Win 1886 vs. Marlin 1895

[Old Shatterhand]

Considering to get me a .45-70 levergun, there is the choice between the Marlin 1895 and the Winchester 1886. The latter is also available in Browning and Pedersoli copies. Surely I would prefer an original 1886, but on this side of the pool they are as common as white ravens. However, there are the copies and the new Japchester versions - which cost about 50% more than the Marlin, and must be specially ordered. Are they worth that money and that waiting, or is the Marlin good enough? (1895 Classic)

Grateful for your opinions on this

Old Sh

(I have posted the same question in another forum, but I would really appreciate your advice too. )

[Blaine]

The Marlin is perfectly fine. The 1886 is classier, but weighs more and is hard to scope. I can't imagine a better big bore hunting rifle than a Marlin Guide Gun.

[fordwannabe]

It depends on what you want from it. If nostaglia and impressing your friends is the reason the 1886 is just beautiful. I f your gonna hunt with it and you are going to use it hard the marlin is a good piece and the price is right. I have a earlier 1895 and it is a workhorse with a smallish scope they are a good outfit. My opinion and probably worth exactly what you paid for it. Tom

[Tycer]

My answer:




The Marlin is a good gun, you won't regret buying it.

However, the 1886 is a jewel of engineering beauty. The action is stronger, smoother and prettier. It might be John Moses Browning's greatest work.

[KirkD]

I have owned both and both were great guns. What Tycer said.

[Huntermb]

I've owned both and would agree that you won't go wrong with either. I love my marlin for my hopped up moose and bear loads (been charged a few times), but my old original 1886 is still a dream to use for the rest of my needs.

[RDB]

Owned both as well. Also owned may '86s, original Winchesters, Brownings. Now own a lwt, "new" Winchester that I took the tang safety off. Love the gun. Enough to buy two.

Haven't owned an Marlin since I sold my Guide gun.

Save yourself the extra effort and heart ache, just order the '86 of your choice the first time around.

I had wanted a light weight, shot gun version for a long time. But unwilling to pay the original's prices today.

My high grade Winchester lwt is sweet. Enough so that I was willing to over look the trigger and tang safety which were both easy to fix. But if a '86 carbine or 26" rifle was your fancy I'd buy a Browning clone. Good luck!

[Blaine]

Owned both as well. Also owned may '86s, original Winchesters, Brownings. Now own a lwt, "new" Winchester that I took the tang safety off. Love the gun. Enough to buy two.

Haven't owned an Marlin since I sold my Guide gun.

Save yourself the extra effort and heart ache, just order the '86 of your choice the first time around.

I had wanted a light weight, shot gun version for a long time. But unwilling to pay the original's prices today.

My high grade Winchester lwt is sweet. Enough so that I was willing to over look the trigger and tang safety which were both easy to fix. But if a '86 carbine or 26" rifle was your fancy I'd buy a Browning clone. Good luck!

I'm ever so curious about the Heartache of Marlin ownership

[fordwannabe]

Owned both as well. Also owned may '86s, original Winchesters, Brownings. Now own a lwt, "new" Winchester that I took the tang safety off. Love the gun. Enough to buy two.

Haven't owned an Marlin since I sold my Guide gun.

Save yourself the extra effort and heart ache, just order the '86 of your choice the first time around.

I had wanted a light weight, shot gun version for a long time. But unwilling to pay the original's prices today.

My high grade Winchester lwt is sweet. Enough so that I was willing to over look the trigger and tang safety which were both easy to fix. But if a '86 carbine or 26" rifle was your fancy I'd buy a Browning clone. Good luck!

I'm ever so curious about the Heartache of Marlin ownership

yeah what Blaine said!

[RDB]

Most figure it out and eventually buy a '86.

If you don't, no worries on my part, just honestly answering the gentleman's question to the best of my abilities from personal experience and my own bias.

[Old Savage]

I like the Marlin better. In my opinion it is the best 45-70 available as is handles and shoots very well, scopes very well and is more suitable to all around use. I don't want to shoot any loads that are too hefty for an 1895SS Marlin.

[Ben_Rumson]

It’s clear that you want the 86, but I think the only way you'll ever know if the 86 is worth the wait is to get the easier to come by Marlin and also order your 86...Practically speaking...the flat top Marlin offers better sighting choices, be they irons or optics...Marlin has a great repair policy here.. Not sure which (86 or Marlin) would be faster to get repaired/service for on your side of the pool...

