OT - !#^&#&@#! Car Dealers....

[Old Ironsights]

My little wagon died the other day. Just 184K old and just barely starting to burn oil and the dash catches fire.

SO I'm out car shopping.

I know exactly what I want, and I know how much I can afford (not much, but not unreasonable... after selling some stuff I can probably get into $5K.)

Why is it then that these morons won't listen and keep trying to sell me somthing I don't want at 3 times the price I can pay?

Why is it so hard for them to understand that I want a small, fuel efficient wagon for around $5000?

ARRRRGH!

[Sixgun]

Ironsights,
Don't feel bad about insulting car salesmen to their face. I have bought enough junk over the years to know that once you drive away, they forget who you are. One buddy of mine used to be a car saleman (now sells Kabota tractors) and he told me the dealership honchos will school them on how to take advantage of each of the personality types who come in to buy.
When you go to buy, tell him what you want and if he tries to sidetrack you into buying other junk, tell him to kiss where the sun don't shine and find another saleman. Do the same with him----------Sixgun

[Thunder50]

They don't make much money on the less inexpensive cars, so they try to sell you a much more expensive one so they can make more $$.

Went to find my daughter a car and trade in my old Cummins Dodge. Blue book is about $11K and they offered me $3K in trade!! Went elsewhere

[Rusty]

We went one time and after the guy took my car to have it appraised he came back and told me what it was worth. I said OK where's my keys? He said Oh I can get them. I said well get 'em NOW cause I ain't talking about anything till I get the keys back. He tried three time to talk a deal and each time I said hey I want my keys first. some times they're just dense.

[Hobie]

We went one time and after the guy took my car to have it appraised he came back and told me what it was worth. I said OK where's my keys? He said Oh I can get them. I said well get 'em NOW cause I ain't talking about anything till I get the keys back. He tried three time to talk a deal and each time I said hey I want my keys first. some times they're just dense.

I had a local dealer do that, with a vehicle they'd sold me. Wouldn't return the keys. I said I'd ask just one more time and did but no keys forthcoming, pulled out the wife's cell and he asked what I was doing and I told him, "I'm reporting the theft of my vehicle." Got the keys back then. The service department is great, the sales department, not so much. Go to Florida and Alabama with the dealers we've done business with before and the service is great! I think it all comes back to the attitude of the owner.

[Old Ironsights]

Ironsights,
Don't feel bad about insulting car salesmen to their face. I have bought enough junk over the years to know that once you drive away, they forget who you are. One buddy of mine used to be a car saleman (now sells Kabota tractors) and he told me the dealership honchos will school them on how to take advantage of each of the personality types who come in to buy.
When you go to buy, tell him what you want and if he tries to sidetrack you into buying other junk, tell him to kiss where the sun don't shine and find another saleman. Do the same with him----------Sixgun

Sadly, one of the sales people I've been talking to is my next door neighbor.

I may have found what I'm looking for though... assuming I can get to the West side of Chicago before it gets sold.

[spaceman spiff]

The guy that sold me my truck sends a Birthday card to my truck every year. I got that in exchange for a useful warranty, that naturally expired 1,700 miles before I needed it.

[wm]

I am no expert but let me tell you how I have done well......there is a Mitsubishi car dealership here in town and they hire a lot of recent Armed Forces Veterans (who seem to turn over pretty quick there while they go to the local university).

When I go in I always ask for the newest sales man, I explain to him I have little time to waste, I have X amount to spend and this is what I am looking for. Call me when you have something come in on trade (I always buy used cars).

I have never waited long or been disappointed.....something about that military background helps to cut through the BS.

Wm

P.S. I usually go back after 30 days, get the oil changed or tires rotated or whatever and take the salesman out to lunch as thank you for his service time and his helping get me into what I wanted.

YMMV

[petie]

Purchased a new Honda last April. Did it with emails. Found every dealer on Honda's website within 200 miles. Sent very descriptive emails to each with exact vehicle and equipment required and asking for final price only. No phone calls allowed. Amazing results - got over $6000 off of a Ridgeline at a dealer 90 miles away. Hondas don't get discounted much but there were some secret promotions going on that I found out about on a Honda forum. Will NEVER buy a car again by walking in and talking to a salesman - and I sold cars for 7 years for a living in the 70s. Was so easy. Have not tried used car purchase this way.

