Beavers in the UK

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:33 am

Not enough yet for you to send over any "Free Trappers"

Beavers have been born in Britain for first time in 400 years - on an exclusive housing development.

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The 12 kits are flourishing at the 550-acre Lower Mill Estate near Cirencester, Gloucestershire - a sustainable luxury home complex designed by 30 of the world's top architects.

Experts believed six beavers introduced there three years ago had bred in January, after noticing tell-tale signs. But no-one had seen the kits until now.

Lower Mill Estate owner Jeremy Paxton brought three pairs - called Tony and Cherie, Gordon and Sarah, John and Pauline - to Flagham Fen Lake in 2005. Beavers were hunted to extinction in the 16th century because their throat glands were thought to be medicinal.

Estate spokesman Alistair Bankier said: "We are very excited - these are European beavers and not as aggressive as their American counterparts. People who live around the estate began to see the kits so we asked a professional wildlife photographer to camp out to get proof.

"It is difficult to spot them - you need to be there between 4am and 6am to capture images of the beavers. If they see humans that's it - they go back underwater. We've managed to get 20 minutes of footage. It shows the kits frolicking together with the mother beaver, swimming and dragging wood.

"Everyone is very proud that these kits have been born as conservation is part of the identity of the estate. There are over 6,000 protected wildlife species at Lower Mill and the beavers are just part of it."

With price tags of up to £10 million, stars including Brad Pitt are thought to have expressed an interest in the modern Utopia, on the Cotswold Water Park. Orchid House, modelled on a Bee Orchid, recently sold for £7.2 million to a mystery buyer.

Developer Jeremy Paxton said: "Beaver kits can swim, but it may take them a month or more to figure out how to hold their breath and swim underwater. When they get tired, they catch a ride on their mother's back. Lower Mill residents hope to witness all this activity and more, yards from human habitation.

"It's an exciting development on an estate which, through careful management of hedges and woodland over many years, now serves as home to more than 13 classic English songbirds. It's also one of the very few places in the country which provides a breeding habitat for the Lesser Emperor Dragonfly."

Andrew · Post by **Andrew** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:38 am

Cool.

Bridger158 · Post by **Bridger158** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:19 am

That'd be cool for me to get the chance to do beaver control work in a foreign country. When they inevitably start flooding out the houses give me a call and I'll come on over.

airedaleman · Post by **airedaleman** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:31 am

VERY upscale beavers! Must be a gated community... All my beaver acquaintances either hang out in the marsh in front of our house on the Chickahominy River, or work at flooding the parking lot at Croaker Landing on the York River. Just plain, simple, hardworking AMERICAN beavers...

Terry Murbach · Post by **Terry Murbach** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:44 pm

OOOOOOOOOOOHH....YOU MEAN FOUR LEGGED BEAVERS.....I WAS THINKING SOMETHING ELSE.....

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 5:17 pm

Terry Murbach wrote:OOOOOOOOOOOHH....YOU MEAN FOUR LEGGED BEAVERS.....I WAS THINKING SOMETHING ELSE.....

Our minds must run in the same gutter, Sir.....

KirkD · Post by **KirkD** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:20 pm

game keeper wrote: "It's an exciting development on an estate which, through careful management of hedges and woodland over many years, now serves as home to more than 13 classic English songbirds. It's also one of the very few places in the country which provides a breeding habitat for the Lesser Emperor Dragonfly."

Well, on the one hand, I'm glad to see the beaver come back in the UK, but I think the 'careful management of hedges and woodland over many years' in that high-priced, exclusive housing development is about to experience a lot of trees being cut down. I lost an nice Ash last week to a beaver, and that one was just passing through. Once they set up residence, then you really see the trees coming down. I've had to 'deal' (i.e., 32-20) with an overpopulation of beavers since I was a teen back on the farm. Better to introduce them in some of the wilder parts of the UK, where they can cut down all the trees they want and no one minds (is there such a place in the UK?).
The big question is whether the Canadian beaver can whup the European beaver when it comes to number of trees cut down per night and number of high-priced acres flooded per summer.

