Interest in 22 hornet...

[GonnePhishin]

Have been looking up info on the 22 hornet round and find it interesting. Does anyone here have any knowledge of any leverguns chambered in this caliber, or is it just a bolt action cartridge? Does anyone reload 22 hornets here? Any thoughts, comments pro or con would be welcomed.

[gamekeeper]

I had a CZ 527 full stocked rifle in .22 Hornet, nicest little rifle I ever owned but Jr lusted after it so much I gave it to him.
Great round for foxes, quiet and accurate.
If Ruger would chamber their lever action in .22 Hornet I would buy one straight away.

[arjunky]

Never seen a lever before. Always wished Ruger would have made a 96 in one. I bought a Savage 40 years ago with all the brass and bullets to build a load, but haven't had time to play with it yet.

Byron

[SJPrice]

The Hornet is probably one of the best single shot small caliber centerfire cartridges ever. Whether that is a break action like a TC Contender or a Handi- Rifle or it is a falling block like a Ruger No 1 or a scaled down Sharps etc. Like this one from Dakota Arms.

For mid-range varmint hunting, it is mild shooting, relatively quiet and accurate. The only problem with it is that you need to take your time when reloading ad the neck of the brass is a little on the fragile side. My opinion only, YMMV

[Borregos]

I have three Hornet barrels for my Contenders (two 10" and one 14"), they all handle 55gr FMJ bullets pushed out with 10gr of IMR4227, deadly accurate

[Chuck 100 yd]

The Hornet is a great little cartridge if you don't expect bench rest accuracy out of your varmint rifle.
Many owners have given up on them due to their (normally) poor accuracy compared to other varmint cartridges. If you are happy with 1 1/2 to 2" groups at 100 yards then the hornet is a very good choice. If you want super accuracy,keep looking.
There are rifles out there that are the exception to the above but few and far between.

I know I will get burned for saying that but I have to report my true beliefs.

[pdentrem]

I have a Ruger #1B in Hornet. It is likely my best shooter other than my 6mm PPC in a bolt.
Pierre

[Pete44ru]

.

Never a lever, in .22H - but plenty of break-open single-shot rifles like the Handi, the Savage 219, & the T/C 's - and (obviously, above) the Ruger & Browning LoWall falling block singles.

My Savage 219B




Microscopically better than Hornet performance can be had in a levergun, however - Like a .218 Bee Winchester & Browning/Miroku Model 65's & a Marlin 1894 (IIRC).



.

[jnyork]

I have a CZ 527 American , which is a very accurate little rifle especially since I discovered Lil Gun powder, 10 shot in 1 1/4 to 1 3/8 easily done. For anyone having accuracy problems with their Hornet, Lil Gun might very well be your solution.

Here is a Savage 23D from the 1930's , the scope is an elderly Weaver K-10 from the 50's. I also have the original Lyman receiver sight that came with it. The checkering , ivory inlays and grip cap were done by a fellow who was a stockmaker for Weatherby back when they were in Southern California, or so was related to me by the original owner, and I had no reason to doubt him. Lady in a local jewelry shop who knows of such things told me the ivory is real. Shoots almost as good as my CZ, any prairie dog within 150 yards is meat in the pan.

[Thunder50]

Have had 3 of them. A Ruger #1A which I sold too cheaply, a Savage 340 (haven't shot that one, planning on sellling it too) and my NEF, which I am keeping. Both the Ruger and the NEF will go about 7/8" using Lil Gun and 40gr Vmax bullets. Sold the Ruger 'cause I found a #1s in 218 Bee. Didn't need 2 smallish 22 centerfires

[1886]

The Hornet is a great little cartridge if you don't expect bench rest accuracy out of your varmint rifle.
Many owners have given up on them due to their (normally) poor accuracy compared to other varmint cartridges. If you are happy with 1 1/2 to 2" groups at 100 yards then the hornet is a very good choice. If you want super accuracy,keep looking.
There are rifles out there that are the exception to the above but few and far between.

I know I will get burned for saying that but I have to report my true beliefs.

My experience too. I gave up on a custom 77/22 Hornet. It shot OK, just not up to my expectations. If you reload, I believe primer selection is crucial. There is minimal neck tension due to a very thin case neck. Lil'Gun is a great powder. Not to go in a different direct, I am lusting after a CZ 527 American .221 Fireball. WOW!! 1886.

