OT Trains, history channel.

[Jay Bird]

Some of you guys may like this stuff, so here you go.
Around The Railroad
Extreme Trains Series Begins Tuesday
November 10, 2008 | 05:07 p.m. CST

An 8-part History Channel series, Extreme Trains, will air Tuesday nights at 9 p.m. CST beginning Nov. 11. Hosted by Matt Bown, train enthusiast and Pan Am Railways conductor, the program reveals the incredible inner workings and past lives of the amazing locomotives that haul huge loads across the country and deliver passengers to their destinations.

Three episodes feature Union Pacific. Shot at various locations across the UP system with the help of about 450 employees, the episodes focus on refrigeration trains, steam trains and the transcontinental route.

Here's the schedule:

Nov. 11. Coal Train. Host Matt Bown joins a coal train crossing Pennsylvania, from mine to power plant. Union Pacific's Bailey Yard also is featured.
Nov. 18. Freight Train. A freight train runs from the port of Los Angeles to Dallas/Fort Worth, passing through the searing heat of the Mojave Desert, New Mexico rainstorms, and an earthquake-proof trench that runs the length of downtown Los Angeles.
Nov. 25. High-Speed Train. A look at the high-speed Amtrak Acela running from Washington, D.C., to Boston, reaching speeds of 150 mph.
Dec. 2. Ice Cold Express. The crew follows Union Pacific's refrigeration train on its cross-country trip from Wallula, Wash., to Schenectady, N.Y.
Dec. 9. Steam Train. Matt rides Union Pacific's famous No. 844 on its annual outing from Denver to the world's biggest rodeo in Cheyenne, Wyo.
Dec. 16. Overnight Traveler. A look at the busiest passenger train in America, running from Seattle to Chicago.
Dec. 23. Circus Train. The longest privately-owned train in the world – the Ringling Brothers and Barnum & Bailey circus train.
Dec. 30. Transcontinental. Matt rides the busiest freight line anywhere – Union Pacific's line from Omaha to Sacramento – a route that crosses the world's longest rail causeway, through the world's largest rail yard, and over the Donner Pass. The episode also covers the building of the transcontinental railroad in the 1860s.

[Jarhead]

Cool...I like trains. I have a 1956 American Flyer S Gauge...Owned it since 1956

Here's a PIC of the Alaska Railroad heading south bound out of Anchorage...you might get a kick out of it.

[C. Cash]

Thanks Sixgun Jr! I will tell my oldest boy who is my train nut. We do all the train stuff back here that we can and have a lot of fun: East Broad Top, Strasburg, Gettysburg, Horse Shoe Curve/Altoona. We have been waitng a long time to see old K4 number 1361...hope it runs again at least on a limited basis. Thanks again.

[Rusty]

Since you brought it up, I have a question for Mr. Sixgun Jr.

I first heard it on a National Public Radio interview but I am now hearing commercials on the radio talking about the fuel millage that trains can get while moving large tons of freight across the country. I don't remember exactly what the claims were but it was something like 250 miles per gallon. Now I've seen the size of the pistons in those big locomotives and they look like 5 gallon buckets.

Without giving away any trade secrets could you enlighten us a little on this?

Thanks,
Rusty <><

[kemosabi45]

I set it to record
Thanks

[Cliff]

Fuel use in diesel locomotives can be very good. Depends on weight of train load, terraine, and speeds. I worked for the CB&Q back in 1964 in the laboratory in Aurora, Illinois and had the fun of going on a test run with some new locomotives GE was trying to sell the R.R. we ran from Omaha, Neb. to Sheridan, Wy about eight times with a dynamometer car testing their pulling power on hills (Big ones) and so forth. Some areas we could get around 17 miles per gallon. The diesels drive electric generators which drive the electric motors which pull the train. Learned a lot about them. Yes the pistons are big. The engines run a a low RPM and top RPM's isn't all that much more. The engines usually run 24/7 never shut down except for major maintenance. Big diesel engines you can almost hear the individual cylinders firing when set a dead idle. Gosh that was a long time back.

[Borregos]

Thanks for posting, that is something I don't want to miss, will also record it for two of my grandsons who are train nuts at the ages of three and four!

Jarhead, liked the picture, I've been on the Allaska Railroad, good memories!

[TedH]

Thanks for the heads up.

[Hobie]

More train guys! Mrs. Hobie and I like to ride the steam trains when possible. Better than models. Rode the Cass Scenic Railway at inception in 1961 and again last year (and a couple of times in between). Love those Shays. To think how they were designed, built and maintained before computers, even before slide rules...



The Durango-Silverton


Cumbres and Toltec


Branson Scenic Railway, AMTRAK Cardinal, and others as well.

[C. Cash]

Hobie,

Great pics! The Cass and Durango and Silverton are on our lists as well. I was just there at Durango and got some photos for my boy. Can't wait to ride that one with him!