Pete44ru · Post by **Pete44ru** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:25 pm

Me too, Terry !

bigbore442001 · Post by **bigbore442001** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:36 pm

Good news but as others have explained it can be a mixed blessing. All members of the rodenta family are prolific breeders. I can't offhand think of too many natural predators of these European beavers. So for now they are a curiosity. Given time they will breed and expand their range.

Beavers are really great animals. Even though we have some problems with them I still admire them. I do like the fact that their pelts are great and one thing I love to eat is beaver. Some of the best tasting meat around.

North American beavers can be aggressive. I know of a New Hampshire warden that was bit almost between the legs by a beaver in a trap. It was caught by the tail and not in a good mood. The beaver's teeth have retractable gums so the beaver bit cleanly through his hip boots and through his thigh. Like a wierd piercing. It did ruin a good pair of boots though.

Borregos · Post by **Borregos** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:38 pm

Kirk +1

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:42 pm

Terry, you and Blaine are incorrigible.

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:47 pm

kimwcook wrote:Terry, you and Blaine are incorrigible.

Now, now - be honest - how many of us had the first split second same thought?

KirkD · Post by **KirkD** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:05 pm

Call me naîve or call me backwoods, but some of you fellows seem to have another understanding of the word 'beaver' that I don't know about and maybe I don't want to know about. I once heard some city fellows about 35 years ago say something about 'beaver' and snickering and I figured they must be talking about a different kind of beaver than we had trouble with on the farm, because from the looks of them, they didn't seem like the kind of fellows who'd ever even seen a beaver. I never did find out what they were talking about. Don't tell me either. From the winking and nudging going on here, I don't think I want to know.

Bridger158 · Post by **Bridger158** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:46 pm

I admit, I had the same first thought.

pharmseller · Post by **pharmseller** » Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:41 pm

I live in the Beaver State...really.

Quinn

Paladin · Post by **Paladin** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 12:14 am

KIRK +2
Can't wait till the city folk start getting a real dose of nature and the damage some of it causes.

Nath · Post by **Nath** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:16 am

Yeah, what Kirk says! Can't wait till the beaver huggers realise they have created a problem!
Not a problem to me, I just want their dumb cuddly fury friendly animal dreams go wrong.
Whats beaver taste like?

Nath.

jhrosier · Post by **jhrosier** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:25 am

I can't imagine why anyone with a shred of common sense would deliberately introduce beavers to an area.
They are imensely destructive. Hundreds of acres around my place have been changed from valuable and beautiful woodlots to stinkin' swamps.
The Rulers here outlawed trapping a few years back and the beavers simply run amok, destroying trees, contaminating wells, and flooding private property.
It is a curse of biblical proportions, compounded by legislative stupidity.
It makes me wonder what, if anything, that they are thinking.

Jack

Terry Murbach · Post by **Terry Murbach** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 8:36 am

Whats beaver taste like?

Nath.[/quote]

OH BOY....HERE WE GO AGAIN....WELL NATH, WHAT CAN I SAY. IT IS A SWEET AND JUICY MEAT. VERY LOW CAL AND YOU CAN HAVE ALL YOU WANT ON A DIET....

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:09 am

Okay, let's steer this one back to some resemblence of manners.

In all seriousness, aren't beavers just big rodents? I've had squirrel and rabbit, and enjoyed both. I haven't had anything else in the family that I am aware of. Not to hijack this thread, but do they make good eating?

bigbore442001 · Post by **bigbore442001** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:32 am

Will all of the jucularity aside, beaver meat to me tastes like very rich beef. I usually have it in a stew and that is what the flavor reminds me of.

Old Time Hunter · Post by **Old Time Hunter** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:29 pm

beaver is very, very expensive! All I can say is...once that beaver starts work'n your log...they multiply like rabbits!

Nath · Post by **Nath** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:41 pm

probably taste a bit woody!

Nath.

deerwhacker444 · Post by **deerwhacker444** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:23 pm

I guess if the beaver does well in the UK, then you'll have to chase it around like they do in Canada....

Chasing Beaver in Canada.!

