OT-Double Rifles

[getitdone1]

Anyone here have a double rifle? Holland & Holland or Purdy? I could follow this with (Ha!) but might get surprised.

Just been looking at several brands and the Merkel double rifles are much less money than most. About 8500 for a 500 NE. A nice look'in gun!

I'd have to be sure I could sell it and at least break even or no such rifle in my life. I like the 500 NE cartridge. 3".

Would take a lot of knowledge but the way to deal in guns and make good money would be to deal in the pricey ones. For beginner no doubt a good way to loose a few thousand at the start!

Don McCullough

[Leverluver]

Don't own a double but have worked with the 500N fairly extensively. More power to ya, I have no desire for one of those things in a "hunting" weight rifle. Not many people want that large of a caliber (big recoil, big expense) so unless, like you say, a well known British company made it, you will have a tough time selling it and getting your money back. Of course, you could always find a good deal and make out on the other end when you decide to sell. Highly doubtful you could buy a Euro maker at new prices and then come out good when you sell. Good luck.

[TedH]

I have a Krieghoff Classic in 470NE. There are at least a couple other regulars here that have doubles as well.

[rjohns94]

I have two:

Chapuis 9,3x74R
http://s222.photobucket.com/albums/dd20 ... s93X74RDR/

Sauer 450/400


Ok, I have three:

12 bore paradox.



Love THEM!!!

[Rusty]

Rusty Jr. has said that he'd like to own one as well. He's not looking for anything quite that large. he was thinking along the lines of a .375 or so. I'm guessing one of those would set you back around $6K give or take a bit. I'd like to hear more myself just out of curiosity.

[Blaine]

Baikal makes some boxcar stout affordable doubles.. SxS and O\U

[Ravenman]

Don't forget the Blaser S2 Safari

http://www.blaser.de/index.php?id=241&L=1

[Leverluver]

http://www.cabelas.com/gun-inventory--- ... i-dx.shtml

They also make 9.3x74s and 45-70s for ~$3,000

They are starting to get out into folks hands and most are well satisfied, for the money invested.

[missionary5155]

Then there is the POOR mans double.
I reamed the chokes out of a Fox B 12 guage leaving .003 constriction on both barrels. Load .685 round ball with a curved inner base wab that matches the ball circumfrance. Powder to your choice.
I can gareentee a 40-1 round ball at 1500 fps will take down any critter about. Just have to keep your hunting to 50 yards for descent accuracy. Total cost was $350 and time.

[RIHMFIRE]

WENT TO THE RANGE A WHILE BACK..
AND THERE WAS A GUY WHO JUST BOUGHT, THAT VERY DAY.....
A MERKEL 500 NOTRO EXPRESS....FROM GANDER MOUNTAIN.
A REAL BEAUTIFUL RIFLE.....WELL... AFTER EVERYONE WAS DONE
DROOLING OVER THE GUN.....HE START TO SET UP TO TOSS
SOME LEAD DOWN RANGE....AT 11 BUCKS A SHOT...HOLY CR@&
SO ME AND DUFF-L-BAGG JUST STOOD THERE WATCHING
THIS GREENHORN .....HE HAD NO SANDBAGS, NO REST, NOTHING..
HE USED A BLOCK OF WOOD TO REST THE BARREL ON....
DROPPED DOWN ON ONE KNEE....STUCK BOTH FINGERS IN THE
TRIGGER GUARD....A DOUBLE TRIGGER MIND YOU.....DID NOT
GRAB THE FOREARM...TOOK AIM....AND PULLED THE FIRST TRIGGER...
AND OF COURSE THE BARRELS RECOILED TO A
45 DEGREE ANGLE....AND THE SECOND BARREL WENT OFF....
WHICH TOOK OUT THE BACK OF THE BARRIER TO KEEP
YOU FROM SHOOTING OVER THE TARGET MOUND...
IT WAS PRETTY FUNNY....BUT AFTER HIS INITIAL EMBARASMENT...
AND ABOUT 225 BUCK WORTH OF AMMO HE WAS SHOOTING
3" GROUP AT FIFTY YARDS...
THE MERKEL IS A REAL NICE SHOOTER.....BUT A 8500 SMACKERS....
AND 11 BUCKS A WHACK
I'LL STICK TO MY CHEAP STINKIN LEVERGUNS

[.45colt]

It would be Fun for sure,but if I had to have a heavy rifle to cover what the 45-70 won't do I would get a Model 70 in .458. We had one in the Family for near 20 years and I was always amazed how accurate that rifle was. with light reloads you could shoot it fairly cheap and fun, all the while keeping the solids handy in case a Buff pop's out from behind the target.
My BIL sold it and all the gear for $800.00 when I was broke. .
Good Luck with Your Quest. .

[rjohns94]

Chapuis doubles start around 4600 and go up. in the 9,3x74 you can get one for that and that is basically a .375 flanged round. I got my 450/400 for less, it is built on a sauer monoblock. I'm considering a Verney-Carron two barrel set , that will be considerably more. I tried the Russian made versions in both 30-06 and 45-70. good investment for what you get but you are limited in light loads for the 45-70. I was disappointed in their plastic sights. Look on www.nitroexpress.com forum. You can learn a whole bunch real quick. I think TedH's DR is the cats meow, the 470NE is a very awesome caliber and reloader friendly. At doublegun headquarters, you can get in on 20 bore REGULATED, at the factory for Federal ball rounds. The gun is called a BAD BOY. I will post a range report when it is delivered in August. Cost if preordered is $1750. The 12 bore version will be out next year. For NA, I can't think of a better set up than that for deer and hogs. The difference is, most shotguns are not regulated both barrels for slugs. They just aren't so its hit or miss in modifying a shotgun to shoot slugs. If you are going to do that, then use a shotgun with screw in chokes, back bored, and use screw in paradox rifle inserts for the last bit of the barrel. Even then, the barrels are not fully regulated but the spin given to the slug will stabilize it a bit more. The one at doublegun headquartes is made in Turkey right along side the Smith side by sides and is hand regulated for a particular slug.

