"El Tigre" failed me while working cattle!

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:54 am

Just kidding, I just missed. Coyotes get curious when the cattle start bawling. He was a little far away and I was tired. I can't think of any more excuses.

Post by **Old Savage** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:58 am

What caliber is that rifle.

It looks just like the one by Rossi that I have in waiting except mine is CCH. Neat sling. Kind of a cowboy Ramar of the Jungle.

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:20 am

Old Savage, The El Tigre's were made in 44-40 around late teens and early 20s in Spain for Mexico. The USA would not sell 92s to Mexico at the time. It came with swivels from the factory. It shoots great. I got it in New Mexico years ago. It's my truck gun now.

Modoc ED · Post by **Modoc ED** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:24 am

From other threads/posts and your mention of them in this thread you must have quite a problem with coyotes. Have you thought of calling in a coyote specialist to eliminate or at least thin them out? We have coyotes out the gump stump here but if a rancher is having real problems, they call in one or two of the local coyote hunters to take care of it. Some ranchers/farmers even use llamas to hold coyotes/mountain lions at bay.

That aside, nice rifle as usual.

O.S.O.K. · Post by **O.S.O.K.** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:34 am

Anywhere there's a lot of cattle there's a lot of yotes.

They are everywhere as you know but do increase their numbers when good protien is available.

And the frustrating thing is that when they are hunted hard, and put under pressure, they have bigger litters! Truely God's dog, they are very successful - you have to admire them.

BigSky56 · Post by **BigSky56** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:00 pm

Rider, Is that a heart on the right hip I lose sight of it in the shadow. Good looking cows. danny

Hillbilly · Post by **Hillbilly** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:31 pm

I jumped a coyote last Sunday afternoon while horseback... even worse that Rangerider's missed shot... I was not packing a rifle.

He popped out of a scrub oak stand about 40 yards from me. I did a double take... thought it was a 'german shepard".

My one- man eradication plan is helping... I am seeing a second set of turkeys hanging out by our north fence... and have been flushing bobwhites every afternoon checking cattle.

Barcelona Rick · Post by **Barcelona Rick** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:36 pm

Rangerider7,

When I was a kid my dad had a little country grocery store/feed store/butchershop/filling station (2 pumps...regular and ethel). We also had a big garden and raised Herefords and of course chickens. Mom and dad had built a nice brick house a stones throw from the store. They ran that thing from before dawn til after dark 6 days a week. Sunday was church, big dinner then daddy would see his credit customers and try to collect a couple of bucks. Usually he came in that afternoon with news of illness, hardhip and no money. Sometimes he showed up with some pickled Indian peaches or pear preserves or native plum jelly. Moma would make a little note in her lined record book and that would be it. Being the oldest it was my job to tend the cows. Most of the time that was fun but not always as all of ya'll know that have fooled with herefords...I'm talking work. When daddy did feed out of the old truck guess who rode in the back ?? Rain, sleet, wind, snow or whatever. Our operation was small without anything fancy. I told myself that the only beef I would fool with after I got grown was on a plate.....now mom and dad are gone and the place is gone and the older I get the more I wish I was that kid again.....(I have told this before I think but just let an old guy look back)....your place is sure greened up. Keep the stories and pics coming.....I'm fixin to load up the grandchildren and look at my buddies new bull...

jumbeaux

JerryB · Post by **JerryB** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:50 pm

I tried to find an old Spanish 92 44-40 for along time.Yours is a good looking carbine. It does look like a heart brand on the right hip of the near cow, that sure is a good looking bull to the right too. Do you have trouble with pink eye with your herd of Herfords?

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:58 pm

I'm a one man operation too. I have killed about 9 or 10 so far this year. Llama and donkeys are good for keeping them away but have seldom seen a llama kill one. I have seen donkeys kick the be-gibbers out of a few and try and kill them but they won't chase them far. I want them dead, not ran over to neighboring ranchers. I have told this story before, but I have seen what a pack of coyotes can do to fresh newborn calves. I know it's mother nature but so am I. We have had some good rains so far, but that will stop soon. We have turkey but very little quail and I sure love to eat both. Ground nesting birds are probably the most endangered game I know. That is a heart brand you see. That was the brand that was on them when the owner bought them. His brand is the Rocking R. Yes, we have a lot of trouble with pink eye and stupidity. My daddy always told me to own mix-breed cattle. Working with these registered horned Herefords I can see Why. That bull is a nice one and so are his two brothers. They are the most docile bulls I have been around.

