Jeff Cooper speaks

[Kid Cossack]

"This little 94 Winchester in 30-30 continues to delight us. It is no 400-meter weapon, but 400 meters is a fanciful range for any but certain specialties. Out to 200 meters it does just fine, and that is the distance inside which the overwhelming majority of effective rifle shots are taken."

From "The Gargantuan Gunsite Gossip" Volume IX, November 13, 1989

[J Miller]

That man said a lot of things I agree with. Too bad he's not with us now.

Joe

[rjohns94]

hard to find truer words

[jeepnik]

That man said a lot of things I agree with. Too bad he's not with us now.

Joe

Oh but he is. As long as there are those of us who got the "word" from the master, he will live everytime we apply what we have learned. Sometime I wonder just how many good guys are alive because of his teachings. More than a few I imagine.

[Dave]

He is so right. The levergun in 30-30 is a perfected instrument.

[Kid Cossack]

You might be a Cooper Trooper if:

. . . . you like the 1911.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with a Weaver grip.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with an isosceles grip.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with two hands.
. . . . you think the .308 Winchester is a fine general purpose cartridge.
. . . . you appreciate a cut down .45-70 like the Wild West Guns Co-Pilot.
. . . . "Summer Special" means strong side OWB to you.
. . . . you remember when "Mordor" meant "The Soviet Union."
. . . . you have ever used the phrase "Condition White."
. . . . you know what a "Kansas City Special" or a "Chicago Special" are in terms of leverguns.

And boy howdy he could write.

[Ben_Rumson]

He liked the Savage 99 300 too... Interesting what he thought about the 99C...
See his remarks here
http://www.molonlabe.net/Commentaries/jeff7_1.html
scroll down to Department of Silly Statements

[Lawyer Daggit]

While he was an excellent shooter and teacher, he of the few true 'thinking' gun writers of the 20th century- a man who would apply intellectual thought to an idea or concept and develop it, rather than just regurgitating what others, and in particular gun manufacturers tell them.

May his teachings live on.

[Jaguarundi]

Yes the Guru is sorely missed.

[Alan Wood]

He liked the Savage 99 300 too... Interesting what he thought about the 99C...
See his remarks here
http://www.molonlabe.net/Commentaries/jeff7_1.html
scroll down to Department of Silly Statements

Thank you for the link!

[claybob86]

You might be a Cooper Trooper if:

. . . . you like the 1911.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with a Weaver grip.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with an isosceles grip.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with two hands.
. . . . you think the .308 Winchester is a fine general purpose cartridge.
. . . . you appreciate a cut down .45-70 like the Wild West Guns Co-Pilot.
. . . . "Summer Special" means strong side OWB to you.
. . . . you remember when "Mordor" meant "The Soviet Union."
. . . . you have ever used the phrase "Condition White."
. . . . you know what a "Kansas City Special" or a "Chicago Special" are in terms of leverguns.

And boy howdy he could write.

With the last one, you have tapped into my vast store of ignorance. What are those?

[Kid Cossack]

You might be a Cooper Trooper if:

. . . . you like the 1911.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with a Weaver grip.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with an isosceles grip.
. . . . you shoot a pistol with two hands.
. . . . you think the .308 Winchester is a fine general purpose cartridge.
. . . . you appreciate a cut down .45-70 like the Wild West Guns Co-Pilot.
. . . . "Summer Special" means strong side OWB to you.
. . . . you remember when "Mordor" meant "The Soviet Union."
. . . . you have ever used the phrase "Condition White."
. . . . you know what a "Kansas City Special" or a "Chicago Special" are in terms of leverguns.

And boy howdy he could write.

With the last one, you have tapped into my vast store of ignorance. What are those?

I may have misattributed Chicago to what should have been New York! The KC Special is a .44 Magnum '94 Trapper, and the NY Special is a .30-30 '94 Trapper, for use in jurisdictions which frown on sidearms.

