OT - Butchering a Russian... (91/30 to 91/59ish)

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 10:46 am

olyinaz wrote:Edit: Woops, I see that I'm flagellating a deceased equus.

I'll just offer this juicy bit:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewIt ... =218313417

Regards,
Oly

Now see, THAT one has a bit of history/cachet... that and the metal doesn't look like it was carved out of a tanker bar by Drunk Ivan with a Cold Chisel in 1943 (like mine does).

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:19 pm

Here's where I am today:

OAL for the rifle is now down to 42" from 50". Bbl length is 21-3/4" (I wanted an inch of "crown oops" to play with if necessary).

Time to crown the bbl & get the front sight dealt with. Think this is silver-soldered or brazed? I need to get it off if I can.

FWIW barrel dia at the front sight mount is .585, and at the new barrel location is .624. Not much taper there.

Then comes inletting the front barrel band spring and refinishing the stock.

JerryB · Post by **JerryB** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:21 pm

Looking good so far.

John in MS · Post by **John in MS** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:48 pm

Am following with great interest -- please keep us posted as you progress!! Looks good so far!

Thanks,
John

SteveR · Post by **SteveR** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:26 am

txpete wrote:nice steve and it does look like a modified M 27 trigger.

I wouldn't post any pics of the rifle here as they don't need to see another cheap $59.00 rifle

pete

lol, yes the trigger is pinned like a M27, but it has a screw on the butt end to allow for trigger adjustment. Its pretty neat the things the Finn's do.

Steve

SteveR · Post by **SteveR** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:29 am

Old Ironsights wrote:Here's where I am today:

OAL for the rifle is now down to 42" from 50". Bbl length is 21-3/4" (I wanted an inch of "crown oops" to play with if necessary).

Time to crown the bbl & get the front sight dealt with. Think this is silver-soldered or brazed? I need to get it off if I can.

FWIW barrel dia at the front sight mount is .585, and at the new barrel location is .624. Not much taper there.

Then comes inletting the front barrel band spring and refinishing the stock.

Why not scope it and leave the front sight off. They have the scout mounts that take the place of the rear sight for like 30 bucks.

Steve

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:44 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0eqG5GJR ... ture=feedu

these guys are goobers

but will give you a idea with a scout set up.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:52 am

SteveR wrote:...Why not scope it and leave the front sight off. They have the scout mounts that take the place of the rear sight for like 30 bucks.

Steve

'Cause my name ain't "Young Scopeguy"...

Irons first. Remember, this is to be a CHEAP truck gun. A Tasco scope would likely double it's "value".

Besides, I'm using this project to help me learn a bit about metalworking.

SteveR · Post by **SteveR** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:26 am

Your killing me here!!

Your right about the worth of the gun now that you hacked it all up!! hahahaha

Just be careful with the files when you cut in the dovetail for the front sight, not much meat in them skinny Russian barrels, you will probably have to find a way to raise the front sight though. It will shoot different with a shorter barrel.

Steve

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:32 am

SteveR wrote:Your killing me here!! Your right about the worth of the gun now that you hacked it all up!! hahahaha

Just be careful with the files when you cut in the dovetail for the front sight, not much meat in them skinny Russian barrels, you will probably have to find a way to raise the front sight though. It will shoot different with a shorter barrel.

Steve

Well, as long as I can figure out the way the front sight mount is mounted, I can always get another (taller) one milled.

As it is, all else being equal, just re-mounting the original will put it .02 taller than where it was to begin with.

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:49 pm

Put the heat to that sight & see if she comes loose.. You've got that sawn off barrel to practice silver soldering on too..

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 2:00 pm

Ben_Rumson wrote:Put the heat to that sight & see if she comes loose.. You've got that sawn off barrel to practice silver soldering on too..

Well, just did that. No joy. I'm hard pressed to imagine that the sight base is integral to the barrel, but 5 min with a propane torch did nada.

SteveR · Post by **SteveR** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:30 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:Well, just did that. No joy. I'm hard pressed to imagine that the sight base is integral to the barrel, but 5 min with a propane torch did nada.

You need a micro torch or something a lot hotter than propane, you need to melt the old solder which I doubt is silver, but it still takes a lot of heat. If its a pain, use your files and cut the old mount out of the old barrel, more time consuming, but you won't need to buy anything else.

You may want to get some heat stop paste if you plan on soldering in the base to the new dovetail you cut in your barrel.

Steve

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:21 pm

Put the barrel stub over your stove burner or heating element to help with heating... Then play the propane flame on the sight/barrel junction... The sight is more than likely Brazed on rather than Silver soldered... Braze happens at dull red on steel...you will need dim light to see true dull red.. Have a pair of pliers handy to pull the sight off with...
Now I'd put the sight back on with soft solder...It's in the 3000- 4000 psi tensile strength range... It will be plenty strong enough if you have a tight fitting joint, plus you won't have to heat that barrel up so hot...But you could use low temp silver solder to put the sight back on for a more strength...

Old Time Hunter · Post by **Old Time Hunter** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:02 pm

The sight is more than likely Brazed on rather than Silver soldered...

Most definitely it is brazed, torched mine off though, got it cherry red and hit with a hammer. Felt like I was a precision Ivan machinist!

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:38 pm

Hey, OI, you gonna nail the pronghorn with that thing?

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:57 am

jnyork wrote:Hey, OI, you gonna nail the pronghorn with that thing?

No, that's what the Savage 99 .308 is for.

This thing is a truck-beater for 'yotes of opportunity and prairie-dog detonation.