[jnyork]

The Hornet is a great little cartridge if you don't expect bench rest accuracy out of your varmint rifle.
Many owners have given up on them due to their (normally) poor accuracy compared to other varmint cartridges. If you are happy with 1 1/2 to 2" groups at 100 yards then the hornet is a very good choice. If you want super accuracy,keep looking.
There are rifles out there that are the exception to the above but few and far between.

I know I will get burned for saying that but I have to report my true beliefs.

My experience too. I gave up on a custom 77/22 Hornet. It shot OK, just not up to my expectations. If you reload, I believe primer selection is crucial. There is minimal neck tension due to a very thin case neck. Lil'Gun is a great powder. Not to go in a different direct, I am lusting after a CZ 527 American .221 Fireball. WOW!! 1886.

I had what was probably the first 77/22 sold in Wyoming. Boy was I happy, what a nice looking little rifle, couldn't wait to go to the range with it. What an AWFUL disappointment, despite screwing with it for over a year, I could NOT get it to shoot, 4 inch 5 shot groups were about average. Friend had the exact same experience with his. We went to the gunshow in Casper one time and both of us traded them off and good riddance to them.

[Mike Armstrong]

Hornet is a good short range varmint cartridge, and can be loaded down to .22WRM ballistics or lower for edible small game.

It was never made in a REPEATER lever action because it is too long for the Win '92 and Marlin '94 actions. The .218, based on the .25-20 WCF case, was made specifically to fit those actions.

I've had Hornets in single falling block, single break action, and bolt action models. The one I liked the best was a single shot bolt action custom made many years ago on a US Krag action, a serious tack driver. The next best was a single shot falling block made on a BSA Martini Cadet action.

I replaced Hornets with the .22 WRM some years ago. I like that cartridge because it can be used in both a rifles and revolvers, but it doesn't match the Hornet ballistics--it is ballistically almost identical to the .22 WCF, the parent case of the Hornet, tho.

All my Hornets (5 of them) responded well to handloading and were plenty accurate for the ranges I used them at. The factory ammo was not accurate at all in some of them. And NONE of them liked the SAME handloads best. It can be a picky little round! Probably one reason it was replaced in the 1950s and '60s by the .222 Remington, NOT a "picky" little round at all.

[Chuck 100 yd]

1886 , The .221 Fireball is an excellent little cartridge. Shoots almost any load you feed it and extremely accurate in either rifle or handgun.

[GonnePhishin]

Thanks for the info fellas. I did some further research on the 22 hornet and maybe it wasn't chambered in a lever gun d/t pointy bullets?? Thanks Mike Armstrong for your input as to why no lever actions chambered for this round. Also, I like your Savage 23D, jbyork!, and have also read about thin neck problems 1886-thanks for confirming this.

I see savage, ruger and cz all make bolt actions for this cartridge. If I decide to go this route it would probably be one of these -the CZ is especially nice looking.

[Rusty]

I would think the best you could do if you want a levergun would be a BLR in .223.

[Pete44ru]

.

I had a CZ-527 Lux in .22H that was prety nice & accurate also.

The good-looking part came after I had fellow forum member rbertalotto (aka: Roy) do his magic, removing the delta-shaped TG webs & shortening the magazine to a flush fit.



.

[Mescalero]

Ream it to K Hornet, and the whole ball game changes.

[1886]

The Hornet is a great little cartridge if you don't expect bench rest accuracy out of your varmint rifle.
Many owners have given up on them due to their (normally) poor accuracy compared to other varmint cartridges. If you are happy with 1 1/2 to 2" groups at 100 yards then the hornet is a very good choice. If you want super accuracy,keep looking.
There are rifles out there that are the exception to the above but few and far between.

I know I will get burned for saying that but I have to report my true beliefs.

My experience too. I gave up on a custom 77/22 Hornet. It shot OK, just not up to my expectations. If you reload, I believe primer selection is crucial. There is minimal neck tension due to a very thin case neck. Lil'Gun is a great powder. Not to go in a different direct, I am lusting after a CZ 527 American .221 Fireball. WOW!! 1886.