This is my boy in front of 1 of only 2 K4's in existance. The other is very close to where we live.

[Jay Bird]

A heavy coal train burns 10to15 gallons per mile. at 16,000 tons.(up hill) They idle at 10 gallons per hour. Most train get 6gallons per mile. If you take a 7500 ton train, 500 miles you can move 1 ton of frieght 500 miles only using 1 gallon of fuel. A train doesn't move from piont a to piont b without stopping. It take around 20 to36 hrs to go 500miles depending on traffic. Confused?? It's hard to explain, because movement of trains is controlled hour by hour w/ traffic. So there is no exact mpg or gpm. Sixgun Jr.

[Wrangler John]

If you have access to the RFD Channel, you can watch Trains and Locomotives on Monday's 3:00 pm PST, 6:00 pm EST, or the repeat on Saturday's at 6:00 am PST, 9:00 am EST. Covers it all from steam, diesel, freight, passenger service including vintage "named trains" Daylight, Super Chief, etc. Also, traction lines, etc. I get it on Dish Network.

Being a train freak is a wonderful thing. Being poor I grew up near the tracks, so train spotting was a hobby. The San Francisco - San Jose commute run was powered by S.P.'s GS-4 fleet of 4-8-4 Northern's without the streamline skirts and painted black with a silver smoke box. I spent many pleasant hours perched beside the tracks watching the entire schedule roar past after school. The commute run was so demanding of locomotives the GS-4's were the only motive power that could handle it, until the 2,400 hp Fairbanks Morse Train Master's appeared. S.P. finally retired the GS-4's in 1957 with the last special run in 1958. I wanted to be a railroad engineer - my father was a marine steam engineer for Matson, so steam power must be genetic, but I came along too late.

Then in 1964, I went to work rubbing horses for Lurline Matson, who just happened to own one of the last private horse express cars operating in America. Had the good fortune to make four trips from Oakland, Ca to Louisville, Ky from 1965 through 1968 in that car. Made the final trips of the S.P.'s Overland Route (Trains 21-22) Overland Express-Mail, and one of the last trips of the City of San Francisco in 1968. We also made one of the last trips on the CB&Q's Post Office Express from Chicago to Omaha in September 1967, they were discontinued in November (a 100 mph knuckle biter on a mile long train. How those Postal workers sorted mail while hurling along is a mystery). Folks, I have to say that rail travel was always an adventure, with many incredible coincidences occurring along the way. My final trip was to a dispersal sale in 1970 with five boxcars fitted out for horses.

Trains are truly a delight, linking us together in a personal way not possible by airlines.

[slabsides]

Like Wrangler John, I was born and grew up for my first six years 'beside the tracks'. Everyone in my neighborhood worked for the RR (The Boston and Maine Line, as was.) Mr. Pope across the street was a long-haul engineer, as was his next door neighbor Earl Jones. I lived with Jones for a while, fostered by an 'engineer', that is to say a train driver. Two doors down, the only Negro (that's what they called themselves then, and so did we, RESPECTFULLY) family in our town lived: a senior conductor, of superlative class and dignity, and his two charming sisters, who raised rhubarb for the neighborhood kids to 'steal', and gave us sugar to dip the sour stalks in when we were 'caught'.We played on the station platform, pushing and riding big two-wheel mail carts up and down the bricks...and no one stopped us. Put pennies on the rails for the big locos to flatten. One cold Nov. night when I was six, my foster dad had yard shifter duty. He stopped his engine at the foot of our street, and the crossing guard (we had live 24-hour crossing guards in those days, mostly manned by retired trainmen) boosted me up into the cab. A delighted little boy rode and even sat on the throttle, briefly, up and down the yard, for a couple of hours. My life beside the tracks spanned the time of transition from all-steam to new diesel powered locos. The new diesels were mostly used for freight, then, the big 4-4-2 steam locos remained on passenger service.
During WWII, I was shunted back and forth from Mass. to Maine frequently; from age 8 on I took the trip alone. We knew all the trainmen, conductors; and candy butchers that roamed the aisles selling everything from sandwiches and snacks to ice cream, drinks and magazines for bored travelers. Even knew frequent fellow travelers, mostly traveling salesmen, who we saw repeatedly on our trips north and south. Had to stop at North Station in Boston and take a cab crosstown to South Station, to continue our journeys, as the trains didn't go through the city. I don't think they do to this day, tho I haven't taken a train trip now for over 40 years.
When I got out of basic in Texas, took a train back to Maine.Almost everyone else I knew opted to 'fly' home, as we had been flown to Texas to start our enlistments and would be flying abroad to our duty stations. I took the three-day scenic route: had a great time, met some fascinating people, and met what would be my best friend in the service then, as we ended up stationed together in Germany. Flying cross-country then cost twice as much as a train ticket, so I had some trip pay to put in my pocket, too.
Yeah, I like trains. Miss 'em. Since 9-11 has resulted in airline passengers being treated like criminals, I won't fly...even to the West Coast to visit my son. I suppose if passenger trains still ran as they used to, we'd be strip-searched before boarding and be required to 'show your papers, SCHNELL!' as plane travelers do now. This ain't what THIS veteran did his service for!!!!
Best regards to all fellow ex-service personnel, from yours truly!