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 3:14 pm

Darn near gave me a heart attack RR7!!!

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 3:19 pm

I have shot a few for a friend over the years out toward liberty hill area he has a nice little ranch.now its just not the yotes but feral dogs are getting to be a problem.a yote will run but some of those dogs are just flat mean.

pete

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 3:34 pm

We have the feral dogs too, but they seem to be worse on the other side of the county. This is mostly all big ranches. The dogs are to far away from home to get back at night to sleep under the porch of the non-believing home owner.

RSY · Post by **RSY** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 4:12 pm

rangerider7 wrote:I know it's mother nature, but so am I.

I love that line.

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 4:24 pm

rangerider7 wrote:We have the feral dogs too, but they seem to be worse on the other side of the county. This is mostly all big ranches. The dogs are to far away from home to get back at night to sleep under the porch of the non-believing home owner.

I have helped out and a few didn't make it back to the porch

pete

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 5:27 pm

When I hunted on core land I ran into quite a few wild dog packs. They hunt for sport and are not afraid of humans until you shoot. I always went for the alpha first. This seems to discourage the rest when he goes down like a sack of potatoes. It would usually be early or late in the day. At the local gun store a goat rancher was telling me about the problem he had with feral dogs. They killed 11 of his young goats and left them all in a row. As he ran out with his 22 he saw them running over the hill. He missed his only shot then looked around for his guard dog, the big white one, he was sitting back at the pen. He was so mad he walked over shot him. He said "for the amount of food that fat piece of $#!+ was costing me, I can buy an automatic 223".

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:34 pm

He shot a Great Pyrenese?

Dave James · Post by **Dave James** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:40 pm

darn yotes are every where, have had a couple killed here in the back side of Chesapeake VA.

Spent some time on a Sheep ranch with a tender one summer up in the hills living ut of a wagon, he had a 30-30, and I had brought my old Savage 340 type in 222, boy howdie we wore the yotes out. have seen them kill for sport and sheepare darn near to stupid to get out of the way.

Cosmoline · Post by **Cosmoline** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:58 pm

Mouth watering. Do you ship those to Alaska by any chance? I'll buy the big one a pair of seats on the Alaska Airlines flight, first class.

pharmseller · Post by **pharmseller** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:15 pm

Rangerider,
If you need more excuses, let me know. I've got plenty.

P

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:20 pm

mescalero1, yep!

RSY · Post by **RSY** » Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:51 pm

Dave James wrote:...sheep are darn near too stupid to get out of the way.

Cattle ain't much better. The last time I killed a coyote was down on some land near Gonzales we used to hunt. I was walking just inside a treeline with my Mini-14 and came across a small herd ambling along parallel to my path. Lo and behold, I spot something walking along with them toward the back (but still in) their group. At first I thought it was a dog since the cattle didn't seem to care and the "dog" was just loafing along with them. A quick peek with my binocular revealed the coyote's true identity. He sat down on his haunches to take a break, and I zinged a 55-gr. Ballistic Tip through his lungs. He didn't much appreciate that and did the spinning death dance in protest for a bit before giving up the ghost.

Amazingly, those danged cows just didn't seem to mind him being there, and he was just taking his sweet ol' time. My theory is that maybe he could smell one of those cows getting ready to drop a calf and was thinking he was going to have a fine feast for himself. Alas, that was not to be. It was the buzzards that feasted that day.