I had what was probably the first 77/22 sold in Wyoming. Boy was I happy, what a nice looking little rifle, couldn't wait to go to the range with it. What an AWFUL disappointment, despite screwing with it for over a year, I could NOT get it to shoot, 4 inch 5 shot groups were about average. Friend had the exact same experience with his. We went to the gunshow in Casper one time and both of us traded them off and good riddance to them.

Again not to take this thread off topic. The early 77/22 Hornets had a twist that was appropriate for heavy for cal. projectiles. Lighter projectiles were pretty much hopeless. 1886.

[earlmck]

I have a couple of single shots I've loaded for many years: Borschardt in regular hornet and low-wall in K-Hornet. The real beauty of the hornet is as a cast bullet platform. That wonderful long neck and just the right case capacity to achieve about all the velocity you want out of a cast bullet makes this round perfect. But as Mescalero says, "ream it to K-Hornet and the whole ball game changes". Yep, for a minor gain in velocity with jacketed bullets you give up a lot of cast bullet flexibility and ability.

I don't know how Ruger fouled up on the 77-hornet but I haven't heard of anybody getting great results from them. I once thought I should have one but too many stories out there along the lines of jnyork's experience persuaded me otherwise. That CZ, however....

[AJMD429]

I would think the best you could do if you want a levergun would be a BLR in .223.

I have a Marlin 1894 in 218 Bee, and it is a sweet little gun. Haven't shot it for accuracy yet, but am accumulating the components for a reloading session or two someday.

Ream it to K Hornet, and the whole ball game changes.

I've heard that from others, as well.

I have a Ruger 77/22-Hornet, and a Savage 22 Hornet, and both are 'nice', although I like the Ruger better as far as how it is built.

I'm thinking of reaming out the Ruger to the K-Hornet, then selling the Savage and funding a 17 Hornet with the proceeds...

I might sell the Ruger and re-barrel the Savage, but probably won't do either one for awhile due to so many other things going on.

[pdentrem]

With my Ruger #1, I settled on 12 grs of W296, Hornady 40 gr VMax, CCI-BR4 primer. 1 to 1 1/4" groups most days.

A departed friend had a Martini 12/15 converted to 22K-Hornet and his load was the same except 12.5 grs of W296. Sub 1" most days with the Martini. I am still jealous. I want that Martini!
Pierre

[Mescalero]

I don't think enough K Hornet work and cast bullets has been done to form an opinion ( for me ) but I may just be uninformed........................ as is often the case.

[Streetstar]

Just saw an article in the recent Shooting Times anout a MAgnum Research chambered in .22 Hornet --- was a good looking thing with stag grips and such

[Larkbill]

Hornady New Dimension dies with the floating bullet seater pretty much eliminated crushed cases during that operation for me, I have Contender barrels in 10" and 21", and an M6 in Hornet over .410.

Did Marlin build the Levermatic in Hornet? Seems like a natural with the box magazine. Still kicking myself for not buying my brother's Levermatic in .256 when he sold it.

[rock-steady]

I had a Ruger M77/22 Hornet for a while. I bought it brand new when they first come out. It shot OK with the 45gr SP bullets. I killed six whitetails and two wild hogs with it. I did find a load that shot .5" five shot groups at 100yds. I used the Sierra 52gr BTSP, H110 and a small pistol primer. I had to seat the 52gr bullets too long to fit in the magazine, so I shot it as a single shot for years. Then I had a great idea....why not sell the Ruger and get a single shot Handi-Rifle? So I did and put a 6x - 24x scope on the homely little Handi. Any crow within 300 yards is in mortal danger. I'm back to using the 45gr SP's and Lil'Gun in the Handi. That reminds me....I'm low on .22 projectiles.....time to see what Midway has in stock....

[firefuzz]

My first experience with the .22 Hornet was a H&R Topper with a full length stock. Had a 4x Bushnell scope on it and would shoot minute of tin can as far away as you could see the can. My Dad made a head shot on a female coyote at 237 long steps by putting the tip of the bottom Duplex on the top of her head. Traded that gun for a pretty slick 1100 Remington and have regretted it ever since.

