a house in what turned out to be a not-so desirable area because the price was very good and he did not know about the local meth problem.

Prior to the actual move, I went down to a shipper and purchased boxes of the same size for packing and very strong wrapping tape. It is easier to stack/load/unload same size boxes. Each box was labeled as to the room and a box number for that room on all 4 sides, top and bottom. That way no matter which way it was loaded, the room location was readable. Then for each box, we then made a list of its contents. Yes, this took a bit of extra time, but it sure saved time when unpacking or looking for something. When I unpacked my wood shop and reloading boxes I was very grateful that I took the time to do this.

We had a house built and one the features added was having the house wired for an emergency generator. This area does not have that many power outages, but it seems like when they occur, the outage is for a long period of time. Bought a 7 Kw+ battery start generator and all I need to do in an outages is thrown the circuit breaker on the main panel to cut off pole power and connect the house circuits to the generator. I run it once a month for a few minutes as preventative maintenance. If I was doing it again, I would seriously consider a natural or propane gas unit that automatically comes on when the power fails and runs an automatic monthly test cycle.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 9:55 pm

The propane ones are NOTORIOUS for excessive fuel consumption.

mergus · Post by **mergus** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 9:28 am

Guys, thank you all very, very much for your opinions. I am going to get out my atlas and study each of the areas mentioned. I may well PM some of you with follow up questions. The wife and I have lived in the current house for 25 years now and I/we feel like we are unknowledgable in moving related things, so the ideas about the packing and labeling are welcome and will be used.

One of the things I hoped to do when we settle on 2 or 3 candidate houses is to go introduce myself to the neighbor on either side and see if they seem reasonable. And then do as suggested and visit a few businesses in the area and see what "things" are like.

Having grown up on the Eastern Shore of Md, I have a great fondness and am comfortable with waterfront/marshy areas and summer time heat. My wife however, not so much. Were I single I would like to try Georgia or South Carolina. As such, I am looking forward to river life on the various rivers that wind their way through and around those states.

Again, Thanks much.

Mergus

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 11:57 am

AJMD429 wrote:Just musing - don't forget Indiana.

We have a low cost of living, probably the best 'gun laws' in the nation aside from Alaska and Vermont (and in some ways probably better, as the predominant local culture is a 'gun culture' except in Indianapolis, Bloomington, Gary, and perhaps Evansville - even those places are pro-gun paradise vs. many entire states).

We DO have 'hills' if you are south of U.S. 40 or I-70.

Anyway, you might give Indiana some though, too....

Down in Brown County comes to mind. Also, around Madison was really good hunting (Does Jefferson Proving Grounds still have those "any deer" hunts?)

wm · Post by wm » Mon Jun 09, 2014 5:41 pm

For what it is worth Northern Michigan has some great hunting and fishing and the property prices are very depressed right now and should remain so for the foreseeable future. Population of Michigan is trending downwards as our young people graduate college and find job opportunities are more appealing out of state.

Bill in Oregon · Post by **Bill in Oregon** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 6:01 pm

Mergus, don't write off the Pacific Northwest, as Blaine says.
Oregon is a pretty easy place to be a shooter. Shall issue. No sales tax, but property and income taxes. Spectacular scenery.
Lots of different climates to pick from: coastal and wet; Willamette Valley (the end of the Oregon Trail), green and drier than the coast, but wet in winter; Rogue Valley, drier yet, with world-class theater; Oregon high desert, drier still, cold but clear winters and if you ski or snowmobile, a great place.
Nice thing is you can live in the high desert and be crabbing on the coast in three hours, or on the coast and be skiing vice versa, or be in Portland (beautiful city) and be on the coast or in the high desert in a couple of hours. Oregon is VERSATILE, and unlike Tennessee and Kentucky, a volcano might kill you but the weather sure won't.
Here's a view of Mount Hood off my back deck in central Oregon's high desert:

Weather here in summer? 80s, low 90s and 20 percent humidity or LESS. At night, we typically cool 30 to 40 degrees, for great sleeping weather.
More than 50 percent of Oregon is public land, so you can access most of the state and you don't need anyone's permission. And our coast is 99 percent publicly owned. You want to walk on the beach? Do it baby!
And even here in the desert, our airport, Redmond, has daily directs to Portland, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Salt Lake and Denver. If you've got family anywhere in the U.S. it is easy to get to them (and they'll want to come for Christmas and skiing).
I won't mention that we have some of the best salmon, steelhead and trout fishing in the Lower 48 ...

mergus · Post by **mergus** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 8:32 pm

Wow, Oregon sounds tremendous. I had no idea....