Scott

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Sun Jun 14, 2009 4:41 am

RSY, that would be my guess too. I have seen a single coyote follow deer and cows much to big for them to handle but hoping for a fawn or fresh newborn to happen about. When the fawn shows up they cripple it then wait for the mother to abandon it.

bigbore442001 · Post by **bigbore442001** » Sun Jun 14, 2009 6:52 am

The only practical way to decimate coyotes is through systematic trapping. Snaring seems to be the best method. I know it is controversial but in my opinion that comes from the pablum of the ten dollar cup of coffee crowd who do not have to live with them. Last week a woman was trailed by a small pack of four coyotes as she was walking through the woods. The state of Massachusetts basically outlawed trapping in 1994 and we've had problems like this ever since. I know Texas has more landowner friendly laws. I'd get some trapper that knows how to use snares and thin them out significantly.

Maine started snaring a few years ago and in some areas the deer population rebounded . The deer kill doubled in some parts. Then the animal rights ninnies tried to sue thus the program was shut down due to one Canada lynx being caught.

Post by **Old Savage** » Sun Jun 14, 2009 8:20 am

Sheep used to graze at certain times of year on land where there was public shooting. I have watched them walk right into 223 fire from semi autos to where the shooters had to move and shoot somewhere else.

Paratrooper Dave · Post by **Paratrooper Dave** » Sun Jun 14, 2009 8:40 pm

6/14/09

rangerider7,

Nice group of Herefords you got there.

Don't worry about the 'yote, he'll be back and I am sure you and your "kitty" gun will get him.

Paratrooper Dave
MAPLE EDGE HEREFORD FARM
Bloomfield, Connecticut

RIHMFIRE · Post by **RIHMFIRE** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:44 am

nice spread and rifle!
yeah ...those coyotes are a PITA....
The neighbors lost a new born colt...paint...
and the rancher lost a calf the other day...
not to mention all the chickens that are disapearing!
While i was riding my atv last week
I came across a scrawny look'n yote....
he was only 40 yards away....and i did not have
a shoot'n iron with me..so i decided to mess with
him...making distress calls..after a while he lost
interest...I watched him walk down the grassy road
for about a half a mile..and the deer were running
everywhere.. Next time I will be prepared!

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 2:31 pm

RIHMFIRE, a buddy of mine rigged his pickup to carry a pack of Greyhounds in a cage in the bed. A pull chain was put in the cab to open the back of the cage. When he saw a coyote in a field he would pull the chain and let the dogs out. They would play with the coyote for awhile then the alpha would kill it. Maybe a trained Greyhound would be the answer.

RSY · Post by **RSY** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 5:29 pm

rangerider7 wrote:RIHMFIRE, a buddy of mine rigged his pickup to carry a pack of Greyhounds in a cage in the bed. A pull chain was put in the cab to open the back of the cage. When he saw a coyote in a field he would pull the chain and let the dogs out. They would play with the coyote for awhile then the alpha would kill it. Maybe a trained Greyhound would be the answer.

Now, THAT'S entertainment! Probably a cost-prohibitive solution for most, but a blast to watch, I bet.

Scott

Bogie35 · Post by **Bogie35** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 8:41 pm

RSY wrote:
rangerider7 wrote:I know it's mother nature, but so am I.
I love that line.

+1!

bogie

Gaucho Gringo · Post by **Gaucho Gringo** » Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:10 pm

The Greyhound racing tracks have an adoption program for them and they do not charge for them from what I have read. Seems like it would be the way to get a coyote eliminating pack of Greyhounds.

RIHMFIRE · Post by **RIHMFIRE** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 7:32 am

rangerider7 wrote:RIHMFIRE, a buddy of mine rigged his pickup to carry a pack of Greyhounds in a cage in the bed. A pull chain was put in the cab to open the back of the cage. When he saw a coyote in a field he would pull the chain and let the dogs out. They would play with the coyote for awhile then the alpha would kill it. Maybe a trained Greyhound would be the answer.

I talked with the owners grandson......
and he was going out there the next day
with his 243 and a few calls and try to call them in..
i dont know how he did...
But i would rather hunt them myself too...
We do have a race track here and they do have an adoption
program...but I dont need another dog...
besides they are just as scrawny as the yotes around here...
ugly too!

RSY · Post by **RSY** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 7:54 am

Gaucho Gringo wrote:The Greyhound racing tracks have an adoption program for them and they do not charge for them from what I have read...

I was thinking more along the lines of food, housing, and vet bills.

