Rossi .454 question

[JR5]

I have recently taken an interest in Rossi lever actions. I am particularly curious of the .454 caliber. Am I correct in assuming that this model would handle both the .45 colt and the .454? Any information you might share would be appreciated.

[Hawkeye2]

I didn't have any .454 brass and couldn't get any a few years back when I got mine. Loaded .45 Colt Starline brass with 2400 and Hornady XTP, no feeding issues at all. Don't remember the load but it was 2400 and just short of a max load.

[gundownunder]

I don't own one, but all the threads I have read suggest that you have the same problem as shooting 38 spl in a 357 or 44 spl in a 44 mag, and that is that the chamber needs a real good scrubbing after shooting a large amount of the shorter cases.
I have also read a number of threads which suggest that the 45 colt rounds don't offer the best accuracy in a 454 chamber.

[Pete44ru]

.

If you're looking at a used .454 Rossi M-92, you might want to check that it's a gun that includes the upgrades that Rossi had to add to the early .454's. (A new gun should have the upgrades)

The earlier rifle's magazine tube would get pulled forward under recoil, tying up the gun; so, for newer rifles, Rossi threaded the magazine tube into the receiver front wall, and (IIRC) set up the magazine to load from the front end.

The nice thing, I found out about .454's, for a non-handloader, is that the Winchester 250gr factory loads are great mid-range loads, for game as light as Whitetail deer - being about halfway in power between strong .45 Colt (+P) loads & full-power (300gr) .454 loads.



.

[AJMD429]

.

If you're looking at a used .454 Rossi M-92, you might want to check that it's a gun that includes the upgrades that Rossi had to add to the early .454's. (A new gun should have the upgrades)

The earlier rifle's magazine tube would get pulled forward under recoil, tying up the gun; so, for newer rifles, Rossi threaded the magazine tube into the receiver front wall, and (IIRC) set up the magazine to load from the front end.

The nice thing, I found out about .454's, for a non-handloader, is that the Winchester 250gr factory loads are great mid-range loads, for game as light as Whitetail deer - being about halfway in power between strong .45 Colt (+P) loads & full-power (300gr) .454 loads.

What he said.

Mine (3) do Feed 45 Colt fine, but I don't shoot them often due to potential 'crud-ring' as mentioned above. However a good scrubbing with a rotating motion should remove the crud.

Orer Starline brass direct from Starline or from MidwayUSA or Graff's or whoever now as it is a 'seasonal' production so when it come out it is rapidly snapped up.

I have several threads on here and on the Rossi forum about mine. Just search for 'Casull' with 'AJMD429' as author.

search.php?keywords=Casull&terms=all&au ... mit=Search

I am definitely NOT the forum expert on the 454 Casull, nor the Rossi, and the only reason I have three is I originally assumed I wouldn't want a 16" due to recoil, and I snapped up the first 20" I came across, plus kept vascillating on 'stainless vs blued'.

As one of my threads says, Rossi's are not perfect guns out of the box; for that be prepared to spend twice as much. Their customer service turned out to be good.....I can't say that for the ammo manufacturer I had factory rounds with brittle cases though.

Especially if you have 45 caliber handguns, the Rossi 454 makes a nice companion levergun.

I actually prefer the 'tube-loading' option it gives, since I can quickly and safely unload before entering home or vehicle, even with winter-gloved hands. Same to keep legal if crossing roads.

[JR5]

Gosh fellas THANKS for all the good info. There is a lot of food for thought here and you bring up thoughts and suggestions I would have never considered.

I guess my interests lean more to the .45 Colt, but I wanted the extra oomph if I needed it (primarily thinking larger black bears).

Certainly my Ohio hunting can be accomplished with the .45. Is my memory correct-- that there is a factory, forward scope mount system (for long eye relief scopes) available for these rifles?

I was captured by the idea of stainless steel and a 20 inch barrel. I currently have a couple of '92 AE Trappers in other calibers and was looking for a change. I do reload and assumed

that the .454 receiver would provide a margin of safety on a hotter 45 colt load. (Not typical inclination, but it's always good to keep your options open).

Thanks Again
Jack

[Pete44ru]

.

