Oregon school shooting

[Bill in Oregon]

Well, in this morning's Oregonian, we have a look into the family that produced the school shooter: a tight knit, loving Mormon family. Clearly, this young man suffered a mental health event that destroyed him:

Jared Padgett's family knew him as happy, chatty person who was quick to hug, full of love and had a goal in life, unlike many teenagers.

They never imagined he would lug weapons to school, kill a fellow student, injure a teacher and then take his own life.

That was not who he was.

"Everybody loved him," said Stephanie Fields, an aunt. "The Jared we knew and loved was not the Jared of Tuesday morning. Everybody is devastated."

Fields said the family is grieving both for Jared, 15, and Emilio Hoffman, the 14-year-old student who Jared killed Tuesday at Reynolds High School.

"We are so saddened by the events that took place," Fields said. "And the coach (Todd Rispler) that got injured. And all the other children at the school. They lost friends. They lost classmates. They lost a little piece of their innocence."

No one in the family appears to have seen this coming.

"All I can think of is he was in a lot of pain for some reason," said Felecia Padgett, one of Jared's cousins.

She spent a lot of time at the Padgett home in Gresham when Jared was young, staying overnight so she could remain in the same school district after her family moved to Vancouver.

"I was at their house every day," said Felecia Padgett, 26. "He was always smiling. He was always happy. He was talkative."

But last Thanksgiving something changed, she said. Jared was not his usual friendly self at a family celebration at his family's house.

Instead, she said he was quiet and withdrawn. Her father, who often saw his nephew, noticed a change as well.

"My dad told me that for the last couple of months, he had gotten kind of quiet," Felecia Padgett said. "They didn't know why. My dad's girlfriend would try to interact with him and he wouldn't respond."

No one thought much about it until Tuesday's shooting.

"Now we're wondering if something did happen," Felecia Padgett said.

In searching Jared's home, detectives found a journal in which he described a plan to kill classmates. A source close to the investigation said Padgett called some people "sinners,'' railing against those who smoked cigarettes or took the Lord's name in vain.

His family never saw that anger.

The last time Fields was with her nephew was at a religious event in March. Jeff Fields, her husband and Jared's uncle, was baptized into the Mormon church. Jared, who grew up Mormon and was active in the Hartley Park Ward in Gresham, was thrilled, sharing hugs all around, Jeff Fields said.

"I love my nephew," Jeff Fields said. "Jared was a good kid up until this point. I just don't know what it was that made him do what he did."

Padgett loved guns and enjoyed video games, like many boys. He also had a plan, intending to follow in the footsteps of his beloved older brother, Lucas Padgett, and join the military.

"Some kids at 15 years old, they don't even know if they're going to stay in their mom's basement," Jeff Fields said. "He knew he wanted to go into the military. That's more than some at his age."

Besides attending school, Jared Padgett's life revolved around his family, which pretty much kept to themselves, said Felecia Padgett. Jared especially loved being with his dad, Michael Padgett, Jeff Fields said.

His parents divorced in 2011, with Kristina Padgett surrendering primary custody of the two minor children, Jared and one of his sisters, to Michael Padgett.

Felecia Padgett said the divorce surprised the rest of the family.

"It was a shock to me," she said.

She said the five siblings, including Jared, were furious with their mother for leaving and even stopped talking to her, at least for a bit.

Felecia Padgett said she thinks Kristina Padgett may have left the family because she eventually found their lifestyle too restraining.

"I don't think she agreed with that type of life," Felecia Padgett said.

But the divorce does not explain his actions, Felecia Padgett said.

"It would affect any kid," Felecia Padgett said. "But I wouldn't say that a divorce would drive someone to do what he did," she said.

Jeff Fields said Jared's mother is devastated by his death.

"He was her baby," Jeff Fields said.

Michael Padgett is also in pain over the loss of his youngest child. In a letter hand delivered to KPTV (12) on Friday, he wrote that he and his ex-wife are at a loss for how and why the shooting occurred. The letter states they taught Jared and their other children the values of compassion, forgiveness, patience and love in Jesus Christ.

"These were all natural attributes we observed within Jared daily," the statement said. "Knowing that these are the values that we have taught our children, we are horrified and distraught by the actions perpetrated by our son."

At home, Michael Padgett set high standards, expecting his sons to be strong, Felecia Padgett said. He didn't want his children to fall into a bad crowd, turn to partying or experiment with drugs.

"My uncle was worried about his kids being influenced by the world," Felecia Padgett said. "He kept them sheltered."

He also encouraged them to play an instrument and develop their talents. He wanted them to succeed, Felecia Padgett said.

"You think you're raising your kids right," Jeff Fields said. "Now we're all totally heartbroken in the family now."

[Blaine]

Heartbreaking for the family....But, at the end of the day, I can't feel bad for killers...