[Remington40x]

I own one, a German guild double rifle, built on a clamshell action in the 1920s. It's a .250-3000, which is a fairly unusual DR cartridge (I've only seen four, total, two of which were Holland & Holland DRs with 6 digit price tags, the third of which was another German guild DR very similar to mine). They are a lot of fun, but it helps to have young eyes, which I do not anymore. I keep kicking around adding a set of claw mounts and a scope, but the cost to do so is almost half what I paid for the rifle.

Chapuis is supposed to be bringing out a small frame DR in calibers like 7x57R, 8x57R, .30-30 and 9.3x74R. The first three would be a lot of fun, but the last one a bit painful in a lightweight rifle. I've been trying to find the information on those Chapuis DRs, but have been unsuccessful to date.

[hammerman]

I was just looking at SAICE. They make a cool double rifle hammergun. It's gear torward Alaska hunting and doesn't come in the big boomers. I'd like to have one in 338 mag if I was going bear hunting in Alaska .

[Ravenman]

For the double rifle fans:
Chapuis
http://www.chapuis-armes.com/spip.php?p ... rticle=131
Sabatti
http://www.sabatti.com/lista.php?gruppo=2&categoria=5
Antonio Zoli
http://www.zoli.it/index_usa_2.php?pagi ... press.html
Krieghoff
http://www.krieghoff.com/ki/index.php?o ... &Itemid=84

[86er]

I have one that I made that is in 450 NE 3 1/4". I really like that cartridge for PH work. Even making the rifle cost me near $4000 once I bought wood, barrels and a raw action + materials.

The 450/400 is my favorite DR cartridge to shoot because it is mild and not too loud.

I have a Purdey in 360 Purdey but it is not a dangerous game rifle, it is more for plains game or a double stalking rifle. It costs more than a new car.

The Sabatti double rifles are a bargain. You can get one in 500NE for $4500 or a little less from Cabelas and some other places.

A hammer double rifle will be much less expensive and totally useful for a hunter but not appropriate for a PH. They tend to retain their value and fluctuate little.

I've had a Purdey in 375-2.5" that doubled in value in during the 10 years I had it. I paid around $6500 and sold it for $12,000 a year and a half ago. I've had a Westley Richards 450 NE that was restocked and cost me $8000 in 2004. In 2009 I sold it for $11,500.

A big deal with re-selling these and getting anything out of them is to buy low, make sure it regulates and you know the load it is regulated with, and any accessories like case or makers snap caps help it retain value. The British guns are more money but also have increased in value at a greater rate than Birmingham guns or continental guns.

A mainstream caliber is easier to sell but will command a higher price. If you get a 450/400 in 3 1/4" (instead of 3") or a 366, 475 Rigby or 475 WR it will be cheaper per quality for the same features than a 450NE, 470NE, 500NE for example.

Merkels are a good value but I don't think they are the way to go for an investment. Neither is a Kreighoff. A used WR or Thomas Bland in a mainstream caliber can be had for around $10K today and over the past two decades rifles that like have consistently gained 50% or more value over a 10 year period.

[getitdone1]

Thanks for all the responses. I'm gonna give all suggestions a look on the internet.

86er. Appears you have the knowledge to add to your income by dealing in double rifles. Of course you have but ever consider doing more of it?

My "thing" for the 500 NE is I like the looks of it and the big caliber. Of course the 475 #2 has a pretty impressive look too. One of the longest, I think. Read it's no more powerful than the 470 which I believe is the most popular. Also read with that big case of the 475 they can keep the pressures down with cordite and that ensured easy extraction during really hot African days.

As I said, I wouldn't have a big double rifle unless I could be sure I could sell it for at least what I paid. I have a double rifle expert along when I bought it. Would be nothing more than a toy--one that I'd enjoy.

I may have to start thinking about hunting in Africa before I get too old. The overall experience would mean more to me than the hunt. Kenya with camera and maybe hunt in Tanzania. I'm a big fan of the movie Out Of Africa. Read all of Capsticks books and several more about famous African hunters. Some very fascinating reading!

Don McCullough

[pshort]

Howdy,
I was just over at Cabelas looking around. They have a few Pedersoli double rifles, 45-70... Search for "pedersoli" and "gun library" section...
Looks like they go for around $3 g's or so.........

Paul

[Old Ironsights]

I still have an itch to re-line my old damascus double 16 to .45-70 (BP)...

[getitdone1]

Thought I might add--There's a beauty about a side by side double, be it rifle or shotgun. The simplicity, the lines--it's a feeling you acquire over time about them. Kinda hard to explain but I know many in this group understand.

Lots of smart guys with plenty of money like them since they sometimes pay 150,000 or more for one. There's an elegance about them even when they are not decorated with fancy engraving and gold inlays. Two fast shots and no more gives an aura of sportsmanship to them.

Near the bottom end of the double barrel shotgun category is the Savage/Stevens model 311 or sometimes 5100. A lot of gun for a small price.

Don McCullough

[Lawyer Daggit]

I used to have a Brno double rifle in 7x57R . It was an over under.

Never could get both barrels to shoot to the same spot, and as a result I got rid of the gun.

One problem was it was I imagine regulated with Sellier Beliott ammo you could not get here.