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:42 pm

Deerwacker444

Bis · Post by **Bis** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:12 pm

I hope you enjoy your beavers as much as I have. You would not believe the number of nights I have sat by my lake and pond just waiting for them to show up with my 12 ga. and 00 shot

. This year I stopped counting the number of trees they took down after 50. Now some of the families have moved on , leaving their dens to fall apart. My beavers have dug dens in the sides of the banks and are now collapsing. I found one when I steped on it and went down to my knee, another den I almost lost my tractor in. I called the game warrden to see about getting rid of them. They are so busy clearing out culvers under major highways thanks to the beavers that they have no time to help the locals. Why anyone would want to have beavers around is beyond me.

revorg · Post by **revorg** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:30 pm

Beavers are miserable flat tailed rats.

Several of them die of mysterious causes every year on my property...

Why anyone would introduce them on purpose is beyond me.

revorg

TedH · Post by **TedH** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 8:37 pm

game keeper wrote:Deerwacker444

+1

KirkD · Post by **KirkD** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:18 pm

Bis wrote:I hope you enjoy your beavers as much as I have. You would not believe the number of nights I have sat by my lake and pond just waiting for them to show up with my 12 ga. and 00 shot . This year I stopped counting the number of trees they took down after 50. Now some of the families have moved on , leaving their dens to fall apart. My beavers have dug dens in the sides of the banks and are now collapsing. I found one when I steped on it and went down to my knee, another den I almost lost my tractor in. I called the game warrden to see about getting rid of them. They are so busy clearing out culvers under major highways thanks to the beavers that they have no time to help the locals. Why anyone would want to have beavers around is beyond me.

By gum, Bis, that sounds just like the area where I grew up in central Canada. If they weren't flooding pasture and crop land, they were building dams, cutting down trees, and plugging culverts. I had to laugh when I read about the collapsing banks. I've fallen into quite a few caved in beaver tunnels myself. (Don't ever run at top speed at night near a river bank that has a lot of beavers!) You are also so right about the game wardens. We were supposed to notify the Natural Resources people every time we had beaver problems. After the beaver pelts lost demand in Europe, fellows stopped trapping them and the population exploded. The game wardens were in beavers up to their eyeballs and didn't want to hear from anyone else. Unofficially they, expected us all to 'take care' of the problems ourselves, which we jolly well did. The tree huggers in Europe thought they'd saved the Canadian beaver. What they didn't know was that they were shot and left to rot by the thousands. What a waste. It would have been so much better to make coats and hats out of them and keep the population at sane levels.

awp101 · Post by **awp101** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 10:35 pm

KirkD wrote:
Bis wrote:The tree huggers in Europe thought they'd saved the Canadian beaver. What they didn't know was that they were shot and left to rot by the thousands. What a waste. It would have been so much better to make coats and hats out of them and keep the population at sane levels.

But they FEEL better about themselves...

Terry Murbach:

I see I'm in good company in this gutter...

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 5:43 am

As I understood it, the trade in Beaver pelts slowed right down in about 1840 when silk top hats became the fashion instead of felt!

I know a lot of you guys moan about having too many critters like Beaver, Coyotes and such but I just think of all the sport you can have hunting the darn things!

By the way, thanks for giving us the Grey Squirrel! I'd feel lost without it!

Ron Macy · Post by **Ron Macy** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:38 pm

I lost a nice willow to beaver three years ago. Trunk was 11" when I measured the stump that was left.

DNR trapped and removed 7 from our little 170 acre lake this spring. Glad they're gone.

KirkD · Post by **KirkD** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:27 pm

game keeper wrote:As I understood it, the trade in Beaver pelts slowed right down in about 1840 when silk top hats became the fashion instead of felt!

That's probably true, but the demand for beaver pelts for fur coats continued up until sometime in the 1970's. I used to run a small trapline when I was a teenager and at that time, beaver pelts brought in a good sum (I can't remember what it was anymore, but it was at least $30). Then the animal rights activists in Europe started spray painting fur coats and protesting against trapping and demand for fur coats in Europe fell through the floor. The price followed and most people I knew quit trapping them ..... it just wasn't worth the time and effort. By the late 1980's the beaver population in my province of Manitoba had reached the highest in recorded history according to Natural Resources, and that's when the shooting in earnest started by farmers who were having their farmland flooded out.

I do enjoy beavers, as long as they are not on my land and cutting down my trees. As a kid, I'd lay by a pond at sunset and watch them work. I have fond memories of beaver ponds when I was a kid.

piller · Post by **piller** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 7:53 pm

I don't have anything to add, but I want to tell all of you that I enjoyed reading this.

