OT - Stopping Heinous Knife crime in England

[deerwhacker444]

Nath...Gamekeeper,..Is it really getting this bad.... Please tell me this is a joke and I've been duped.

Weapons Arrest

This would be completely laughable except it seems to be real. I can't imagine what kind of field day they'd have with some of the photos we've posted with our game harvests.

I can't believe Great Britain has turned into such a bunch of pansies like this. I bet they could find tons of pics of radical Muslims showing off knives if they wanted too.

[Nath]

Welcome to Britain DW!

The only up shot is, while the police are tied up dealing with the brain dead they may stay away from my woods, I hope.

N.

[wecsoger]

From the land whose people explored the *world* and made an empire of good bits of it, to this.

[KirkD]

I watched the video. It reflects a view that is so pathetic, I don't even know where to start. Does anyone, even for one minute, think that those laws are going to stop people knifing other people? People have been knifing each other for thousands of years, with or without laws. Knives can be made from almost anything. Why do they waste taxpayers' Pounds Sterling on such a misguided, utterly futile, and useless policy that will do absolutely nothing to stop people knifing each other? If they want to reduce knifings, start encouraging Judeo-Christian values, and healthy marriages and traditional families where the father sticks with his wife and kids, provides for them and teaches them honour, integrity and the work ethic. My first question to PC whats-his-name would be, 'why don't you get a life, by getting a job that would actually make society a better place to live?'

[Mac in Mo]

Unbelievable! That sends chills up my spine. That was like watching something from the old Soviet Union. Also as a former police officer, these "cops" should be ashamed to show their faces. It really opens ones eyes to see these ridiculous laws being so aggresively enforced. Wow! Kevin

[AJMD429]

...coming soon to a theater* near you...!

* Theater (Brit. theatre) >noun 1 a building in which plays and other dramatic performances are given. 2 the writing and production of plays. 3 a play or other activity considered in terms of its dramatic quality. 4 (also lecture theater) a room for lectures with seats in tiers. 5 Brit. an operating theater. 6 the area in which something happens: a theater of war. 7 [before another noun] (of weapons) intermediate between tactical and strategic.
-ORIGIN Greek theatron, from theasthai 'behold'.

[Nath]

All of you, well said

N.

[O.S.O.K.]

Another blatant reminder of why the First and Second Amendments to the Constitution of the United States are necessary.

And why we must not allow any further incremental infringements against them. And why we are working to reverse the damage that's already been done.

Indeed.

[OK357]

Not much difference between there and here. Government exerting it's will to protect and secure us against ourselves lest we accidentally poke an eye out.

[Ray Newman]

Just 'goes ta show ya' that those white boys aren't nothing but troublemakers.

Or was it just me who noticed that only white boys were arrested? From what I read on some of the UK news sites, it seems that ethnic minorities carry such weapons and are a big problem....

[gamekeeper]

What a great idea!!!! If only the police had the internet 50 years ago they could have arrested every Boy Scout in the UK.

[olyinaz]

What bothers me is not the cops there going to look up hoods videoing themselves brandishing shanks in public places because you know darn well and good that they concealed them on the way to/from wherever the videos were shot. Even in The States that's a serious crime with a long enough blade and I have zero tolerance for violent punks and the havoc they wreak.

No, what bothers me is the comment that they were going to go and talk to the parents of kids who had videoed themselves AT HOME doing nothing illegal whatsoever! Huh?? It's mad I say, absolutely barking MAD and I can't believe that any liberty loving U.K. resident would put up with it.

Amazed,
Oly

[wavetrain75]

I worked with carpenter from Britian for a few months before moved to Alaska. He had only been here are here weeks. He gave up a $150,000 a year job (so he said), sold everything he owned (except his house, I guess you can't even give away a house in Britian anymore) and moved to the United States.

"It's all Muslims," he said.

I asked how many people have guns buried in the back yard. "They're too scared, you have to keep your guns locked up and the police have the key, they can check them anytime. You have to keep your empty shell casings because you're only allowed so much ammo and you can be arrested if any is missing."

He spoke of the United States the way I wish people from here did. But he also saw that we're headed the same direction.

Don't get me started.