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:49 am

Old Ironsights wrote:
jnyork wrote:Hey, OI, you gonna nail the pronghorn with that thing?
This thing is a truck-beater for prairie-dog detonation.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:12 pm

jnyork wrote:
Old Ironsights wrote:
jnyork wrote:Hey, OI, you gonna nail the pronghorn with that thing?
This thing is a truck-beater for prairie-dog detonation.

Hey, them there are tough critters to kill. I was thinking about using a .50 BMG but couldn't find one to fit in the truck cab...

Alan Wood · Post by **Alan Wood** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:54 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:
jnyork wrote:
Old Ironsights wrote:
jnyork wrote:Hey, OI, you gonna nail the pronghorn with that thing?
This thing is a truck-beater for prairie-dog detonation.

Hey, them there are tough critters to kill. I was thinking about using a .50 BMG but couldn't find one to fit in the truck cab...

Alan Wood

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 6:08 pm

Polish & crown.

I thought about leaving some file marks just to keep it in character, but changed my mind...

Sorry for Shake, Flash looked worse.

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 6:14 pm

Well Done!

horsesoldier03 · Post by **horsesoldier03** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 10:19 pm

Nice job on the crown! What did you use?

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:09 am

horsesoldier03 wrote:Nice job on the crown! What did you use?

Hacksaw, bastard file, 400-800-1500 wet-dry, & a brass screw w/valve grinding compound.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:06 pm

Old Time Hunter wrote:
The sight is more than likely Brazed on rather than Silver soldered...
Most definitely it is brazed, torched mine off though, got it cherry red and hit with a hammer. Felt like I was a precision Ivan machinist!

Well... took it to the body shop down the street and put the acetylene to it... got it cherry red. It did NOT come off.

I guess I'm going to have to mic it out and make one out of some type of steel.

markinalpine · Post by **markinalpine** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 3:47 pm

OI,
I will admit failure! I've come up empty.

Since I first read your opening comment to this thread, I have been searching for an article I read some time ago on-line where the author described and illustrated his project to install a front sight on a shortened barrel. He used a (all measurements will be guesses) 1/2" wide steel strap long enough to wrap around near the end of the barrel with enough extra length to form ears. This strap was maybe 1/16" thick. He drilled through the strap and a steel block that was curved on the bottom to the curvature of the barrel for a through machine screw to clamp the block and strap to the barrel, and he screwed a small hex drive cap screw into the top of the block for an adjustable front sight.
Anyway, sorry, I just can't locate that article, but maybe I've described it well enough to give you an idea.

Good luck,
Mark

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:51 pm

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewIt ... =216546497

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:06 pm

txpete wrote: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewIt ... =216546497

Wow!

Oly

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:22 pm

where is my hacksaw

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 10:02 pm

OI - Sounds like you want to do to your gun what my buddy's brother has with his M/N:

It's a sweet-shooting gun, and makes a perfect truck gun!

SteveR · Post by **SteveR** » Sat Mar 19, 2011 11:15 am

Ysabel Kid wrote:OI - Sounds like you want to do to your gun what my buddy's brother has with his M/N:

It's a sweet-shooting gun, and makes a perfect truck gun!

No, he no want no stinkin scope.............................................................

Steve

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Sat Mar 19, 2011 10:36 pm

SteveR wrote:...
No, he no want no stinkin scope.............................................................

Steve

Nope. Not if I have to sacrifice my rear Irons.

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Sat Mar 19, 2011 10:45 pm

and you can still use you irons

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:57 am

txpete wrote:

and you can still use you irons

Nate Kiowa Jones · Post by **Nate Kiowa Jones** » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:56 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:
Old Time Hunter wrote:
The sight is more than likely Brazed on rather than Silver soldered...
Most definitely it is brazed, torched mine off though, got it cherry red and hit with a hammer. Felt like I was a precision Ivan machinist!

Well... took it to the body shop down the street and put the acetylene to it... got it cherry red. It did NOT come off.

I guess I'm going to have to mic it out and make one out of some type of steel.

You don't have to do that. Just cut and grind away all the remaining barrel, contouring the bottom to fit and solder to the larger O.D. up the barrel. Or leave enough to shape into a dovetail base to go into a new dovetail cut where you need it.

model55 · Post by **model55** » Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:01 pm

You can do as nate suggested or put on a scout mount for a scope without losing anything.If you want the iron sight dove tail it in,if a scope the various mounts use part of the iron sight bases and are reversible.Going to try a 2x power soon on my MN.Bought the UTG mount which is a bit over done ( tactical

) but completely reversible.

Stan in SC · Post by **Stan in SC** » Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:12 pm

The "Darrel" mounts are good.I used the BKL mount which replaces the rear sight.It is rock solid for about $37 if I remember correctly.
http://www.bkltech.com/BKL_253_3_Long_C ... kl-253.htm
This thread has made me reconsider selling my scout scoped 91/59.In fact I took it to the range today and my decision not to sell it was reinforced by it's accuracy.Thanks Old Ironsights.

Stan in SC

Post by **AmBraCol** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 8:56 pm

Saw this video - reminded me of this thread...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTX_-quVROA

awp101 · Post by **awp101** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:01 pm

Too bad these guys don't make a MN mount. Remove the scout scope and the mount doubles as a rear sight:

http://scoutscopes.com/

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 6:22 am

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=110825

Stan in SC · Post by **Stan in SC** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:35 am

And there is a way to windage adjust front sights on a 91-30.
http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/mo ... /index.asp

Stan in SC