[Blaine]

Most figure it out and eventually buy a '86.

If you don't, no worries on my part, just honestly answering the gentleman's question to the best of my abilities from personal experience and my own bias.

WellSir, I have a USRAC 1886EL, shotgun butt, etc. It's for sale sometime when prices favor selling it. The trigger sucks, and I have had failure to fire on factory ammo, as well as my reloads. But, it's sure cool to look at

[Noah Zark]

I have three Marlins in 45-70:

- First year 1972 production "BO" prefix 1895 with 22" bbl and half magazine. Tackdriver.
- SS 1895 with 16/5" barrel and gray laminated furniture, PG stock and full magazine. I forget the "SD-something" suffix. It is not the "SDT," and does not have a cheesegrater for optics. I haven't shot it much, and it has the light-gathering fluorescent sights which are a little larger in diameter than I am accustomed to.
- 1895CB with 26" octagon barrel. Tackdriver.

I also own a Browning 1886 rifle with crescent butt and full magazine, the unadorned "Grade 1" vanilla flavor. Tackdriver.

Of the four, the Marlin 1895CB is probably my favorite. The wood is slim, and the rifle is "sleek" and handles like a much smaller rifle, even given the barrel length. I can carry it in the crook of my arm all day. With the 9+1 capacity in this lead dispenser I can't claim to being even remotely "undergunned." The mass of barrel hanging out there really stabilizes the sight picture, but the same can be said of the much more "zaftig" 1886.

On the other hand, the 1886 has that indescribably seductive "snick-snick" sound and feel of the 1886/1892 two-bolt action that is . . . indescribable. But it IS zaftig.

If I didn't get the Browning 1886 for the right price, I'd be perfectly content with the 1895CB, or the 22" half-mag. The 16.5" "Trapper" is too butt-heavy (Marlin got back!) for handling, and the furniture is beefy and checkered.

Noah

[tman]

What Tycer Said. Try to hold out for an 86 src. You"ll never look back.

[firefuzz]

I've had three Marlin .45-70s, all were good, accurate guns with jacketed bullets...only one of then would shoot decently with hard cast ones. None of them feed rounds as smoothly as the '86 does either. The Marlin is definately easier to disassemble to clean over the '86 and like Old Savage I won't load many rounds that the Marlin wouldn't handle with ease. BUT........

The '86 is truly a lever-gunners dream. Solid and heavy, the way a .45-70 or other heavy cartridge gun should be. The action on my Miroku clone is so very smooth, I can honestly say I can't tell the difference between working the action empty or loaded. The matte finish on mine is a turn off, but that's about to be taken care of and I really want to find a shotgun style stock for it....my heaviest loads are far, far below max but they're all I want with that cresent buttplate. Every time I go to my gunsmith he keeps waving a brand new set trigger assembly for an '86 under my nose....I'm thinking hard about that as it would include the expense of changing out the hammer too...which he also has.

I dont' want to scope a lever gun, YMMV on this. A good set of aperture and/or tang sights well get me as far off, out to 300yds or so, as I want to shoot anything with a levergun, I've got several good bolt guns with scopes if I need more range than that.

I tease the Marlin owners a great deal, and I hope it's taken as it's intended...good naturedly, but either of the guns would make you a fine rifle. But....ya never saw the Duke carrying a Marlin!!!!!

Rob

[M. M. Wright]

I have owned at least two of the Marlin 1895s and had no trouble with them. The micro-groove barrel even shot lead bullets well. I had an original Winchester 45-70 full magazine octagon barrel rifle that I foolishly let get away. Then there was the Browning SRC in 45-70 that I traded to a very good friend mostly because he wanted it. I even bought one of the current Winchesters in 45-90 that I didn't even get out of the gun show before someone bought it from me! Now I have an old Winchester 86 (1916 mfg) in 45-90 that I may be in love with. It doesn't like black powder or lead bullets very well but shoots 300 grain jacketed hollow points into around 2.5 inches at 100 yards. Redfield sourdough front sight and Marbles tang with the smallest aperture screwed in. I'll change the aperture for deer season but this one is going to the woods with me.
The Browning has by far the best fit and finish if that matters to you. The Marlins are far cheaper but look it. If you can find a Browning, buy it!