[Jacko]

I could only get through the first little bit of the video , annoyed me to much , 1st up because I do not get why the young ones see a need to pose in that manner , asking for strife in todays world. Second because the police responce is a sad reflection on the decay of society of todays developed nations.

Same stuff has happened down here in Australia. I carry a small clip point pocket knife for those times when a pocket knife comes in handy , have all my life , even through high school and never used to cut anything more than an apple or a piece of string and unfortunatly I have been breaking the law, have been for years as its unlawfull to carry a knife without lawfull excuse and just in case you need it is not a lawfull excuse . It is illegal to carry a knife while in public in Queensland , I am pretty sure it is the same law Australia wide.

Our firearms laws are not quite as droconian as Great Britains but they are out there. Queensland introduced a Catorgory M licence recently for Crossbows , thing is the capital M stands for Miscelaneous Weapons Licence . Looks like there preparing for even more restrictions to me , perhaps licencing knives , Bows and arrows ? - Its hard not to be paranoid when so many freedoms have been removed with the blessing of uneducated unquestioning Sheeple .

regards Jacko

[Nixterdemus]

Best part was the broad at the end in the one piece jumpsuit/slacks outfit and it was cut short.

Are these kids foolin' 'round or bona fide thugs?

Granted that is the UK and since you can't arm yourself w/firearm you knew knives, hatchets, chains, baseball bats, tire irons and rocks were going to come into play.

Sounds like a modern version of West Side Story combined w/Blackboard Jungle w/dash of King Creole w/o the choreographed dance scenes & singin'...

[rjroberts]

How, then will they fight them on the beaches....and in the streets? Or, have they already surrendered?

I believe Churchill also said something about X number of laws makes a nation of laws; 2X number of laws make a nation of scofflaws. Don't remember the exact wording and my book which has it is packed away; got to rely on old memory.

Oh, while we're at it: "This England, which was wont to conquer others hath made a shameful conquest of itself." (That's of course, Shakespeare, Richard II.)

[Bill in Oregon]

Um, before y'all get too worked up about the UK, keep in mind that any American boy in a Cub or Boy Scout uniform had better not "be prepared" in school with his trust Cub or Boy Scout knife. I'm 56, and can't imagine not having a pocket knife on me at any age.

[Doc Hudson]

I really can't decide which is more stupid. The cops who go around arresting the kids in photos with knives, or the darned fool kids who knowing they are breaking the law still post photos of themselves doing so.

it just goes to show that folks need to be a bit more careful about what they say and show on-line. I hope Jacko doesn't get into trouble because of his confession.

Did y'all also notice that the police Constables going to arrest those kids were armed?

For something like 200 years, only about 10% of Britain's police force were armed with anthing more lethal than a whistle and a trunheon at any time. And generally speaking those armed policemen were only armed when attending to specific tasks that made gunplay likely. As I understand it these days a majority of Police Constables are constantly armed on duty.

What do Britons think about the increased armament of their traditionally unarmed police forces. Do you folks feeel more or less secure with the situation?

The Sun has set indeed upon the British Empire. Requeat in Pax Great Britain.

[Rifleman336]

I'm suprised that the police didn't walk in to everybodys kitchen and rip it apart to find kitchen knives and then trash the rest of the house just to make sure.

I bet hamberger joints are big over their, for you can't eat a whole stake without cutting it!!!

Hard to believe the Brits were the the same people shuttering about invasion from the Germans, and screaming for arms and ammo in case they did invade. Instead Churchill recommended that all brits carry a bag of black pepper to throw in the face of the German soliders, and get their gun!!! YEAH,RIGHT!!!!! A bag of pepper vs. a MP-33 submachine gun in the hands of a trained solider!!!

Thats the differance between being a citizen versus being a subject. Not that we have reason to talk, day by day our politicans are wringing their hands in antisapation of one day, of using the constitution to wipe their butt after using the toliet!!!! There's no time like the present to fight for whats left before it's all gone!!!

Rifleman 336

[Nixterdemus]

I'm a tad old to be quotin' these fellers, however I think the Beastie Boys said it best:

"You gotta fight, for your right, to PAR-R-R-R-R-Tay"...

Sometimes a little levity goes a long ways.

[KirkD]

Well since we are quoting various famous people, a question I would like to ask the buffoons who are drafting these crazy UK laws is, in the immortal words of Dr. Phil, 'So, how's it working for ya?'