Sounds like N. Mich has the same problem Vt has....all the young people are moving away. The Vt unemployment rate is only 3.4%. They can't find a decent job and can't afford to stay here.

Mergus

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 9:01 pm

Bill in Oregon about has me about convinced to move.

Bill in Oregon · Post by **Bill in Oregon** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:24 am

Levergunners are most welcome here!
By the way, here's a vid I shot last fall in the heart of the Cascade lava fields. It's about 45 minutes from my house, and if you visit when the aspen is golden, the vine maple bright red, you'll not soon forget what you saw. Not obvious are all the lakes and streams full of trout ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWJBqWC6rVg

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:07 pm

Bill in Oregon wrote:Levergunners are most welcome here!
By the way, here's a vid I shot last fall in the heart of the Cascade lava fields. It's about 45 minutes from my house, and if you visit when the aspen is golden, the vine maple bright red, you'll not soon forget what you saw. Not obvious are all the lakes and streams full of trout ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWJBqWC6rVg

Bill, unless there's a deduction I can't find, OR wants about 9% of my meager income in state tax. I know there's no sales tax, but I don't buy much anymore

Bill in Oregon · Post by **Bill in Oregon** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 1:20 pm

Blaine, yes, we do have personal income tax and property tax. But it will only cost you $77 to register your truck ...

Richardx · Post by **Richardx** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 12:59 pm

I live in west TN and I agree that it is flatter than the rest of the state but east of Jackson, TN it gets much hillier(?).

I have had a carry permit for over 15 yrs and only places it doesn't work is, wait for it, Mass., NY, NJ, Illinois, and probably the republic of Kalifornia.

Come on down the weather is fine, lots of hunting and fishing and every type of shooting sport.

RichardX

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 1:50 pm

I have lived in both KY and TN. Both are neat places. I would lean toward TN, myself, especially East TN.

Great people in both states.

The only thing that was hard for me was being so far from the ocean, and from real mountains, but that's just because of where I grew up.

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:03 pm

AJMD429 wrote:. . . the best 'gun laws' in the nation aside from Alaska and Vermont (and in some ways probably better, as the predominant local culture is a 'gun culture' . . .

You think India has better gun laws than Alaska?

I will have to pull up the laws - I was under the impression there were more restrictions there. Aren't there restrictions on hunting calibers, too, or am I mistaken on that?

Funny how the politics work with IL and it's huge cities being so anti-gun, and IN right next door being the opposite. I think it must be the culture of crime in places like Chicago that drive the anti-gun sentiment.

RIHMFIRE · Post by **RIHMFIRE** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:36 am

I like them both...but spent more time in TN...mostly east TN
in the mountains and all the way to Nashville...
I liked Townsend, near Cades Cove,... to Maryville...southeast of Knoxville

I hear the huting is awesome in KY along the rivers....

harry · Post by **harry** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 11:01 am

7.62 Precision wrote:
AJMD429 wrote:. . . the best 'gun laws' in the nation aside from Alaska and Vermont (and in some ways probably better, as the predominant local culture is a 'gun culture' . . .
You think India has better gun laws than Alaska?

I will have to pull up the laws - I was under the impression there were more restrictions there. Aren't there restrictions on hunting calibers, too, or am I mistaken on that?

Funny how the politics work with IL and it's huge cities being so anti-gun, and IN right next door being the opposite. I think it must be the culture of crime in places like Chicago that drive the anti-gun sentiment.