[Bill in Oregon]

I can, when they are screwed-up 15-year-old boys.

[AJMD429]

I can sort of 'feel bad' for them in that they are probably 'troubled and hurting', but my sympathy stops once they start hurting others.

Still, the WORST damage is ultimately done by our social do-gooders and politicians, as they try to 'legislate away' the things these guys do. The do-gooders need to realize that you can't legislate away bad weather, nor blame those who carry an umbrella for the rain storms. The politicians need to quit using every bad event as a means of gaining power and money and votes.

[7.62 Precision]

Well, in this morning's Oregonian, we have a look into the family that produced the school shooter: a tight knit, loving Mormon family.

I never take this at face value. Every time someone commits a crime, family and friends say, "We could't have ever seen it coming, he/she was the model citizen etc." You can see the same pattern every time.

Here we have a tight-knit, loving Mormon family . . . . except divorced parents would not lead me to describe it as a "tight-knit family."

I used to run the prepress department at a printing company in that printed for a particular funeral home that handled the funerals for a lot of the less lawful citizens of the area. I used to compare what the families said about their criminally deceased to the actual events regarding their deaths. It was often almost humorous.

I remember one funeral program I laid out that had eulogized the dearly departed like this: "_________ was a loving son and father . . . . etc., all the stuff about being a productive, caring member of the community who will be missed by all . . . . . he was a faithful employee of (a local auto parts store) who was respected and loved by his coworkers, but he was an entrepreneur at heart and always strove to be financially independent. He died unexpectedly but peacefully at (a local hospital). We can only believe that his loving Lord needed such a pure soul with him in heaven more than we needed him on earth."

This was a guy in his thirties who had been arrested and convicted of numerous crimes, and had a few children by various mothers, but was not married. For several weeks he had been robbing Wendy's restaurants at gunpoint. The police began stationing officers to watch Wendy's restaurants, and sure enough, one day he walked into one they were watching, pulled his gun, and demanded money. The police challenged him, he opened fire on the police officers, and while he missed, they didn't.

It is rare to get a true picture of who someone really is by talking to the family.

[AJMD429]

I never take this at face value. Every time someone commits a crime, family and friends say, "We could't have ever seen it coming, he/she was the model citizen etc." You can see the same pattern every time.

Here we have a tight-knit, loving Mormon family . . . . except divorced parents would not lead me to describe it as a "tight-knit family."

Yep. There are times and cases where divorce is the only option because ONE of the couple was a total idiot, but even then, it is still not a 'normal, tight-knit family'.

I used to run the prepress department at a printing company in that printed for a particular funeral home that handled the funerals for a lot of the less lawful citizens of the area. I used to compare what the families said about their criminally deceased to the actual events regarding their deaths. It was often almost humorous.

I remember one funeral program I laid out that had eulogized the dearly departed like this: "_________ was a loving son and father . . . . etc., all the stuff about being a productive, caring member of the community who will be missed by all . . . . . he was a faithful employee of (a local auto parts store) who was respected and loved by his coworkers, but he was an entrepreneur at heart and always strove to be financially independent. He died unexpectedly but peacefully at (a local hospital). We can only believe that his loving Lord needed such a pure soul with him in heaven more than we needed him on earth."

This was a guy in his thirties who had been arrested and convicted of numerous crimes, and had a few children by various mothers, but was not married. For several weeks he had been robbing Wendy's restaurants at gunpoint. The police began stationing officers to watch Wendy's restaurants, and sure enough, one day he walked into one they were watching, pulled his gun, and demanded money. The police challenged him, he opened fire on the police officers, and while he missed, they didn't.

It is rare to get a true picture of who someone really is by talking to the family.

Of course the Mormons tend to like firearms (being chased and killed tends to do that to a group, although some of our modern-day American Jews seem to have forgotten that lesson), so that will be another thing we will see our legislators and media scrutinize.

Bottom line is - if you take a gun and start killing innocent people to 'solve' some real or imagined 'problem', YOU are the problem, and your BEHAVIOR is the issue - not your choice of firearm, the kind of car you drive, what family background you come from, or what your skin color is (or, for madman4570 - which 'drug' you use, if any). The news media and legislators THRIVE by dividing up the citizenry according to 'demographics', and they glean money and power by playing one group against another, but the only 'group' we need to fear is the 'group' that wants to initiate aggression. That is why many Libertarians choose that political party - their CORE belief is that it is always wrong to initiate aggression, whether you're citizen or government. They are definitely not 'pacifists', but they do believe in 'live and let live', much as our nation's founders did.

[7.62 Precision]

I heard an interesting comment on this topic yesterday, on public radio of all places. The guy is a reporter for Bloomberg News (we know where that bias lies), but he said that thanks to the media and the Internet, every deeply disturbed young man in America now has a template for how to destroy themselves and others ...