[Mike D.]

I also "grew up' around steam locomotives. Big steamers of all types were left "hot" on the tail tracks next to my Grandmother's home, and we kids used to bribe the hostler to get in the cab and pull the whistle chain. I was gifted several signal and switch lanterns, including one with multi-colored lenses. Those were definitely the good old days.

My late Great Uncle was an SP Engineer for over 40 years, retiring in 1956, when steam was all but dead. His last runs were the Coast Daylight, train 98, between San Francisco and San Luis Obispo. The motive power was a GS-6 4-8-4. Only one of it's type survives today, and it is a static display piece in the National Transportation Museum, in St. Louis. I can remember him well, looking dapper in his striped engineers overalls. Tall and trim, he was quite a hand at running steam locomotives, but balked at "going Diesel", saying that it "took the work out of railroading". He had a long retirement, too, passing in 1987, at age 96.

[Jay Bird]

Those old lanterns are like old winchesters. They came be worth big dollars.
Thanks for all the stories.

[Hobie]

When we lived in Richwood, Durbin and Bartow the neighbor kids would go along the tracks looking for dropped coal to take home. I remember once waking in a sweat, from a nightmare, and heard the train going by and the crossing whistle. All was well then. Those were steam engines. I THINK they were Norfolk and Western engines. If you get a chance stop at the O. Winston Link Museum and Transportation Museum in Roanoke, VA.

[Mike D.]

It's a darned dirty shame that the N&W saw fit to "kill" both Class "A" 2-6-6-4 #1218 and Class "J" 4-8-4 # 611. Both were operating just fine until a few years ago when the powers that be at N&W determined that they were too expensive to run and dropped their fires, forever. I believe that both are at Roanoke, the place where they were built. From the cradle to the grave, as they say.

[Hobie]

It is something t see them in the shop. Sort of a ballet as the parts are moved around...

My grandpa worked as a mechanic in a roundhouse (and that is about all I know) until he tried to enlist at age 18 in 1918. Discovered he had TB (supposedly) and he went to farming while waiting to die in 1974... Still, it must have gotten in the blood somehow.

[Jay Bird]

,

[Wrangler John]

See, I knew it! Folks that like lever rifles have a romantic streak buried somewhere deep inside.

It's a streak that resonates with historical things, things of the past that appeal to the imagination, that sense of adventure, the innocence and promise of youth. It isn't just a man thing either, my wife loves the sound of train horns and steam whistles; they sound mournful, yet evoke images of wonder at where they're going and what business they're about. She enjoyed riding the Skunk Train, the Roaring Camp and Big Trees narrow gauge, the Sierra Railroad, the Laws Railroad Museum, and visiting the California State Railroad Museum - in fact she signed us up as members. She stood in the cab of U.P.'s Challenger 3985 while it was under steam at the Sacramento Railfair in 1981 completely amazed by its size and complexity. She blew the whistle and for a moment became a little girl again. The appeal of trains is universal.

I shall never forget the rumble and sway, or that cadence of steel wheels tapping out a rhythm on track joints, as our horse car ran along the levy beside the Mississippi River somewhere between Wisconsin and Iowa, bound for Chicago. We passed barges and paddle wheel tourist boats as night fell. City lights glimmered across the river, while fireflies sparked romantically beside the right of way, rising as if they were embers of joy dancing skyward. In the distance, summer lightning cleaved the humid night revealing rows of corn marching around whitewashed farm houses and silos, as if to mimic ghosts from a past age. I sat there on the edge of my bed, peering through the open door, sharing a passing vision of America with champion Saddlebred horses, while drinking in the allure of diesel smoke, fresh oat hay hanging in nets, that sweet essence of well groomed horses, the lingering aroma of new white paint gracing the car's interior, and that cloying perfume drifting in from river banks and farmsteads. While Eden's fair garden has long ago been denied us, I can attest that that night it came close upon me, leaving me to wonder what awaits in another heaven to come.

Enough of this, I ramble as age demands.