[Machado]

I cherish this memento from Jeff Cooper. He left a void still unfilled.
Antonio

[Whit Spurzon]

"This little 94 Winchester in 30-30 continues to delight us. It is no 400-meter weapon, but 400 meters is a fanciful range for any but certain specialties. Out to 200 meters it does just fine, and that is the distance inside which the overwhelming majority of effective rifle shots are taken."

From "The Gargantuan Gunsite Gossip" Volume IX, November 13, 1989

I'm another Cooper fan. I suspect he's had a good deal more real life experience (and learned from it) than most gun writers.

Not sure I agree with the 200 yard limitation. Forum member Wind would be pitifully unchallenged at that range with his 30-30. Last month I filmed him taking on a 20" wide by 32" tall dinger at 500 yards, OFFHAND, iron sights. He put one on it on his second shot - the first was blown just right by the variable crosswind - and then he proceed to ring it repeatedly after that.

Here's the video; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiQGPmo3 ... RHAslEM5TA

Keep in mind that wasn't with a full power load, that was a 170 grain cast bullet over 10 grains of Unique. In my 30-30 that gets a fuzz over 1400 fps. He has enough (tang) sight to reach way out there - after the 500 yard dinger he took on a stump that was over 600 yards, probably more like 700... - give him a full power load and whatever he's shootin at better be outta sight or expect to get plugged.

Obviously not intending to imply it would be ethical to hunt game that way but targets and zombies would not fair well inside his horizon.

[Sarge]

I would tend to agree that the 94 is capable well past 200 meters, but having read a lot of Cooper over the years and corresponded with him a bit, I think you have to take his statement in context. Cooper's concept of riflery involved going from 'slung' to 'hit' in about the time it takes most of us to shake off a sneeze.

Viewed in that light, the 94 is indeed a 200 meter implement and properly sighted, it can make those hits without any histrionics on the part of the operator. That certainly mirrors my experience in the field with it, recreational shooting notwithstanding.

[buckeyeshooter]

I enjoyed his writing and have adopted many of his teachings.

[Blaine]

It was his opinions that influenced my getting a 45-70 or three....also, a couple 1911s.....

[TWHBC]

http://www.thesconce.com/

A site with Jeff Cooper's writings.

[Jaguarundi]

TWHBC thanks for the link .

[Ysabel Kid]

That man said a lot of things I agree with. Too bad he's not with us now.

Joe

+1 on both counts!

[FWiedner]

I continue to find it amazing that simple truths, simply stated, might have the effect of biblical revelation.

The Colonel had a true gift for profundity.

[JB]

I enjoyed some of his writings and I'd have liked to met the man, but never cared for his "my way is the only way" mentality. If you didn't carry a 1911 and a "scout" rifle, you didn't have the tools for the job.

[1894cfan]

How about a Win 94 Scout rifle?

[AJMD429]

How about a Win 94 Scout rifle?

Nah - it would never work. Wouldn't have enough versatility to meet the needs of hunters, ranchers, or locals needing to defend their turf from mauraders. Wouldn't be powerful enough, easy enough to handle, or have the range needed. Sights clearly inadequate. If any group were to try such a thing, the gun might be popular at first, but I'm positive it would be obsolete in a couple short years.

A good 'Scout Rifle' is a timeless concept of rugged simplicity and flexibility - something that should be useful for a century or more. The Win 94 could never do that.

[1894cfan]

How about a Win 94 Scout rifle?

Nah - it would never work. Wouldn't have enough versatility to meet the needs of hunters, ranchers, or locals needing to defend their turf from mauraders. Wouldn't be powerful enough, easy enough to handle, or have the range needed. Sights clearly inadequate. If any group were to try such a thing, the gun might be popular at first, but I'm positive it would be obsolete in a couple short years.

A good 'Scout Rifle' is a timeless concept of rugged simplicity and flexibility - something that should be useful for a century or more. The Win 94 could never do that.

I just knew I should never have done it, but too late now!
BTW, '77 94 is slicker than a hot knife through butter, LOTS smoother than a '41 94 thats hardly been shot that I bought last year.