POLITICS - Proposed IA Law: Sheriffs Shall Issue CCW Permits

don Tomás · Post by **don Tomás** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:41 pm

"...Dubuque county Sheriff Kenneth Runde said that won't work. He said if he knows someone in his community has assaulted his wife but never been convicted, he wants to be able to deny a permit..."

As a retired LEO, I had to re-read that above statement twice. Think that attitude might have something to do with Iowa folks wanting to become a "shall issue" state???
Tom

Sheriffs don't want to give up control of concealed gun permits

There was an outcry at the statehouse Wednesday from county sheriffs objecting to a bill they say would make it harder for them to deny permits to carry concealed weapons.

The bill changes Iowa law to say the sheriff shall issue a permit except for a limited list of reasons, including felony convictions and drug addiction. If a permit's denied a written explanation would be required.

Representative Clel Baudler, a Republican from Greenfield, says there needs to be more consistency statewide in issuing the permits. Dubuque county Sheriff Kenneth Runde said that won't work. He said if he knows someone in his community has assaulted his wife but never been convicted, he wants to be able to deny a permit.

Runde says:"And we're going to give people like that permits to carry? That's not gonna happen, and I won't give 'em to those people. Just because they didn't get convicted 'cause their wives wouldn't testify, doesn't give them a right to carry a gun that they may end up using in a domestic violence situation."

Dewey Hildebrandt is sheriff of Bremer County. Hildebrandt says there are some cases where people might not have been found by the courts to be mentally unstable or unfit, there are situations where the sheriffs know the individuals personally and they are not the type they would want to see carrying weapons.

Story County Sheriff Paul Fitzgerald said explaining why a permit is denied could interfere with criminal investigations. "Taking the discretion away from sheriffs who have the intimate knowledge is going to be a disservice to the people in those communities," Fitzgerald says. Fitzgerald says the responsibility has got to fall back into the the sheriff and the sheriff has to stand up on why he did not give the person a permit.

Representative Baudler, a retired state trooper, says sheriffs are protecting their turf. He cited an example of permits unfairly denied for no apparent reason, including a prison guard who was not allowed to carry a concealed weapon for private protection outside the prison.

Kansas Ed · Post by **Kansas Ed** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 6:04 pm

Hmmm...denial of rights based on personal opinion....anyone want to comment on past societies with this attitude?

Ed

TedH · Post by **TedH** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 6:55 pm

Sounds like that Sheriff needs to go. All states should be 'shall issue'.

No, scratch that. You shouldn't need a permit at all to protect yourself and loved ones.

Leverdude · Post by **Leverdude** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 7:47 pm

No, scratch that. You shouldn't need a permit at all to protect yourself and loved ones.

Yup,
And if permits are deemed necessary they NEED to be shall issue.

I was argueing with a mentally deficient guy yesterday that kept going on about they should be registered just like cars & motorcycles
.
I just said ok, thats fine. Convicted felons can buy & drive cars right? & drug addicts & wife beaters, hell anybody can register & drive a car.
Even better you dont NEED a license or registration to buy a car, just to drive on public streets. So a guy dont need a permit or to register his gun unless he wants to shoot it in the street right? You can carry it anywhere just like you can transport a car or bike anywhere as long as your not driving. Cars & guns are not in any way compatible & even tho your driving privilages are harder to lose they are not a right.

Anyway, no single person should be able to arbitrarilly deny permits because of speculation. Thats why we have courts. If you've not been found guilty your innocent. For Now.

Caco · Post by **Caco** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 9:01 pm

Hmm-Never knew anything about it an in my own yard??
Well you don't need to have a permit to carry to missuse a gun, just the availability. Sooo next guess the sheriff wants to determin who can own a gun based on his opinion

In Iowa the sheriff's vary widely from a shall issue attitude to counties where hardly anyone qualifies.
Dave

Leverdude · Post by **Leverdude** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 9:48 pm

Its similar here in CT Caco.
We have an appeals system tho thats very fair called the
"Board of firearm permit examiners" Its made up of normal civilians & to my knowledge, if your wrongfully denied & you appeal it you always get your permit.
The law here reads that the issueing authority (chief of police) can deny you if he doesnt think your a suitable person to have a permit even if theres no legal reason to turn you down.

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:06 am

Kansas Ed wrote:Hmmm...denial of rights based on personal opinion....anyone want to comment on past societies with this attitude?

Ed

Hmmm - sounds like that sheriff must be a Democrat!

Mike S. · Post by **Mike S.** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:39 am

The whole CCW permit thing still puzzles me. I live near the IA border and travel down there occasionally. My county sheriff gives me a card saying it's legal for me to have the gun with me here in MN, cuz I'm a law abiding citizen with a clean record, but if I drive a few miles south with it, I become a criminal.

Mike

Hairy Clipper · Post by **Hairy Clipper** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 6:48 am

I've don't see a need to issue a permit...the 2nd amendment says the right shall not be infringed...where is the need? It is granted by the Constitution.

Hairy

donw · Post by **donw** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:09 am

i agree with hairy clipper.

why should a person be denied a right based on someones elses "personal opinion"?

california is also notorious about denying a ccw because the sheriff doesn't like the way you part your hair, wear a ring on your pinkie, type of shoes you're wearing, your blood type etc...it should not be left up to them IF THERE IS NO LEGIMATE REASON TO DENY. if there is no legimate reason, a ccw SHOULD BE ISSUED.

it seems a bit odd...the constitution reaffirms the right to own a firearm but states may deny the right to carry one. they have the "right" to license something already deemed rightful to own...but not carry...

Hairy Clipper · Post by **Hairy Clipper** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:16 am

donw,

I hope you did not miss my point. The 2nd amendment says we do not need a permit from anyone, or any government to be armed and defend ourselves.!

Hairy

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:20 am

The Constitution doesn't grant anything. The Constitution, in the section referred to as the Bill-of-Rights, ACKNOWLEDGES and enummerates rights that existed before the Constitution was even written.