M. M.

[kimwcook]

I can't weigh in on the debate between the '86's, Marlin or Winchester/Miroku/Browning '86. I do have a Miroku '86 in 45-90 and I love it. It is heavy, but it sounds and feels like a piece you want in your hands. I don't care for the tang safety or rebounding hammer, but I haven't had a problem one. The tang safety is covered with a tang sight so I don't see it. I'll have the rebounding hammer system replaced some day. As soon as I can find someone who'll do it.

[RDB]

I have a USRAC 1886EL, shotgun butt, etc. It's for sale sometime when prices favor selling it. The trigger sucks, and I have had failure to fire on factory ammo, as well as my reloads. But, it's sure cool to look at

Cool to shoot as well. I'm in Issaquah. Both the trigger and light primer strikes are very easy to fix if you are inclined. Send me a PM if you want to fix it and need a little help.

If I lived out of the CON US I'd still make the same fixes to the tang safety Winchesters . Easy to get the parts and easy to do. Kim that goes for you as well if you want to get it done. And I thought everyone on here was from PA

We should have a WA lever gun shoot!! And fix your guns at the same time or at the very least shoot mine. Nice range 15 min from my place where we could do both...all day or till the ammo runs out!

[Sixgun]

I'm not going to analyze the pros and cons because after shooting tens of thousands of rounds out of each, I can say they are both great guns, but.........
the Marlin is a Chevy and the 1886 is a Cadillac.

[jeepnik]

Wow, this is getting almost as much attention as a 45-70 vs 444 thread.

First, shoulder both and see which feels better. Some guns fit better than others. Then decide if you really want to spend what an 1886 costs.

[Lastmohecken]

I have owned two of the Marlin 1985's and one Marlin 444. They were good guns. I owned one Winchester 1886 Extra Lightweight Japchester and while it was accurate, I hated that rebounding hammer and added top tang safety, and it eventually started misfiring. I suspected it was a problem with the rebounding hammer as others have figured out, but I traded it off, instead of fixing it, and that was before I started posting on this board, or done much research on it.

I now own an older Browning Saddle Ring Carbine 1886, Grade II, and I love it. Recoil seems less to me then the Marlins and I am keeping a recevier sight on it, anyway. I can't hardly see myself ever getting rid of this gun, at least not until I am too old to use it, but I will never buy another one of the later Winchester's with the rebounding hammer. Life is just too short for putting up with these lawyered up replicas.

[Old Savage]

Sixgun, I'll go with you on the Chevy/Cadillac comparison but ------- the Marlin is a Chevy truck.

[gary rice]

Cant disagree with any of the above. I first bought a marlin 1895 cowboy and love it, this romantic affair went on for about 3 years while all the time eyeing a browning 1886.. A few months ago I gave up and bought one, havent divorced the cowboy but boy do i love the browning, you will too.

[RDB]

-- the Marlin is a Chevy truck.

Remember to old '70's era Datsun trucks? Light weight, good milage, last a long time, easy to work on? Not something you'd think on keeping a generation or two.



You can dress them up but it is still a Datsun.

Never thought to ask but will a Marlin feed upside down or side ways? '86 is a true controlled round feed and will do so easily. Scopes or optic sights? On a LEVER gun? I'd give up shooting first.

The new Winchesters? Buy a Browing '86 hammer and sear and change them out...easily done. Plugging the tang safety isn't that hard, Just grind off the button and lock tite it in place till you can get it welded up. "If" you get it welded up

With the EL and take downs versions the extra effort (which isn't much) is worth it imo. Like everyone else in the world I too would prefer the original design.

[BigSky56]

Marlin makes a levergun never seen one , get a browning you'll smile every morning. danny

[SFRanger7GP]

I can't imagine being without both. I have one of the recent Winchester 1886 LT with the rebounding hammer. It was misfiring and the trigger was terrible. There is a thread here that tells how to fix all of that. I was ready to sell or trade it off before I followed those instructions. Now I love it. I just grew opposing thumbs a few years ago and it was simple for me to do.

I have one of the first 1895 Marlins when they went back to button rifling. It has dropped a ton of game with jacketed and cast bullets. I have a Leupold EER scout scope mounted on it with XS (AO?) iron sights. I think it is the perfect rig for night hunting hogs. I may replace it with one of the new 1895 SBLs. Better yet, just keep it and buy the other one!

[Old Savage]

This would be the Datsun, 357



and of course the Chevy Truck

[Old Time Hunter]

Kinda partial to these...even though I also have the other:

[Old Ironsights]

IMO it all depends on what you want it for.