Scott

Scott Young · Post by **Scott Young** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 11:33 pm

i have done quite a bit of snaring for coyotes. i have worked for chicken farmers, small ranches and also for commercial and private coyote/fox pens. i can tell you that you can put a real hurting on them with snares. the down side is when the local coyotes are gone, new ones will come in. the up side is it is very easy to do and is the most effective method outside of poisoning.

shooting them is fun too, but it takes time to get them all.

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 11:31 am

Scott Young, you are right on when you say "new ones will come". It is a never ending job. That's why you must hunt them year round. I feel for the pups but that is why I say, "I know it's mother nature, but so am I". They have been out of control for 20 years. Ever since I saw a pair of coyotes hunting in the middle of the day next to interstate 35, I knew livestock owners were in trouble.

Travis Morgan · Post by **Travis Morgan** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:38 pm

rangerider7 wrote:Scott Young, you are right on when you say "new ones will come". It is a never ending job. That's why you must hunt them year round. I feel for the pups but that is why I say, "I know it's mother nature, but so am I". They have been out of control for 20 years. Ever since I saw a pair of coyotes hunting in the middle of the day next to interstate 35, I knew livestock owners were in trouble.

I feel for the ranch dog's pups that get orphaned, the man who calf crop gets killed, and the guy that has to buy store eggs or go without his Sunday dinner. As for coyotes, I feel one thing..... recoil.

Dave James · Post by **Dave James** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 8:38 pm

Know a couple of older timers

who used to run a cross breed dog, that was greyhound and a deer stag of some type. yote's didn't stand a chance.

Never thought about them following waiting for the drop, but it makes sense, you know strange thing is I don't remember the yotes and stray dogs being as big a problem back in the late 50's early 60's, could be the memory is getting slow

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:00 pm

In the 50s and 60s you hardly ever saw a coyote in the day time. Their numbers were down because of bounties and trappers.

J35 · Post by **J35** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:49 pm

rangerider7 wrote:RIHMFIRE, a buddy of mine rigged his pickup to carry a pack of Greyhounds in a cage in the bed. A pull chain was put in the cab to open the back of the cage. When he saw a coyote in a field he would pull the chain and let the dogs out. They would play with the coyote for awhile then the alpha would kill it. Maybe a trained Greyhound would be the answer.

Used to hunt with a fellow that used a pair of Greyhound crosses when he called coyotes. He would just lay them at his side and when a coyote came in he would say get em, most times the coyotes never had a prayer.

He started with pure bloods but our country was to rough and the Greyhounds to fragile, to much speed and not enough brakes equals dead Greyhounds.

Have fun

J35 · Post by **J35** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:58 pm

Old Savage wrote:Sheep used to graze at certain times of year on land where there was public shooting. I have watched them walk right into 223 fire from semi autos to where the shooters had to move and shoot somewhere else.

One time up by Springerville AZ I was shooting prairie dogs when a Pronghorn buck walked into my field of view thru the scope, could'nt have happened at a better time as my barrel was real hot and needed a break.

Have fun

J35 · Post by **J35** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:19 pm

RSY wrote:
Dave James wrote:...sheep are darn near too stupid to get out of the way.
Cattle ain't much better. The last time I killed a coyote was down on some land near Gonzales we used to hunt. I was walking just inside a treeline with my Mini-14 and came across a small herd ambling along parallel to my path. Lo and behold, I spot something walking along with them toward the back (but still in) their group. At first I thought it was a dog since the cattle didn't seem to care and the "dog" was just loafing along with them. A quick peek with my binocular revealed the coyote's true identity. He sat down on his haunches to take a break, and I zinged a 55-gr. Ballistic Tip through his lungs. He didn't much appreciate that and did the spinning death dance in protest for a bit before giving up the ghost.

Amazingly, those danged cows just didn't seem to mind him being there, and he was just taking his sweet ol' time. My theory is that maybe he could smell one of those cows getting ready to drop a calf and was thinking he was going to have a fine feast for himself. Alas, that was not to be. It was the buzzards that feasted that day.