[Idahoser]

...Does anyone, even for one minute, think that those laws are [strike]going[/strike] intended to stop people knifing other people?

It ain't about knives. It's about control.

[Idahoser]

Um, before y'all get too worked up about the UK, keep in mind that any American boy in a Cub or Boy Scout uniform had better not "be prepared" in school with his trust Cub or Boy Scout knife. I'm 56, and can't imagine not having a pocket knife on me at any age.

When I was searching Fleabay for a new pocket knife for myself, I discovered the existence of the CRKT "Fireman" and "Police" versions of the M-16 (which I like a lot). Having a friend at work who's married to a fireman, I suggested this as a birthday gift. She said they were not allowed to carry knives.

[creosote]

Idahoser hit the nail on the HEAD!
creosote

[Jacko]

I really can't decide which is more stupid. The cops who go around arresting the kids in photos with knives, or the darned fool kids who knowing they are breaking the law still post photos of themselves doing so.

it just goes to show that folks need to be a bit more careful about what they say and show on-line. I hope Jacko doesn't get into trouble because of his confession.

Did y'all also notice that the police Constables going to arrest those kids were armed?

For something like 200 years, only about 10% of Britain's police force were armed with anthing more lethal than a whistle and a trunheon at any time. And generally speaking those armed policemen were only armed when attending to specific tasks that made gunplay likely. As I understand it these days a majority of Police Constables are constantly armed on duty.

What do Britons think about the increased armament of their traditionally unarmed police forces. Do you folks feeel more or less secure with the situation?

The Sun has set indeed upon the British Empire. Requeat in Pax Great Britain.

Yeah, I thought about admitting anything before I typed . She'll be right!- famous last words but the Aussie way

DOC, You reminded me of the the mirror laws the major Commonwealth Countries seem to follow each other with and the steady roll out of weapons the Queensland Police force carry's nowdays as the general publics ability to defend itself is compromised more and more.

When my Dad was a State Police Constable then a Federal Police officer in the late 50's, early 60's he carried a service pistol, a Batten, self defence training from his Army and Airforce years and most importantly the general publics respect , even the crims where more honest/respectfull .

To the point - I had the unfortunate duty of witnessing and helping a work collegue in a traffic accident today in which he was injured. The attending constables where packing utility belts Batman would have been proud to have at his dispossal . He had, Capsicum [Pepper] Spray, a Tazer, a Batten and a 9mm Glock as well as a plethora of other gadgets and gizmo's. No wonder this bloke looked like a body builder!

Personnely being a particularly large and ugly individual that can bluff and bluster with the best of them and actually having won my last 3 fights by several blocks I hold little fear for my safety but my wife and childeren are quite fearfull, misplaced or not it holds back their lives - a sad situation

regards Jacko

[Roland]

The brits can do as they like on their own island, it's their membership in the EU that gives me pause, most gun control suggestions on an EU level is supposedly introduce by britain, in this way they can directly affect my country in a negative way.

People should know there is a significant culturual gap between europe and britain. Last I checked, in France around 30% of the population owns a firearm, similar numbers in germany, and scandinavia is one of the more gun-dense regions in the world, Finland and Norway being in the top 5. And lets not forget switzerland... In england even before the bans starting in the 80s less than 1% of the population owned a firearm.

[Nath]

The brits can do as they like on their own island, it's their membership in the EU that gives me pause, most gun control suggestions on an EU level is supposedly introduce by britain, in this way they can directly affect my country in a negative way.

People should know there is a significant culturual gap between europe and britain. Last I checked, in France around 30% of the population owns a firearm, similar numbers in germany, and scandinavia is one of the more gun-dense regions in the world, Finland and Norway being in the top 5. And lets not forget switzerland... In england even before the bans starting in the 80s less than 1% of the population owned a firearm.

If you are asking me the EU is a big mistake, we are being forced together, ancient civilizations worlds apart being pushed together. No good will come from it.
Since the last war Europe has been getting on just fine.
Greetings Roland, from what I see of your land you are way way ahead of this crumby island and long may it stay so.

Nath.