I had Stainless Marlin when I was in Alaska. Wouldn't have any other for the kind of brush-beating, salt-water sloshing, bang around swamp/snow buggy kind of stuff I was doing then.

There's a reason Jim West works with the Marlin for his Brush Guns.

BUT, the 86 IS a thing of beauty. I'm just partial to Trucks over Limos I guess.

[firefuzz]

This would be the Datsun, 357

Hey, Hey now. Don't be puttin' down the .357. It's just a compact Caddy, in the right gun:






Rob

[Blaine]

Hmmmph....Ok, Everyone's rifle sucks except mine

[jeepnik]

Marlin makes a levergun never seen one , get a browning you'll smile every morning. danny

If that be true, drop the Sears catalog, and come out of the outhouse. That sorta think can make you go blind.

[rodeo kid]

For the money I don't think you can beat the classic 1895 Marlin in 45-70. I have one with a 3x9 Redfield scope and only have $625 total in it. Will work for anything you need to hunt. The 1886 is a fine rifle but does not do anything on a hunt that the Marlin won't. God Bless.

[Sixgun]

Sixgun, I'll go with you on the Chevy/Cadillac comparison but ------- the Marlin is a Chevy truck.

OS, I have my work cut out as it ain't easy arguing with an intelligent guy, especially one who has about 35 hottie women backing him up.

Chevy truck? Datsun? All J-U-N-K Those early Datsuns and most Chevy trucks rotted out before the last payment was made on 'em and that was when most people got a 36 month payment plan!

I guess this means most Marlins are shot out after about 1,000 rounds. I know I did that to a Marlin 336 .219 Zipper after 1200 rounds. Its OK though as I still have a near NIB back up.

Buy a Jeep Wrangler--it will last as long as an 1886

Hey, this is gonna get good---------Sixgun

[RDB]

How come Ed doesn't use one of those fancy, made in Alaska, stainless Marlins

http://z-hat.com/Stevenson.htm

"Ed also uses the Winchester Model 71 lever action converted to .450 Alaskan by the late Harold Johnson of Copper’s Landing, Alaska, the cartridge’s creator. The .450 Alaskan is based on the .348 Winchester case, straightened up some, or “Improved,” then necked up to .458 inch. While he has used a variety of bullets, lately he has been happy with the results obtained using the 405-grain Kodiak bonded softpoint driven in excess of 2,100 fps.

Another big-bore levergun that Ed frequently uses is a Browning Model 1886 .45-70, produced in 1992/93. These were first-rate, well-made rifles that are accurate and reliable. The factory rear sight was removed and an Ashley (now XS Sight Systems, Inc., 2401 Ludelle Street, Fort Worth TX 76105; toll-free: 1-888-744-4880; or www.xssights.com) rear peep installed, while the front sight was replaced with a HiViz green fiber optic for improved visibility in low-light conditions.

Like most folks who carry a rifle in the Alaskan bush, for years Ed kept a piece of electrical tape on the muzzle to prevent rain from entering the bore. Nonetheless , somehow water made its way into the .45-70 barrel and, upon firing, the last inch or so of the barrel split. (Ed suspected that water came in from the breech, then ran to the muzzle where tape held it in place, then froze.) Ed had the barrel (and magazine tube) cut to 201?2 inches, removing the damaged area, and the front sight reinstalled."

[BigSky56]

Jeepnik If you need a bucket rotorwash I can get it for you danny

[jeepnik]

Jeepnik If you need a bucket rotorwash I can get it for you danny

Yes, please. In those days, rotor wash was my friend. It kept the flames back.

[hfcable]

i like em both too [ and the 444 winnie ] and also like the original model marlin 1895 from ....1895.
but this one is my favorite, you've seen it before,:









the wood is not as reddish as my photos make it look. i have carried it [ carefully ! ] on a a number of hunts here in alaska.
a custom 1886; started with a browning, and copied a couple of guns from Madis winchester book.
some how i just prefer it to all others including originals, and it is extremely strong and accurate, very well balanced and fast handling, and smooth!

[BigSky56]

hfcable thats a nice 86 I prefer the short mag tubes on my levers that gun would sure work on elk in the dark timber. danny

[hfcable]

hfcable thats a nice 86 I prefer the short mag tubes on my levers that gun would sure work on elk in the dark timber. danny

thanks. hope to try that down there one day; i have a condo in bozeman, right next to MSU campus, and plan to spend more time there in the future. have shoot moose and caribou with this one, now need mule deer and elk with it too!