"Aside" from Alaska and Vermont,

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 3:47 pm

RIHMFIRE wrote:I like them both...but spent more time in TN...mostly east TN
in the mountains and all the way to Nashville...
I liked Townsend, near Cades Cove,... to Maryville...southeast of Knoxville

I hear the huting is awesome in KY along the rivers....

I have seen a lot of deer in both states. I killed tons of deer in KY. Most with an M240C, one with a 25mm. Killed four with one burst once, cost me my score.

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 3:51 pm

harry wrote: "Aside" from Alaska and Vermont,

In parenthesis he said that the laws in some ways were probably better than Alaska and Vermont, since IN had a predominant gun culture.

I need to take a look at the laws, because honestly it never occurred to me to look at IN as a strong pro-gun state. Given its location, I just assumed that it was probably about average for the area. Talk about making assumptions, huh?

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:35 pm

Bill in Oregon wrote:Levergunners are most welcome here!

Hmmmm , my levergun accumulation isn't what it used to be !

But double shotguns , drillings/combo's , Ruger #1's and bolt actions are picking up where the lever rifles left off

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:10 pm

I've been looking since this thread started for possible vacation/hunting properties !

Southern Dorchester County Maryland is still in the front for me . But the Georgetown SC area ranks a semi close second .

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:02 pm

6pt-sika wrote:
Bill in Oregon wrote:Levergunners are most welcome here!
Hmmmm , my levergun accumulation isn't what it used to be !

Being a levergunner is in your heart, not your gun safe.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:42 pm

BlaineG wrote:Down in Brown County comes to mind. Also, around Madison was really good hunting (Does Jefferson Proving Grounds still have those "any deer" hunts?)

Beautiful hills southern 1/3 of state, filled with lots of SMALL towns. Dunno about JPG, but Atterbury has lots of hunts.

7.62 Precision wrote:I will have to pull up the laws - I was under the impression there were more restrictions there. Aren't there restrictions on hunting calibers, too, or am I mistaken on that?

Funny how the politics work with IL and it's huge cities being so anti-gun, and IN right next door being the opposite. I think it must be the culture of crime in places like Chicago that drive the anti-gun sentiment.

In parenthesis he said that the laws in some ways were probably better than Alaska and Vermont, since IN had a predominant gun culture.

I need to take a look at the laws, because honestly it never occurred to me to look at IN as a strong pro-gun state. Given its location, I just assumed that it was probably about average for the area. Talk about making assumptions, huh?

Probably more hunting restrictions, but I believe it was the Indiana CCW law that Florida copied as their 'model' law which the rest of the nation then emulated.

Last report I saw there were about 400,000 CCW's in the state and the population around 6,000,000, so 1 out of every 15 people, and probably therefore about one out of every 10 to 12 adults you'd see out on the street (after counting out the under-age and nursing-home population), has a CCW license. On holidays, anyone out in the rural areas is likely to host family get-togethers involving firearms, and it isn't unusual to hear 3-shot-burst or full-auto gunfire. Pretty low violent crime rate, other than the few zip-codes in the big-cities. Not very many anti-gun cops other than in big-cities, either.

bigbore442001 · Post by **bigbore442001** » Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:45 am

I wish you the best on your retirement. In some ways I wish I could retire now.

I would take a trip and do a scouting run of sorts. Spend a week in both Kentucky and Tennessee. I know this is common sense but sit at a local small town restaurant and get a feel for the culture of sorts. Find out the good, the bad and the ugly.

Everyplace has a good and bad side to it but you have to evaluate what your needs are and if the good is appealing enough to make a move.Another thing to do is go to Weather Underground and study the climate of the regions you want to move to. I have been through Tennessee and it is a beautiful state but I know West Tennessee gets very hot and humid.

Hunting is another issue that you need to look into. Many people from other parts of the country find it hard to grasp the old New England concept of open land. For most places if land is not posted it is open to hunting. That has been a cultural tradition for well over a century or more. Not the case in other places.

hightime · Post by **hightime** » Fri Jun 13, 2014 6:35 am

Good luck on your retirement. I couldn't make it here in Northern , MN. Taxes and heating bills. I went back to work. I found it is way better. Yes, that's what I think. I had little pride in what I was doing. I went back to work building hunting shacks, cabins, saunas. Now I look back at what I've done each day with pride and money left over after paying those taxes. I however don't work everyday.
Now if I were going to move to retire, the big factors would be woods and a lot of public land. From what I understand few areas have it like us here where only along roads are private. We have lots of public forest. With lots of lakes and swamps, there is natural boundaries to maintain privacy.