[Streetstar]

Children brandishing dangerous weapons ! Oh the horror ! The horror

[gamekeeper]

The brits can do as they like on their own island, it's their membership in the EU that gives me pause, most gun control suggestions on an EU level is supposedly introduce by britain, in this way they can directly affect my country in a negative way.

People should know there is a significant culturual gap between europe and britain. Last I checked, in France around 30% of the population owns a firearm, similar numbers in germany, and scandinavia is one of the more gun-dense regions in the world, Finland and Norway being in the top 5. And lets not forget switzerland... In england even before the bans starting in the 80s less than 1% of the population owned a firearm.

If you are asking me the EU is a big mistake, we are being forced together, ancient civilizations worlds apart being pushed together. No good will come from it.
Since the last war Europe has been getting on just fine.
Greetings Roland, from what I see of your land you are way way ahead of this crumby island and long may it stay so.

Nath.

+ 1 Spot on Nath.

[Nath]

Tis true GK, we just use to visit each other and enjoy the different cultures and trade happily away with each other but laws are being forced on peoples that most just don't need, it'll just go pop one day! When will they learn.

N.

[Bruce Scott]

What do Britons think about the increased armament of their traditionally unarmed police forces. Do you folks feeel more or less secure with the situation?

Doc,
I well remember when the coppers here in Western Australia were unarmed. Where I grew up one policeman looked after the town and the surrounding shire. It was, as I recall, virtually crime free. It was VERY BIG news when the local butcher was pulled up DUI and a scuffle occurred. Those were very different times. We never locked our house or car as there was simply no need. Now all officers are armed and there are more scoundrels per acre than fleas on a wild dog.

[Doc Hudson]

If you are asking me the EU is a big mistake, we are being forced together, ancient civilizations worlds apart being pushed together. No good will come from it.
Since the last war Europe has been getting on just fine.
Greetings Roland, from what I see of your land you are way way ahead of this crumby island and long may it stay so.

Nath.

is true GK, we just use to visit each other and enjoy the different cultures and trade happily away with each other but laws are being forced on peoples that most just don't need, it'll just go pop one day! When will they learn.

To tell you the truth I thought Britain was making a fatl mistake joinint the EU.

Didn't you folks join and then withdraw from the European Common Market back in the 1960?

Let's face it there are way too many ethnic and cultural diffeerencesfor the EU to ever really be a success. I just wonder how long this United Europe business will last.

[38 Special]

Such laws that we brits have to follow huh !! make of it what you will. They banned guns some years back and you know what , gun crimes escalated.

The CJA 1988 mainly relates to carrying knives in public places, Section 139 being the most important.

"It is an offence for any person, without lawful authority or good reason, to have with him in a public place, any article which has a blade or is sharply pointed except for a folding pocket-knife which has a cutting edge to its blade not exceeding 3 inches." [CJA 1988 section 139(1)]

The phrase "good reason" is intended to allow for "common sense" possession of knives, so that it is legal to carry a knife if there is a bona fide reason to do so. Examples of bona fide reasons which have been accepted include: a knife required for ones trade (e.g. a chefs knife), as part of a national costume (e.g. a sgian dubh), or for religious reasons (e.g. a Sikh Kirpan).

In this case, public place is meant as anywhere accessible to the public, so for example a private campsite, which members of the public must book to use, is a public place. Also, knives should only be carried to and from and used at the location where they are needed. For example, leaving a knife in a car for use when you go fishing would be illegal. It should be taken back into the house each time you use the car (other than to go fishing). [1]

The special exception which exists in the Criminal Justice Act 1988 (s139) for folding knives (pocket knives) is another "common sense" measure accepting that some small knives are carried for general utility however even a folding pocket knife of less than 3" (76mm) may still be considered an offensive weapon if carried or used for that purpose. It was a long held common belief that a folding knife must be non-locking for this provision to apply.

A Crown Court case (Harris v DPP), ruled (case law). A lock knife for all legal purposes, is the same as a fixed blade knife. A folding pocket knife must be readily foldable at all times. If it has a mechanism that prevents folding, it's a lock knife (or for legal purposes, a fixed blade) The Court of Appeal (REGINA - v - DESMOND GARCIA DEEGAN 1998) upheld the Harris ruling stating that "folding was held to mean non-locking". No leave to appeal was granted.