There are actually fewer school shootings than there used to be statistically, but the media makes such a big deal about them now that it seems like a growing problem. The worst thing is that these things are so publicized that they appeal to a certain type of kid as a way to do something big and memorable, to really punish those he feels slighted him, whatever his reason, he feels if he can make it big enough, he will get fame.

Now the kid who may have committed a crime, who may have shot a parent or stabbed a bully, or vandalized his school, all of which are serious crimes, is motivated to instead take a gun to school and try to outdo the last kid who shot up a school. Instead of shooting one person who he has a problem with, he tries to shoot everyone in the school.

[plowboy 45]

2ndonvc
I'm truly sorry I offended you.
This was meant as doc stated.
Bigbore seems to have proof the way I meant it.
Don't know where ADD was when I was a kid, but I do know where it was not ,at my daddys house.
Congregations on retireing at 50, I retired at 48, but I missed out on the money part.
AGAIN MY SINCEREST APOLOGY.

PLOWBOY

Just wanted to bump this over to page 2 so 2ndovc would not miss my apology, sorry if its in anyones way
PLOWBOY

[AJMD429]

Just wanted to bump this over to page 2 so 2ndovc would not miss my apology, sorry if its in anyones way.

One of the things about the internet, and most 'written' communication is that 'nuances' are not clear, and the subtle intonations and facial expressions we all use to communicate with are stripped from our typed (and often mis-typed, due to voice-transcribing, cellphones, and our own ham-handedness) messages.

[Blaine]

Just wanted to bump this over to page 2 so 2ndovc would not miss my apology, sorry if its in anyones way.

One of the things about the internet, and most 'written' communication is that 'nuances' are not clear, and the subtle intonations and facial expressions we all use to communicate with are stripped from our typed (and often mis-typed, due to voice-transcribing, cellphones, and our own ham-handedness) messages.

Hence, the Smiley....Or,

[Grizz]

There are actually fewer school shootings than there used to be statistically, but the media makes such a big deal about them now that it seems like a growing problem.

not to mention that the left wing school scam is so destructive that 4000 kids drop out of school EVERY DAY. I forget where I got that but I've seen it in several places, it's some dotgov output that they haven't covered up yet.

it is the school scam that is creating the shooters and the slaughterhouses. there's gonna be hell to pay one day.

[BrentD]

it is the school scam that is creating the shooters and the slaughterhouses.

Now, don't you think that is just a LITTLE over the top? Maybe one or 2 light years, give or take a dozen?

What purpose does it serve to blather such things?

[AJMD429]

...there's gonna be hell to pay one day.

I think we're there now, unfortunately. . .

[plowboy 45]

Seems like the schools do have a problem, or to say it very plain they have went to dung, round here anyway, and I suspect everywhere else.

[7.62 Precision]

I have an opinion, and I think there is something to it.

If you read about kids in the 1960's and before, basically from almost any source, and you will read about boys getting in fights.

I can remember hating some kid's guts when I was in school, and then getting in a good fight with him. A few bruises later, we were often good friends, or at least didn't hate each other any more.

Other times it was a bully, and while I may never like him, at least a fight, whether I won or lost, sent him off to bully someone he saw as an easier target.

One of the important aspects of childhood is learning how to navigate relationships and make the correct decisions in social interactions. We hopefully learn, by the time we are adults, that violence is a last resort and that a fistfight is not always the best way to settle an argument, but it is the fighting when we are young that teaches us these things.

When I moved to New York, I remember one thing that amused me was that there was a pond where fights took place. If a couple kids disagreed, they would arrange to meet there after school. They, along with maybe 50 spectators would troop from the high school to this pond, where they would shout at each other and push each other and dare each other to throw a punch. When they got the yelling and pushing and daring out of their systems, everyone would filter away and the argument was considered settled. At the time, I was amused by the fact that no one really got in a fight, but looking back, it was a way those kids had devised, probably without really considering it, to resolve disagreements without any real bloodshed or lasting hatred.

I remember when I was young that boys' fathers gave them pointers on fighting and advice on how to apply violence when dealing with a bully, etc.

Once when I was sitting in the principal's office (after another kid punched me unexpectedly, and then we were both pounced on by teachers, before we had a chance to settle it) my dad walked into the office and said, "The next time I get called to come here because you got in a fight, I want to see black eyes and bloody noses!" The school faculty was not amused, but I think there was something to it.

Now our culture abhors the idea of children fighting, and at the first hint of an impending fight, adults intervene. What I saw as a child, and still today, is that when young boys or younger teenagers are constantly prevented from solving their own problems with each other, the resentment and hatred grows. A kid that is taught not to resist bullies may one day become so frustrated that he handles the situation completely irrationally.

A kid that has never bean able to learn in a healthy way how to handle conflict, may brood and hate and overreact, maybe to the point of murder.