Bis · Post by **Bis** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:31 am

My understanding is that the beavers are somewhat protected as well as the gators around here. I was talking to a judge in town and un-officially he told me to remember the "3 S" rule, shoot it, shovel it and shut up

.

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:15 am

Kirk, thanks for the information about Beaver pelts in the 1970s, I remember all the bunny huggers having a go at women wearing fur coats and that by so doing they killed the trade and impoverished many a Canadian trapper that relied on it to feed his family! I just didn't realise that the "Beaver" was still so much in demand in those days! I sometimes have trouble thinking beyond the 1800s

I have a book entitled "Canadian Wilds" by Martin Hunter, it is all about the Hudson's Bay Company, Northern Indians and their mode of Hunting and Trapping Etc. It is a fine read and I highly recommend it.

Doc Hudson · Post by **Doc Hudson** » Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:11 pm

Nath wrote:Yeah, what Kirk says! Can't wait till the beaver huggers realise they have created a problem!
Not a problem to me, I just want their dumb cuddly fury friendly animal dreams go wrong.
Whats beaver taste like?

Nath.

Like chicken. Everything tastes like chicken.

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:26 pm

Like Kirk said, furs were in very high demand in the late 60s nd early 70s until killed off by the "huggers". Remember the nitwits slinging blood on ladies wearing furs? Good beavers could bring $60+ but what I really remember was about the same time bobcat hit their high for the century. A real fat and prime one could bring $300 to $400. THOSE were the good old days.

I was working on a petrochem startup project in central England in the mid 90s. On the rare day off, my partner in crime and his Brit girl friend went to a zoo of some sort (somewhere north west of Manchester). Lo and behold they had an enclosure full of p-dogs. My partner told his girl friend never to bring me there. She asked why not and he told her I would kill them

(I'm from Wyoming). Actually I really wouldn't have. More fun to see people get out of their own messes. Like beavers, p-dogs look cute, right up to the time they are destroying YOUR property. Anyway good luck to all with the beavers and p-dogs

KirkD · Post by **KirkD** » Thu Jul 24, 2008 6:53 pm

Leverluver wrote:Like beavers, p-dogs look cute, right up to the time they are destroying YOUR property. Anyway good luck to all with the beavers and p-dogs

Heh, heh.

That reminds me of the last time my wife and kids visited the Winnipeg zoo. They had an enclosure for p-dogs for years, but they had obviously escaped. There were p-dog holes everywhere and p-dogs popping up in all the enclosures throughout the zoo. The zoo was at their wits end as to how to control them and they obviously fighting a loosing battle.

Personally, I'm glad to see the European Beaver back in England, just so long as they permit the property owners to shoot and trap them when (not 'if') they get out of control. With that in mind, the best place to re-introduce beavers is into the most expensive properties with the highest concentration of fish-kissing, tree-hugging, whale-worshiping devotees. If you can't get those people out into the real wilderness, bring the real wilderness to them and let them deal with it. Come to think of it, it might be a good idea to re-introduce wolves into that estate as well.

Mike D. · Post by **Mike D.** » Thu Jul 24, 2008 7:38 pm

I predict that those psky rodents will quickly fall out of favor once the trees come down. We had a big problem with the darned flat tailed rats in our orchards. They were girding and dropping 100 yr old pear trees and dragging them into the ditches. When they plugged the pipes between canals, the real trouble began. We had the trapper come out but the beavers outsmarted him. I sat down there for two nights with my .25-20 and a starlight vision and they fooled me, too. I finally put a $50 reward per head and the Mexican workers scored. Nothing like a little incentive to get the job done, eh? In a few years the British Beavers will have to be thinned out just the same.

Save trees, eat beaver!

Bis · Post by **Bis** » Thu Jul 24, 2008 8:34 pm

They are smart. They use to come out at dusk and I would be waiting for them, they would usually see me before I could get a shot off. The next night it would be an hour later, this went on until I was out there at 2 in the morning before they would show up.

I cleared some brush near where they liked to plug my spill ways and set up a blind behind a few small trees, I left it alone for a few days to let things settle down. When I went back, they had eaten the trees around my blind and all that was there was my chair sitting on an open area of the beach.