My next Hornet was a Savage 219 that had a 3x9 Bushnell on it. Got it as boot in some trade and never got to shoot it. Sold it to a co-worker a couple of days after I got it. He owned a dairy and was having a bad time with a pack of stray dogs killing his calves. According to him it's a dog killing machine out to about 100yds, which is as far as he's going to try a shot at.

I now have a Remington 799 mini mauser (same gun as the Charles Daly). Boy was I P.O.ed when I found out it had a pressed and pinned barrel. Couldn't get it to hold a group inside a 3lb coffee can. So I rebidded the action and free-floated the barrel and now the 'lil beast will group an honest 3/4" group with almost anything. Got a little 2x7 Leupold rimfire scope on it sighted in 3" high at 50yds. It's my walk around coyote gun, I weighs about 7.5 pounds loaded but balances so well it feels like 4 pounds. I've yet to shoot at anything over 150yds, but I've never missed a 'yote with it out to that distance. These guns are hard to find now and if you start looking for one and even as well as this one shoots I'd suggest spending a few extra greenbacks and getting the CZ.

Got another Hornet barrel for a H&R Topper I'm looking for a cheap action for and I've always lusted after a Winchester 43, but cost will probably prevent me ever owning one of those. Probably punch the H&R out to .22 K-Hornet, afraid to mess with the Remington.

Rob

[GonnePhishin]

Thanks firefuzz for your information. Hard to believe they made that mini mauser with a pinned barrel. Stay warm down there.

[1886]

I previously mentioned I believe the Hornet is very primer sensitive, read brisance, due to the case neck walls being so thin. Neck tension is minimal at best. If I were to revisit the Hornet, I would try the Fed. 200 primer for ball powders and the Fed. 100 for extruded powders. 1886.

[North Country Gal]

The Hornet is a great little cartridge if you don't expect bench rest accuracy out of your varmint rifle.
Many owners have given up on them due to their (normally) poor accuracy compared to other varmint cartridges. If you are happy with 1 1/2 to 2" groups at 100 yards then the hornet is a very good choice. If you want super accuracy,keep looking.
There are rifles out there that are the exception to the above but few and far between.

I know I will get burned for saying that but I have to report my true beliefs.

Nothing wrong with stating your honest beliefs. We should all do that.

That said, I have a 14" Contender Hornet pistol that will consistently shoot any factory stuff, even the cheap stuff, under an inch at 100 yards and do even better with hand loads. Have to actually make an effort not to get under an inch with this one. Had a Ruger 77/22 Hornet that took much more work to get to get under an inch, but got it done, though average, across the board groups size was more in the range you describe. Traded it for a CZ 527 Hornet, my present Hornet rifle, and it does what the Contender can do, right out of the box.

The Hornet is a great little cartridge, basically akin to a reloadable 22 mag, as some folks have described it. The counterpart in the lever gun world has traditionally been the 218 Bee or 219 Zipper. Have never seen a Hornet in a lever gun, though. You might try looking for a lever gun in the Zipper or Bee, but, be warned, those are hard to find and pricey when you do. Same for brass and ammo compared to the Hornet.

[model55]

With the way things are here I'd gladly have one since 22lr,22mag is scarce.Then I could load copper as well.

[carbluesnake]

Used to have a Sav.340 in Hornet and presently have a CZ527 in Hornet. Years ago I glass bedded the Sav. and it shot the lights out. 1/2 inch groups at 100 yds. My CZ shoots 1/2 inch groups at 50 yds. I had a 6X Weaver on the Savage and a 2X Leupold on the CZ. I have settled on 9.5 gr. 2400, 45 gr. sp, and Rem. 61/2 primers. The Rem 71/2 won't shoot as accurately as the 61/2 primer. One of my first rifles was Win. 22 K Hornet. Check out C.S. Landis' book, Twenty-two Caliber Varmint Rifles for some good nostalgia. The book was written 1947. Landis writes that the cartridge was developed by Reuben Harwood in 1894. He used a duplex load of Dupont #2 and FFG semi-smokeless powder topped with a 48 gr. type-metal bullet. A 22 Hornet cartridge was listed in the #6 Ideal Handbook. Winchester Repeating Arms listed the 22 Hornet in 1923. Dupont's #1204 and #80 powder were favorites in the Hornet.

