color case hardening... anybody do this themselves?

[O.S.O.K.]

I'm thinking of getting the materials (bone charcoal, charcoal) and color casehardening a m94 receiver myself. I've found some information on-line and it sounds pretty simple, but there were no specifics for time and such...
http://home.sprynet.com/~gex/Color.htm

Anybody do this? Do you have any reference sites?

I'm concerned about screwing up the receiver.

But on the other hand, with decent information, I'm willing to try... the places that offer this service charge a mint...

[jdad]

Go over to Marlin-Collectors.com and look up "JimD". He has a whole series on how he does it in his shop.

[O.S.O.K.]

Thanks

[Sixgun]

Without the proper ovens, your wasting your time. The metal has to be held at a very certain temperature, maintained, and cooled properly or the receiver will warp. Its a lot easier to pay Doug Turnbull $300 to do it for you. This is assuming YOU strip the receiver and prepare it yourself.-----------------Sixgun

[Andrew]

I have never priced an oven nice enough to do hardening processes but they look "not cheap". Good luck with the project, I always like to do things myself too.

[BenT]

Keeping it from warping is the hardest part. Case coloring doesn't require all the heat that case harding does.

[Ysabel Kid]

Risk vs. reward. Each man's call... but I'd hate to risk screwing up a good gun myself!

[O.S.O.K.]

Warping....uh never mind. Dang it. This particular receiver is a scintered, post 64 model (72). CCH is the one finishing process that looks authentic - all the others are basically paint jobs...

Thanks the the feedback guys.

I figured it had to be harder than it looks though it seems strange that they've been doing this for hundereds of years w/0 fancy ovens - I was hoping I could just place it in a fire - but that apparently is asking for trouble.

I'll probably just go to plan B and coat all fo the metal with guncoat. I can get an inexpensive air gun and do that myself... this will just have to be a practical hunting rifle.

I decided on a Marble tang sight for this too. Allows for a lot of adjustment and is windage adjustable too.

[Mike Hunter]

I’ve been doing CCH in the shop for 4-5 years now, it surprises me at times that folks think they can do this in their back yard with a hibachi grill.

If I remember correctly initial investment was close to 3K, digitally controlled heat treat oven, stainless steel crucibles, quench tank, aeration system. Then about a year trying different techniques so that I would get dependable, repeatable results.

For the first 3-4 months, I took 1018 steel plates, surface ground them until they were dead flat, then color case hardened them, using ratios from 10:1 to 1:1, and quench temperatures from 1100 deg F to 1450 deg F. I would measure the amount of warpage, which would range from +/- .000 to over 30 thou. Probably about 50 or so trials before I had a fairly good understanding on what was happening.

The two biggest issues are warpage (changing the temperature of the metal from 1400 deg F to 60 deg F in a second or two is pretty drastic) , and how do you safely handle and dump a crucible full of steel parts and charcoal that is 1400 deg f, oh BTW without letting the parts get exposed to air.

Here are some of the variables that can affect CCH;

Temperature of parts at quench
Temperature of water at quench
Carburizing Temperature
Soak time (how long parts are at carburizing temperature)
Ratio of Bone to wood charcoal
How far the parts drop before hitting water
How close the parts are to each other
Mass of parts
Type of animal charcoal (bone, leather, hoof, horn)
Amount of dissolved air in the water
Circulation of the water
PH of water (hard vs. soft)

Just to name a few. Changing any one of the variables just a little can have a significant impact on your CCH.

Not trying to discurage anyone, but its not as easy as it sounds

Mike Hunter
www.Hunterrestorations.com

[Doc Hudson]

Pay close attention to Sixgun and Mike Hunter. If it were easy to do, there would be lots more than just a handful of people doing this. In fact, until I read this thread, I was unaware of anyone other than Doug Turnbull who did case coloring these days.

[mescalero1]

O.S.A.K,
If you will give me untill this evening, I may have an answer for you.
My gunsmiths are out of the buisiness now, but they still do things for themselves, myself, a few select friends.
I never paid much attention than passing interest, but they have a chemical methodology for coloring that passes for the effect.
I will ask them and pass along the information.

[mescalero1]

PS
I have a Win. 94 that could use some help in this department,
if they are up to it; I'll get it done and get them to post pics.
They are into photo- journalism

[86er]

Mike sums it up pretty well, but FYI I'll add that my "oven" was around $3200 when I bought it in 1999.

[jmatt]

You should take the Case Color class from Murray State College in Tishimingo, Okla. that is given each summer. It lasts one week and tuition costs $250. We have been doing this for the past three years and as others have said it ain't easy!! You have to hold your left leg about 3" off the ground while dunking the parts into water - or is it the right leg and 4" off the ground? The most time consuming part is building blocks to keep the metal from warping. Much mill work!! I will bring some examples if we get to meet at the Texas hunting camp in Dec. Or come to Canton, Tex. and we can show you how it is done. Some days it really works really well and some days it stinks. The class in Okla. is really great - along with their classes on other subjects.

[O.S.O.K.]

mescalero1 - I'm interested. Is your 94's receiver a scintered one? They don't take bluing... may not work with that process either... I don't want spend much on this receiver finish. If I wanted to spend good coin on the project, I'd use a non-scintered receiver.

As stated, I'm OK with a quality coating... they are actualy very good. And I can do it myself. Something I'm all about.

[mescalero1]

They were out, will try again WED.