XS Sights (google) has a "LeverScout" mount (meant for a Model 94, but will fit a Model 92) that utilizes the rear sight dovetail slot to anchor the (Weaver-type) rail's forward end (provided that the dovetail slot is about 4" from the front of the receiver) - but will require D/T two 6-48 holes atop the front receiver ring, inline with the bore, in order to anchor the rear end of the rail.


.

[JR5]

Thanks Pete44ru your information has been very helpful.

[AJMD429]

I believe all the 16" Rossi lever guns have holes drilled and tapped for their 'scout scope mount', although the holes are nicely concealed under the factory rear sight shaft.

Likewise, I'm pretty sure all the octagonal 24" ones are pre-drilled and tapped for a tang sight.

[Panzercat]

I have recently taken an interest in Rossi lever actions. I am particularly curious of the .454 caliber. Am I correct in assuming that this model would handle both the .45 colt and the .454? Any information you might share would be appreciated.

Don't assume this. Mine did not reliably feed 45lc. Real Guns experienced the same issue with their rifle as well. I've seen testimony that some do, tho I consider this the luck of the draw more than anything.

[Panzercat]

I have recently taken an interest in Rossi lever actions. I am particularly curious of the .454 caliber. Am I correct in assuming that this model would handle both the .45 colt and the .454? Any information you might share would be appreciated.

Don't assume this. Mine did not reliably feed 45lc. Real Guns experienced the same issue with their rifle as well. I've seen testimony that some do, tho I consider this the luck of the draw more than anything.

Late edit now that I'm off work-- Link to Real Guns Rossi .454 review. The most relevant part from Part 2 is quoted below--

Below are five common 45 Colt factory loads L-R: Barnes, Hornady, Black Hills, Buffalo Bore, and Winchester. The only round that could be side receiver loaded, fed, chambered, and fired normally was the center cartridge... Black Hills Cowboy ammo.

*picture here

1) Didn't side load, didn't feed to chamber 2) Side loaded, didn't feed to chamber 3) Side loaded and chambered 4) Side loaded and chambered 5) Side loaded, didn't feed to chamber. If you look closely, you'd notice the cases with an exposed case mouth had the problems. In all cases, the 45 Colt round was released from the guide rails prematurely, which caused the case rim to drop low on the bolt face, while putting the cartridge at a steep angle, which caused the case mouth to hang on the top radius of the rifle's chamber. The Barnes fed one round through the rifle's loading gate, but the wide hollow point hung on the entrance to the magazine, preventing any additional rounds to be loaded. Rounds that would not feed were single loaded by hand and all fired normally.

This pretty much mirrors my experiences with 45lc in this rifle to a tee. Sidegate loaded, failed to feed, jammed on the upperside of the chamber. Let me dig around a bit... Ah, Here we go. Reaching back to 2012 for this--


Critical fault position. Jammed.


Condition of rounds upon being removed.


But I'd be remiss to note not everybody has this problem, it's going to be your call.

[BigSky56]

With the 92 frame in 45 colt you can use a gamer load to 50K load I run a 14K load and a 30K load all usable in my pistol too. If you get a 454 just down load it to 45 levels and tricking it out to shoot 45 and 454 might cost you some hide if it malfunctions dealing with a bear. danny

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

....................................
Critical fault position. Jammed.


Condition of rounds upon being removed.


But I'd be remiss to note not everybody has this problem, it's going to be your call.

If those are your rounds part of the problem is the crimp. A roll crimp works better for these guns.

[Panzercat]

If those are your rounds part of the problem is the crimp. A roll crimp works better for these guns.

Not sure the crimp accounted for driving the nose of the bullet into the upper chamber wall at such an angle where it would not feed, or the four other types of ammo with the same problem as mentioned in the article, but it's a moot point. I was thoroughly unimpressed with the quality of the product and let somebody else who was fine with just a 454 rifle deal with it. I chalk it up to Rossi quality control more than anything.

[Griff]

I guess my interests lean more to the .45 Colt, but I wanted the extra oomph if I needed it (primarily thinking larger black bears).

Certainly my Ohio hunting can be accomplished with the .45. Is my memory correct-- that there is a factory, forward scope mount system (for long eye relief scopes) available for these rifles?