Owen

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Fri Jun 13, 2014 3:53 pm

In looking at TN, also consider sales tax for specific locations. Unless things changed since I was there last, there is no income tax. However, there is sales tax and counties and cities have their own sales tax. So while one location may have a sales tax that is not to bad, another location might have high county and city taxes. For example, sales tax was over 9.75% in one city, with state, county, and city sales tax combined, and the city was arguing over changes that would bring it to 11%. This can be a big deal if you consider the percentage of your income that is spent locally for consumer goods.

In the next county over, sales tax was very reasonable.

While people complained about the sales tax, not having a state income tax makes a big difference.

bigbore442001 · Post by **bigbore442001** » Sat Jun 14, 2014 5:16 am

Not to go off on a tangent but to me one big factor would be the amount of property tax.

Personally, I believe property tax to be inherently evil. Imagine owning your own home free and clear yet you have to pay a tax on the place you live? If you really hit hard times and do not pay that tax then what will happen to the ownership of your home?

As the gentleman from Vermont stated they are moving out and one of the reasons is property tax. Many people and my parents are included had to sell their life long home because their income is fixed but the taxes on your property are not.

I would look around at what the mill rate for property is and if there are loopholes. Farm exemptions,etc.

cshold · Post by **cshold** » Sat Jun 14, 2014 9:48 am

bigbore442001 wrote:Not to go off on a tangent but to me one big factor would be the amount of property tax.

Personally, I believe property tax to be inherently evil. Imagine owning your own home free and clear yet you have to pay a tax on the place you live? If you really hit hard times and do not pay that tax then what will happen to the ownership of your home?

As the gentleman from Vermont stated they are moving out and one of the reasons is property tax. Many people and my parents are included had to sell their life long home because their income is fixed but the taxes on your property are not.

I would look around at what the mill rate for property is and if there are loopholes. Farm exemptions,etc.

Smack on true.
School & property taxes are a huge factor.
You never truly own anything that you have to pay yearly taxes on.

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Sat Jun 14, 2014 6:19 pm

Ahh . . . . taxes.

So we have to pay taxes one way or another. Originally, the purpose for federal taxes was to fund the federal government (which is way over-funded today). Today I think the federal taxes are required more to cover the fact that our monetary system is little more than a counterfitting operation. By taxing the citizens, the gov't keeps their faith in the currency.

Whatever the case, taxes have to be payed, so the question is, what system would be most fair?

Our graduated income tax system is a system that taxes the wealthy unfairly.

Sales tax taxes those with lower incomes disproportionately (though it is more fair than the income tax).

The lottery is a voluntary tax on poor people.

Land taxes seem more fair, since everyone ultimately pays them, but are not necessarily so. In some parts of the country, farmers struggle to afford the land taxes because they have more land than other people, yet the land taxes are what support the local infrastructure, so those living in town pay a much smaller percentage than farmers, yet enjoy the same benefits from those taxes.

Any time you consider taxes in an area, you have to consider all types of taxes - no sales tax is nice, but the income tax might be way high, or there may be no income tax and high land taxes.

The amount of property you will own and you income can be factors, too. Someone who earns 50K per year is going to be affected more by sales tax than someone who makes 150k, while the second guy will be hit harder by income tax, or maybe land taxes, if he owns more valuable property.

Canuck Bob · Post by **Canuck Bob** » Mon Jun 16, 2014 8:44 pm

My heritage had roots in Ontario and Alberta. I've never regretted picking the west of the continent. I went to school in Idaho decades ago and there is a lot to like about the west. I find Ontario and travel around the US that the eastern side and the horseshoe around the Great Lakes is just too crowded. Of course near our border is a bit cold in the winter, lol!