[Pete44ru]

[!#^&#&@#! Car Dealers....]

They always spoke well, of you !

[Gun Smith]

A car salesman will sell 200-600 cars per year. You buy ONE every 4-5 years. You don't have a chance to beat one at their own game.

[brucew44guns]

I would hate to think that every gun a man buys throughout his life, would carry the same bad memory and experience as most of the cars he will buy. Probably wouldn't be many gun collectors.

[jnyork]

I would rather be beaten with a stick that go to a car lot.

[spurgon]

Are private individual sales out of the question?

[Old Ironsights]

Are private individual sales out of the question?

No, but I haven't found what I want in the papers.

But I think I've finally found a couple of good prospects over in Chicago.

[rimrock]

I just bought a car for my teenager last week. Dealership asked me for $100 check to hold the car overnight while I did some research. Dealer only got the sales price , no warranty or financing when i bought the car. So, they decided to deposit my check even though my credit union had paid them in full for the car. They deposited my check just to see if they could get away with it (that's what I believe, and I'm, sticking to it). I happened to look at my account and saw the check had cleared. So, after having been rudely treated by their financeman, I was really mad, and let them have it. Told 'em I would (and plan to) file a complaint with the motor vehicle commission, and that I work for 14 lawyers (which is true). I did get a refund in today's mail. While I don't expect the motor vehicle commission to do much, dealership will get penalized because they'll have to have their lawyer respond to the complaint. I think I'll try the email purchase mentioned in an earlier part of the thread for my next car purchase.

[Travis Morgan]

A car salesman will sell 200-600 cars per year. You buy ONE every 4-5 years. You don't have a chance to beat one at their own game.

After being jerked around by dealers for a coupla days, we'd finally found my wife's next car. While we were out on the test drive, we decided to buy it. When we got back from the test drive, I noticed the window seal was flopping around loose. The salesman had let it slip that he hadn't sold a car in 6 weeks before this. When I pointed out the seal, he says, "Oh, you can fix that for under $35. " I said, "Bullshit, you fix it, or else." By then, we're standing in the showroom, in front of the rest of the sales team. He asked me, "You're seriously gonna walk over $35? " I replied, "It's been HOW LONG since you sold a car?" He fixed it out of HIS pocket and gassed it up.

[guido4198]

First thing to remember is you CANNOT insult a car salesman. Those people are trained to "take it" and, as has been pointed out, to use your own personality against you in any negotiation.Soooo...don't engage in a game that they have trained for, and ( for most of us...) we have not. For those reasons...I have found that the only way I've found to buy a car from a dealer is to decide what you will pay(always well below their asking price)...put it on a piece of paper with your phone number, hand it to the sales person and leave. You may "miss" a few this way, but you don't come away feeling like you've been greased and bent over.
Guido's 2 cents...

[meanc]

If you really want to tick off a finance dept/sales manager/salesman all in the same day... Try this.

I was having one of my cars custom detailed across the street from a dealership in which I had a really bad experience.

They sold me a Toyota Certified used car (came with a 50, 000 mile warranty), that actually wasn't a Toyota certified used car at all.

Went back and had to jump thru so many loop holes to get it straightened out with both the dealer and Toyota, but only with the help of the BBB

Anyway, I was stuck at the car wash for about 2.5hrs, so I ventured over to the dealership for giggles.

I told them I was looking for a new car under $30,000 and I only had 2 hours to get it done, as it was a gift for my wife.

I told them I wanted the Highlander that sat on the showroom floor, but they said it cost $36,000, so I told them to work on it. And they only had 2 hours to make a deal.

They came back every 15 minutes with an offer, for about 6 times, but I politely said no and told them to keep trying to find a way to make it work.

They gave me soda, ordered some lunch for me with their lunch order, even let me sit on one of their computers.

At about 5 minutes after the 2 hour deadline they came back to me with a $30,500 price.

I told them to look at the computer screen I was playing on, and there was an ad for a Nissan Murano for $25,000.