I think we cannot point to any one reason these murders happen, but there are certain factors that seem to remain the same in most of these shootings. Perhaps when a certain combination of factors can bring a certain individual to the point of making the decision to murder, and we see that many of these factors are repeated:

They are interested in previous shootings.
Most shooters are on drugs for some type of mental disorder, real or not.
They feel they have something to prove.
They want fame and notoriety.
Many feel bullied or inadequate without a way to deal with it.
Many come from broken homes.
Etc.

On the other hand, most of the "school shootings" used for the statistics are simply gang or drug violence that has spilled into the school from the surrounding community, and have nothing to do with schools, other than it was where the participants happened to be at the time.

[AJMD429]

7.62, I think you have a very good point.

[Old Ironsights]

Iirc, there was a study or two done after WWII to find out why the French of WWII were such wimps compared to he French of WWI and much of it came down to the feminization/overprotection of Boys by the Husbandless French Women.

Disturbed Surrender monkeys unable to cope with fighting (then end up blowing up) are also a direct result of Feminization/Pacification.

[Malamute]

Other times it was a bully, and while I may never like him, at least a fight, whether I won or lost, sent him off to bully someone he saw as an easier target.

One of the important aspects of childhood is learning how to navigate relationships and make the correct decisions in social interactions. We hopefully learn, by the time we are adults, that violence is a last resort and that a fistfight is not always the best way to settle an argument, but it is the fighting when we are young that teaches us these things...

I think one major component that hasn't been mentioned, and it reinforces your main point, is that when actual fights happen, kids learn that there are real consequences to their actions. Act, (or say something) and reactions occur. In todays world, kids are protected from the natural consequences of their talk and actions (or even getting dirty). In many schools, the modern thought is EVERYBODY gets an award, even if they didn't do anything, or came in last, everybody passes, everybody gets the easy way, grades mean little. Everyone is a special snowflake, everyone gets good stuff, everyone wins, no negative consequences for doing nothing, or being a jerk.

[plowboy 45]

7.62 I agree with your last post 110%, but someone's gonna come along and read it, and its gonna hurt their feelins cause their daddy didn't raise them this way, and their gonna cry and dog you for posting it.
You will be deemed a violent person, cause sense can't be beat into a person.
Wrong, they just wasn't beat hard enough, but they'll want to talk it out till they could wanta kill you.

[J Miller]

7.62,

I am from that time, born in 1952, and I will say without hesitation that your opinion is absolutely 100% correct.

Joe

[Griff]

7.62, you're SO right!

As a grade-schooler in the '50s myself, that's pretty accurate. Even for the private school I went to. Hell, just like the Navy when I was in... if you had a problem with someone and a teacher saw it... you were both dragged in, boxing gloves shoved on your fists, and into the ring you went. Nobody got hurt... you gained some measure of self-respect... no matter who "won"... neither of you really did, as you both got swats afterward from the Principal. The "instigator" of your little conflict, (or the bigger of the two of you, or older)... or who really dominated the "fight"... usually got a few more... maybe in some perverted fashion to "make-up" for the difference in size/age/bulliness (sp?), or ???

[7.62 Precision]

In todays world, kids are protected from the natural consequences of their talk and actions (or even getting dirty). In many schools, the modern thought is EVERYBODY gets an award, even if they didn't do anything, or came in last, everybody passes, everybody gets the easy way, grades mean little. Everyone is a special snowflake, everyone gets good stuff, everyone wins, no negative consequences for doing nothing, or being a jerk.

This is true. I often find myself standing back and keeping my mouth shut when one of my kids is about to make a mistake or do something the wrong way. It is important for them to fail and to try again, just as it is also important for them to succeed. I want them to fail and learn from their failures with things that do not matter in the long run, that are not very dangerous, and do not have dire consequences. I want them to learn what they need when they are 3 or 5 or 8, not when they are 18, or 26, or 30.

My three-year-old goes right up trees and I have to go up and get him out when he gets stuck. Sometimes I tell him, "you can do it, figure it out." Sometimes I talk him through climbing down, and sometimes I go up and get him. The result is, while he will always exceed his limits, he is gaining the ability to recognize those limits, and decide on his own if he has exceeded his limits or not.

There are several cartoons that my kids liked, DVDs that family members sent to them, like Bob the Builder, etc. After watching them a bit, I told my wife that I did not want my kids watching those movies. People are shocked by that, and can't understand why, but it is because in those movies someone always causes a problem, usually through disobedience or breaking rules, and there are NEVER individual consequences to that individual's actions. It is always the community that has to deal with and fix the problem, and the individual never faces any consequences.

Maybe it is intentional, maybe not, but that is not how I want my kids to view life. I want them to learn personal responsibility, not a dependence on the the community to fix their problems and mistakes.