I was captured by the idea of stainless steel and a 20 inch barrel. I currently have a couple of '92 AE Trappers in other calibers and was looking for a change. I do reload and assumed that the .454 receiver would provide a margin of safety on a hotter 45 colt load. (Not typical inclination, but it's always good to keep your options open).

Thanks Again
Jack

Jack,

There are no differences in the .454 Rossi receiver and the .45 Colt version, except for: provision for the mag tube to screw in to provide more retention, as early ones jumped the screws upon recoil.

I have a 45Colt Rossi, it feeds everything from 250 grain slugs down to 160s. And, I can run them using 44Mag minimum to mid load data. Since the same gun is chambered in 44 mag, loading my 45 Colts using this data is, IMO, perfectly safe; even if I were getting the same pressures as the 44Mag. Which I'm not, as the 45Colt is just 'that' much larger, so pressures with the same data 'should' be just 'that' much less! I keep some of these loaded as self-defense, hog, or bear loads, just in case I ever get that invitation! I sorta consider these loads as my 45Colt+P loads. They're kept well away from my toggle-link rifles and my Colt SAAs and clones.

But for the Rossi 1892 and the Browning 1885 in 45Colt, they're plenty of 'big medicine' in a small package! both Lyman's 49th Reloading Handbook and Lyman's 4th Ed. Cast Bullet handbook list loads specifically for the rifle in 44Mag and 45Colt. Both rounds were fired in Winchester 94AEs. 20" 1-16 twist for the 44M and a 16" 1-38 twist for the 45C. I've yet to chronograph my 45Colt+P loads from the 20" Rossi to know for certain, but I believe I'm getting around 1400fps for the 240JHP.

86er borrowed my 1885 in 45Colt to test some of Buffalo Bore's 45Colt+P loads in it's 24" barrel... and IIRC they were clockin' in the neighborhood of 2000fps... I believe these are the 260HP advertised as 1800fps. And as noted on their site, safe for the Ruger Blackhawk and similar sized handguns as well as the Winchester 1892, 94 & Marlin 1894 carbines.

It's my opinion, that these loads will do anything a 38-55 will do, PLUS leave a larger HOLE! We're talking "45-Gov't" load performance... in a smaller delivery package!

[1886]

I purchased a stainless trapper length Rossi .454 earlier this year. It is meant to be a companion to my 4.2" Redhawk .454 conversion. Mine seems to be a solid rifle. I do not have much trigger time with it. The overall fit and finish is quite good. The action is smooth and it feeds anything from SWC .45 Colt loads to WFN 360gr hardcast .454 rounds. It is a light and handy, powerful package. Recoil is considerable and that is to be expected. It is not perfect and I will get around sending it to Steve for some massaging and upgrades/improvements. I have had good luck with Rossi 92s. I would not buy one without being able to test it for functionality with the projectiles I intended to employ. I believe Rossi has discontinued the .454 again. If you want one, start your search soon. They do seem to have a following. Good luck with your decision. 1886.

[Panzercat]

I believe Rossi has discontinued the .454 again. If you want one, start your search soon. They do seem to have a following. Good luck with your decision. 1886.

Any source attributable to this? Just curious, because the success stories make me want to try it again.

[1886]

I believe Rossi has discontinued the .454 again. If you want one, start your search soon. They do seem to have a following. Good luck with your decision. 1886.

Any source attributable to this? Just curious, because the success stories make me want to try it again.

This info came from Rossi. I was told model R92-57011 may stay in production. There are currently some .454 models available on Gun Broker. 1886.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

This link is to the 2015 catalog.

ROSSI 2015 FULL LINE CATALOG

Toward the bottom (Page 17) is the product list. The 454's aren't there.

That said, if you go here;
ROSSI USA LEVER ACTION RIFLES
The very first gun listed is the 20" stainless 454.

At one time this same website showed a 24" stainless octagon in 454 !!!!

Who knows

[JR5]

Thanks one and all for your sage advice. It is sincerely appreciated. I was originally looking at an internet type of purchase.
After reviewing all inputs here-- I believe I will look for one I can actually put my hands on. Also I have .45 colt dies, bullets, etc.
and believe that will be adequate for my hunting/shooting purposes.
Thanks again.
Jack