Scott

Lots of times they follow cows just for the mice and grasshoppers the cows kick up, I have watched them many times in the summer, when the cows usually calf in Feb.

One time up on the Salt river on the White Mountain Apache reservation I was headed down stream from the bridge on a two track and stopped to open a gate, about 100yrds further up the road was a Black bear sitting so I pulled on thru and closed the gate and headed on towards the bear , he got up and headed off slowly across a open hillside covered with about 50 Herfords and the cows could of cared less, he passed within 20 yrds of several.

Have fun

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:32 pm

I have killed a many a coyote in the spring after checking a fresh newborn calf and heading to the barn a see a coyote on the trot nose up going to the smell. It could be for the calf but singles are usually just going after the leftovers. If I see a pack it's for the calf and cow. I sometimes carry my AR15 in the spring with a 30 shot magazine in it. It seems to thin the pack some.

Post by **Old Savage** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:26 am

You Texas guys don't mess around!

Dave James · Post by **Dave James** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:25 pm

Some times I think the Game & Fish people have missed the boat in not bringing back the bounties, on them

We used to hunt hard for them in Kansas back in the late 50's -early 60's when back home couple of the counties still had them, was 5 or 10 cents an ear, didn't take long to earn enough to buy a box of 22's

shdwlkr · Post by **shdwlkr** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:06 pm

rangerider
Never seen what coyotes can do to a new born calf but I have seen what a pack of dogs can do and yes with the help of the county sheriff we did a number on them as they were causing everybody problems. Next morning the owners were busy writing checks to the sheriff.
It was my best friends dad's dairy farm and we waged war on anything that bothered the cows.
One of my bosses before he went deft and died used to trap eastern coyotes and they were much bigger than I thought they were and didn't see anything wrong with trying to keep the numbers down as you say they like anything that is on the ground.
I also worked for a sheep farmer one summer and I did a job on a pack of dogs that went after his sheep. He thought at first that I had gone home when he saw the dogs coming into the flock but when he noticed the sheep all grouping up in a strange manner he figured that I must be close. I was I was in the flock on my knees waiting for the dogs to get close. I only had my winchester 94 and 50 bullets but not many got away and the funny thing was the sheep stayed real close behind me and when I stopped shooting they just filled in around me while I reloaded and when I started shooting again they just walked behind me. The owner got 3-5 that thought they would sneak in behind me. We collected a lot of dogs with tags that night to and the sheriff again got lots of checks. We did that for a few nights before they decided there was easier pickens someplace else and a few nights later the few that were left went into the wrong farmers field and never made it out.
I was taught that if your dog is after my farm animals and gets in my sights it is all over.
Don't know if I dare do that today or not to many live and let live folks.
I am out west now and I have yet to see a rancher that didn't have a few firearms in his/her truck and lots of ammo and they aren't bad shots either.
Here in NM depending where you live you have illegals from Mexico, cattle from Mexico, dogs, coyotes, other bigger wild animals or poachers all looking for a free meal at your expense.

J35 · Post by **J35** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:11 pm

Dave James wrote:Some times I think the Game & Fish people have missed the boat in not bringing back the bounties, on them

We used to hunt hard for them in Kansas back in the late 50's -early 60's when back home couple of the counties still had them, was 5 or 10 cents an ear, didn't take long to earn enough to buy a box of 22's

I believe some counties in VA have a bounty on coyotes today.

Good luck

rangerider7 · Post by **rangerider7** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 10:08 pm

David James, That is the way I got started at age 13. Turning the ears in a the Rexall for a burger, fries, and a fountain Coke. What was left over went for 22 cartridges. We usually bought Remington Rockets. They were in a kinda chick-let box, 22 shorts with lots of kick! Jack Rabbits were running in herds and coyotes were plentiful at night. Man what fun!

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 10:16 pm

Most places in N.M. you are at least 1 hour away from the law, if not further.
Shoot first to save whatever, talk to the sherrif later , when he shows up.

Travis Morgan · Post by **Travis Morgan** » Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:01 am

All the states I've ever read livestock law on allowed you to kill any animal that was harassing livestock, with the exception of birds of prey, grizzlies, mountain lions, and those #$%^ing wolves!