I told them I had to go, and without saying another word I left.

I bet I received 25 phonecalls from 5 different individuals over there, over the next three days.

[stretch]

Always remember - they've GOTTA sell a car to eat. You
don't have to buy one from them unless you want to. I've
had pretty good luck doing my homework and not taking
any stuff. They'll come down to your price -if it's realistic -
before they'll let you walk.

[Hobie]

Any auto salesmen on the forum? If you'd like to contribute but are, ummm, intimidated, just drop me a PM and I'll post your contribution as an anonymous posting.

[Pete44ru]

I sold rereational vehicles, and some cars, when I worked at an RV dealership from 1986 to 1992.

I somehow was able to take home over six figures, for each of those years.

I never used any pressure tactics, shady techniques, or bait 'n switch manouvers - yet outsold the rest of the sale staff by a factor of three.

I just treated folks like I wanted to be treated - I talked to them about their wants & needs, listened to what I thought they meant, then did a show 'n tell of whatever, explaining it's value in their terms, long before I would ever mention it's price.

Even so, I did, however, eventually experience "burn out", and switched career's to another field for a couple of years, before becoming a field rep for a CATV company.

The moral:
Before doing any kind of buying, do your homework.
Never buy on emotion (color/accessories/etc).
Always remember - There's more than one fish in the sea.

[tabingcolt]

iF YOU'RE IN THE $5000 range, avoid car lots and be shopping in the newspaper classifieds, and online used car sites. there's not enough profit in a $5000 car for a dealer to take it seriously. I know, I used to sell cars, new and used.

[bsaride]

Just had my daily driver die. I will never buy from a dealer if at all
possible. I did get a good deal on a new truck back in '82 because
I did my homework and shopped around.

I just bought a '96 Subaru AWD wagon for $2000, found it on
Craigslist. Going the non-dealer route I found better selection
and pricing on Craigslist. Ebay wes so-so, autotrader.com, etc
were worse. The $2K was max for my meager budget. And I
get paid on tuesday and hope to recover, lol.

Good luck,
Jay

[ccw9mm]

If you want to hunt down a car by fuel efficiency, check out: FuelEfficiency.gov. There are guides for each year of the past decade or so. On this site, you can also search for vehicles in a given model year by class of vehicle (ie, station wagons) or by fuel efficiency (MPG): click.

The Cars.com web site is good search tool. There are ~800+ station wagons currently advertised for sale within 250mi of Indianapolis, under $6K. Many will have reasonable fuel efficiency, though with high miles and possibly some maintenance lacking (given the low prices).

[Pete44ru]

[there's not enough profit in a $5000 car for a dealer to take it seriously. ]

Not necessarily, where I come from.

Keep in mind: An automoble/truck, retailing for $5K would need to have an ACV (actual cash value) to the dealer of no more than 60% ($3,000) - i.e. that's all the dealer actually paid for it on a trade-in, no matter what he told/showed the previous owner.
Any less difference/profit margin, and it will usually go off to an auction venue.

So, if the dealer "bought" the $5,000 vehicle "right", then it'll help pay the light bills, property taxes, non-commisioned employee salaries, etc, etc.

[PPpastordon]

My little wagon died the other day. Just 184K old and just barely starting to burn oil and the dash catches fire.

SO I'm out car shopping.

I know exactly what I want, and I know how much I can afford (not much, but not unreasonable... after selling some stuff I can probably get into $5K.)

Why is it then that these morons won't listen and keep trying to sell me somthing I don't want at 3 times the price I can pay?

Why is it so hard for them to understand that I want a small, fuel efficient wagon for around $5000?

ARRRRGH!

OI;
I am so relieved to know that used car salespersons have not changed since I was last forced to "confront" them. This also makes me remember why my last two vehicles came from individuals.
Good luck.
Grace and Peace.

[Old Ironsights]

Well, I think I got a pretty good deal.

1999 Escort wagon, just listed on the 22nd, 76,617mi from a well respected Chicago dealer for $4250 out the door.

Looks almost identical to my dead 95 Tracer - which I got in '04 with 149K for $2100.

Half the milage for twice the price. I guess it works for me.