[brucew44guns]

From 1975 until 1978 I had a job in Eugene, Oregon that included fueling 3 SP engines that stayed parked in Springfield, a sister city to Eugene. These were older diesels that once were ones used to pull long freight trains, but had been relegated to be used as switch engines around the area, moving cars around the various sawmills and plywood mills. Each one would take a few hundred gallons apiece on M-W-F. I would stay by the hose off my tank truck to shut it down when full, but would listen to those big engines idle, feel the vibrations, look at the various parts on the engine as I stood there in the rain. Couldn't help but feel that I would have made a good engineer if that was the path I had went, it definately could get into your blood.

Couldn't help but think about Obama and Biden, last night, watching the History Channel segment on trains--covering the coal hauling. They want to bankrupt the coal industry, shut it down. Hard to imagine not having people in the streets if that were attempted, all those jobs and industry shut down?

[Jay Bird]

Couldn't help but think about Obama and Biden, last night, watching the History Channel segment on trains--covering the coal hauling. They want to bankrupt the coal industry, shut it down. Hard to imagine not having people in the streets if that were attempted, all those jobs and industry shut down?

Take away coal plants, mines and trains Millions of jobs lost.
Here in Colorado, if it were not for coal I wouldn't be working.

[DerekR]

My paternal Grandfather was a Engineer on the Illinois Central Gulf "City of New Orleans". He lived in McComb, Mississippi and ran from New Orleans to Memphis. McComb was full of ICG guys......they were a colorful bunch!

[C. Cash]

My Mom's Grandfather was a foreman on the Fort Smith and Western Railroad ca. 1880's-1920's....line ran through McCurtin, Oklahoma. Supposedly, he helped Bob Dalton get a job on the railroad at some point before the infamous holdup, and the two families were acquainted. From Oklahoma my Mom's family moved out to LA and then the San Joaquin Valley of CA.......the Daylight trains ran through there..would have loved to have seen that but I was not born early enough. Does the Freedom train still run(the FEF)?

[Kodiakk]

Saw the first show last night. Great stuff!

Liked the view going round the Horseshoe Curve, quite a view lookin back along the cars.

[ole pizen slinger]

Rusty,
When I went to work for the Southern Railway in 1973, I was told that a shot glass of diesel fuel would haul a ton of freight one mile and that is four times the efficiency of trucks. The locomotives now on line are more fuel efficient than when I first went to work.

Mark D,
I had the opportunity to run the 611 on its way to the museum in Roanoke. Steam pulled trains have a character of their own that is lost with diesels.

ole pizen slinger

[Mike D.]

During WWII my mom was a telegrapher on the MOPAC She still has her card and all the paraphernalia that went with the job.

[C. Cash]

Found her! (The Freedom Train 4449 "Daylight" FEF Northern)

http://www.orhf.org/

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Pacific_4449

[GANJIRO]

Growing up in post war Japan I have pleasant memories of commuting on trains with my mom and older sis (11 months older) visiting relatives in far off towns and in the country. The trains in the city were electric but the ones outside were diesel or coal/steam locomotives. I always recall the distant sound of train whistle blowing as I tried to sleep under the mosquito nets at my grandparents home in the country, fine memories of a better time. Train have always been very special to me. Was able to catch one episode.

[Peter M. Eick]

I caught the first show and as a lifelong train buff I was somewhat disappointed. They spent too much time on the non-trains stuff and less on the engines, cars and the practical part of the operations of the railroad. I will be looking forward to the 844 run. I have often wanted to go and videotape and chase that train up to Cheyenne.

[deafrn]

New poster, longtime lurker, and semi-retired FRN (the "polite" term for railfans on the C&NW) here. I don't photograph trains or collect much railroadiana anymore, but I still like to watch them when I get the chance, television included. I perk right up when the talk turns to engine size and fuel consumption...

The old first-generation EMD engines ("567's") had pistons that were 8-1/2" in diameter, and they went up in size as the subsequent models increased in bore (and stroke). The name "567" came from the measurement in cubic inches of ONE cylinder, so the total displacement of a 16-cylinder loco prime mover was considerable.

A retired engineer friend gave me a fuel consumption card that the Northwestern issued back in the early 1980's showing fuel consumption in gallons, and here are just a few examples from it: the old F7/GP7/SD7 locomotives with the 567 engine would burn 3.5 gallons/hour while idling, and 93 gallons/hr in Run 8 (full throttle). The newer, higher horsepower 645 engines in SD40 locomotives would burn 168 gallons/hr at full throttle. With "2 to 5 units coupled," the latter types would gulp 22 gallons/hr just idling and 670 gallons/hr with the engines giving all they had.

And I complain about filling the tank on my car!

A friend who is an MIC for a Class 1 says that the new engines do get more from a gallon of diesel fuel, and today's train handling procedures are much more fuel-conscious than the old days.

[bj94]

About train fuel usage-

I heard on Discovery or History channel that a train will ship a ton of freight for 1/3 the fuel use that a truck will use.

[Peter M. Eick]

It should be a lot better then that but I don't have the statistics to prove it.