[windy]

i'd like to say you can get the same out of a 22 savage hipower, but i haven't done enough messing around with the lighter loads to back it up. still, for a levergun, the savage has lots of promise, provided you have one that hasn't been taken down too often and gotten sloppy. my friend mike nesbitt convinced me that you don't need .227's or .228's to make it shoot straight; .224's the right shape and size will do. heaven knows what kind of accuracy the cast boolits will get; haven't tried 'em yet, but i'm drifting that way, as soon as i find one of the molds for it.
mind yer topknots!
windy

[AJMD429]

The Hornet is a great little cartridge if you don't expect bench rest accuracy out of your varmint rifle.
Many owners have given up on them due to their (normally) poor accuracy compared to other varmint cartridges. If you are happy with 1 1/2 to 2" groups at 100 yards then the hornet is a very good choice. If you want super accuracy,keep looking.
There are rifles out there that are the exception to the above but few and far between.

I know I will get burned for saying that but I have to report my true beliefs.

Nothing wrong with stating your honest beliefs. We should all do that.

That said, I have a 14" Contender Hornet pistol that will consistently shoot any factory stuff, even the cheap stuff, under an inch at 100 yards and do even better with hand loads. Have to actually make an effort not to get under an inch with this one. Had a Ruger 77/22 Hornet that took much more work to get to get under an inch, but got it done, though average, across the board groups size was more in the range you describe. Traded it for a CZ 527 Hornet, my present Hornet rifle, and it does what the Contender can do, right out of the box.

The Hornet is a great little cartridge, basically akin to a reloadable 22 mag, as some folks have described it. The counterpart in the lever gun world has traditionally been the 218 Bee or 219 Zipper. Have never seen a Hornet in a lever gun, though. You might try looking for a lever gun in the Zipper or Bee, but, be warned, those are hard to find and pricey when you do. Same for brass and ammo compared to the Hornet.

One other option to consider is the 17 Hornet - it seems to be more accurate (I don't have any of the 'same' guns in both chamberings, but I have 22 Hornet in a Ruger 77/22H, older Savage bolt action, and Contender pistol, and the Contender seems most accurate but none are spectacular, and a 17 Hornet in Contender carbine length, and so far the 17 is quite a bit more dependable in terms of accuracy).

I figure the 17 HMR is zippier and more accurate than the 22 WMR, so it makes sense doing the 'same thing' to their bigger center-fire cousins would also have the same effect.

I know when I read about the rimfire Winchester 17 Mag it seems silly if you can get a reloadable-case 17 Hornet instead.

[JB]

The Hornet is a great little cartridge if you don't expect bench rest accuracy out of your varmint rifle.
Many owners have given up on them due to their (normally) poor accuracy compared to other varmint cartridges. If you are happy with 1 1/2 to 2" groups at 100 yards then the hornet is a very good choice. If you want super accuracy,keep looking.
There are rifles out there that are the exception to the above but few and far between.

I know I will get burned for saying that but I have to report my true beliefs.

That's my finding as well. Neat little cartridge, but the 223 if far more accurate, more powerful, far cheaper factory loads, and easy to load down if you don't want full power.

[AJMD429]

That's my finding as well. Neat little cartridge, but the 223 if far more accurate, more powerful, far cheaper factory loads, and easy to load down if you don't want full power.

I always wondered if those 'light' 223 loads that would be down in the 'Hornet' range and much quieter and less muzzle blast, are as accurate as 'real' 223 loads...? It seems some cartridges are super-accurate when loaded down, yet others only at their best when pretty warm loads are used.

[Steelbanger]

I have fired thousands of 22 Hornet rounds at metallic targets. I used two Contenders for NRA Silhouette, one scoped and the other open sights. More accuracy than you would ever expect. I was so impressed with that tiny cartridge, after years of reading how inaccurate it was, that I bought a rifle barrel (21") to use on a rifle stocked Contender. I sometimes used it to hunt turkeys and bagged a few with it, the longest kill was around 200 yds. When NRA Hunter Pistol shooters started to lose interest I sold all my Hornet equipment but I sure miss those highly accurate barrels and my thumb hole laminated rifle stock.