[BigSky56]

When you get down here come on over to the the NW corner and we will take the horses and chase elk & mulies. I missed the wilderness hunts this year trying to finish haying so the third week of this month I will chase elk probably down around dillon with my BIL and nephews. danny

[hfcable]

When you get down here come on over to the the NW corner and we will take the horses and chase elk & mulies. I missed the wilderness hunts this year trying to finish haying so the third week of this month I will chase elk probably down around dillon with my BIL and nephews. danny

you know that is an offer i cannot refuse.....one of these days i will be down that way for a fall hunt. i like to hunt old style with traditional gear. that sounds just wonderful!

[BigSky56]

Horses and levers is the way to hunt, depending on where I go either a 348 or 30-30. danny

[hfcable]

Horses and levers is the way to hunt, depending on where I go either a 348 or 30-30. danny

both great choices, and i like the old 38/55 lever guns too, and sometimes my 303 savage model 1899, and i have a nice 7x30 water model 94 that is so accurate................................................... dang it this list could keep getting longer and longer.

[KCSO]

I saw Tycer's photo and thought it was ME. That's my reply the 86 is IMHO much smoother than the Marlin. I wouldn't trade my 86 for 3 Marlins.

[KirkD]

Cable, that is a gorgeous, customized '86. I think if I sold all my originals, and got modern ones, I'd want to customize a sweet looking '86 as well. Love the half octagon/button mag/fancy wood.

[Griff]

...That's my reply the 86 is IMHO much smoother than the Marlin. I wouldn't trade my 86 for 3 Marlins.

+1

Sixgun/OS, the Marlin might be the Tundra or new Nissan equivalent... but it ain't a Chevy truck, unless you're thinkin' S-10... it and the others I mentioned are pretenders; not REAL trucks. I don't know from Ford, ain't ever owned one... but presently I have 3 Chevy trucks... of the... let me count 'em up... in order, startin' @ 16, a '59, '47 panel, '74, '72, '64, '88, '55-½, '03 & a '05! Yep, 9 I've owned... and nary a one of them ever left me on the side of the road; nor has one "rusted to nothing". They've been everything from ½-tons to 1-tons; the panel truck, being from Iowa, was the rustiest of the bunch! But, the little 292 cleaned up, a fresh coat of paint and some fellar in a Caddy had to have it!!! Shoulda asked for more than $2,500, but for a freebie, that ain't bad profit on a couple gallons of primer and topcoat... ok, and a few hours labor! Like they say, "LIKE A ROCK!"

Frankly, I wouldn't trust the new downsized 1895 with anything over Trapdoor loads.

[madman4570]

Considering to get me a .45-70 levergun, there is the choice between the Marlin 1895 and the Winchester 1886. The latter is also available in Browning and Pedersoli copies. Surely I would prefer an original 1886, but on this side of the pool they are as common as white ravens. However, there are the copies and the new Japchester versions - which cost about 50% more than the Marlin, and must be specially ordered. Are they worth that money and that waiting, or is the Marlin good enough? (1895 Classic)

Grateful for your opinions on this

Old Sh

(I have posted the same question in another forum, but I would really appreciate your advice too. )

Marlin is "good enough"
See if you can try a SS Marlin XLR from someone!

If you are totally hung up on (pure smoothness of operation) wait and spend the coin for a 86'(hopefully you get a none beat good one?)
If you want the stronger Lever of the two that shoots fine and is a lot cheaper then get the Marlin!
Consider with that Marlin and its ability to handle very stout loads and loaded up with the 400gr brass punch bullets you can litterly take any game on earth if you really have the desire. (Just kinda of an extra neat factor cool thing)?

If you can get a hold of the Book "45-70 Rifles" by Jack Behn (Fantastic read)Read it and judge for yourself?
That book as Elmer Keith stated will be the accepted standard treatise on the 45-70 along with Bill Ruger's praise of this book.
Strength wise comparing the two the Solid Top Marlin wins hands down At least my understanding of it!
Kinda like comparing a S&W 629 to the Ruger Redhawk?

Either one is a great gun! Good luck which ever you get!

[Mike D.]

I have never owned a 1895 Marlin, new or old, but do own a number of 1886s. I would like very much to find a real Marlin 1895 in .40-82.