OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
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OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
I'm working on some mid-range loads for the Blackhawk, and experimenting with this powder.
The bullets I'm using range from 255 grains to 280 grains, lead, ranging from BHN 10 to about BHN 18.
I've seen in some sources (Speer # 14, for one) where the use of HS - 6 is paired with Large Pistol Magnum primers, and some (most) just call for Large Pistol primers.
Anybody experimented with this powder ? Other powders I've been trying for these mid-range loads are Unique and Universal, but I'm thinking that this HS - 6 might be a not too well known jewel. Any help here is greatly appreciated. - DixieBoy
The bullets I'm using range from 255 grains to 280 grains, lead, ranging from BHN 10 to about BHN 18.
I've seen in some sources (Speer # 14, for one) where the use of HS - 6 is paired with Large Pistol Magnum primers, and some (most) just call for Large Pistol primers.
Anybody experimented with this powder ? Other powders I've been trying for these mid-range loads are Unique and Universal, but I'm thinking that this HS - 6 might be a not too well known jewel. Any help here is greatly appreciated. - DixieBoy
When the People Fear Their Government There is Tyranny; When the Government Fears the People There is Liberty.
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Anybody ?
When the People Fear Their Government There is Tyranny; When the Government Fears the People There is Liberty.
- CowboyTutt
- Advanced Levergunner
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- Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:27 pm
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Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Yes indeed, I do! My favorite plinking/home defense load. I was looking for something slightly more powerful than standard 45 Colt loads but not full +P. Using the Hornady 300 grain XTP (non mag) bullet, 10.2 grains HS6 and Win LP primer. Load to 1.58 COL for about 950 fps out of a 5 1/2" Bisley. Be sure your cylinder chambers have been reamed to .4515 or .452 just in case you have one of those pesky undersized Rugers as it drives pressures up. The Winchester primers are plenty hot enough or you could try a CCI350 if you wanted.
-Tutt
-Tutt
Last edited by CowboyTutt on Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"It ain't dead! As long as there's ONE COWBOY taking care of ONE COW, it ain't dead!!!" (the Cowboy Way)
-Monte Walsh (Selleck version)
"These battered wings still kick up dust." -Peter Gabriel
-Monte Walsh (Selleck version)
"These battered wings still kick up dust." -Peter Gabriel
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Thanks Cowboy ! I've been poking around through manuals and articles in Handloader for a few weeks now, looking for more information.
The load you describe here is right in the ballpark for me too. I'm not looking for a Cape Buffalo killer here, just an accurate mid-range load.
Thanks again. - DixieBoy
The load you describe here is right in the ballpark for me too. I'm not looking for a Cape Buffalo killer here, just an accurate mid-range load.
Thanks again. - DixieBoy
When the People Fear Their Government There is Tyranny; When the Government Fears the People There is Liberty.
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Cowboy - A P.S. here. I have already been down that road with the undersize throats. Bought a reamer through Brownell's and opened them up.
It knocks me out that Ruger, with all of the resources at their disposal, cannot seem to get these darn throats right on the Blackhawks in .45 Colt.
Oh well, it makes for continuing sales for the reamer makers and gunsmiths.
- DixieBoy
It knocks me out that Ruger, with all of the resources at their disposal, cannot seem to get these darn throats right on the Blackhawks in .45 Colt.
Oh well, it makes for continuing sales for the reamer makers and gunsmiths.
- DixieBoy
When the People Fear Their Government There is Tyranny; When the Government Fears the People There is Liberty.
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Yes. I use the HS6/260 SWC load in the very bottom graph of this article, except I use MO Bullet's 255 grain SWC. I like it real well in my Old Vaquero and it's great in our Rossi Model 92 as well. Windage deflection in the revolver has since been corrected.
http://www.customsixguns.com/writings/d ... e_myth.htm
http://www.customsixguns.com/writings/d ... e_myth.htm
People were smarter before the Internet, or imbeciles were harder to notice.
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
I was thinking the same thing about medium loads in 45LC and 44 special. I read over on the rugerforum .com that John Linebaugh recommended this powder for medium loads in the 45LC.
Says Linebaugh: "My personal loads include only 3 loads that I have settled on for all my handgun shooting. All are safe in Rugers and have been recommended to hundreds of shooters, All report good results and accuracy".
Powder Gr. Bullet Velocity Use
WW 231 8 gr. 260 cast 900 fps defense/plinker/big game
HS 6 13 gr 260 cast 1050 fps big game
HS 6 13 gr 310/320 cast 1000 fps big game
H-110 24 260 cast 1280 fps big game
H-110 24 310/320 cast 1250 fps big game/ dangerous game
Says Linebaugh: "My personal loads include only 3 loads that I have settled on for all my handgun shooting. All are safe in Rugers and have been recommended to hundreds of shooters, All report good results and accuracy".
Powder Gr. Bullet Velocity Use
WW 231 8 gr. 260 cast 900 fps defense/plinker/big game
HS 6 13 gr 260 cast 1050 fps big game
HS 6 13 gr 310/320 cast 1000 fps big game
H-110 24 260 cast 1280 fps big game
H-110 24 310/320 cast 1250 fps big game/ dangerous game
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Sarge and BenT - Thanks guys. You know, I had that John Linebaugh article here but didn't think to look at it again for mid-range loads. After seeing you all's replies I dug it up, and there's that honey of a load I've been looking for.
Seems that it ought to be well within the safe zone, pressure wise, too. Thanks again. - DixieBoy
Seems that it ought to be well within the safe zone, pressure wise, too. Thanks again. - DixieBoy
When the People Fear Their Government There is Tyranny; When the Government Fears the People There is Liberty.
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Well, I guess I'm going to have to get a camera and learn how to post pics this summer.
Followed you guys' advice and did some shooting today with HS - 6 loads, running from 11.5 grains up to 13.0 grains. Made up 3 cylinders full, of 11.5, 12.0, 12.5, and 13.0 grains of HS-6, with Starline cases (1.270''), WLP primers, and 255 grain Mid-Kansas SWC's.
Accuracy was non-existent in my Blackhawk at 11.5 grains, a little better but still erratic at 12.0 grains, and suddenly, at 12.5 grains, OH BOY !!
Started actually hitting where I was aiming. This Blackhawk has been a challenge since I got it: really tight chamber throats needed reaming, sloppy lock up, you know, all the usual Ruger stuff. But I love the Blackhawks, and after a little bit more tuning I might just have a decent shooter on my hands.
Thinking that cutting an 11 degree forcing cone is my next chore, given that I'm wanting to shoot lead SWC's, Keiths, and the RCBS-SAA bullets pretty much exclusively in her.
I'm going back out tomorrow with a batch of 12.5 grain loads, and 13.0 grain loads to see which works better for me. Today might just be some of the most fun I've had with this revolver since I bought her. Thanks again to you guys for steering me back to Linebaugh's article and the 13.0 load. - DixieBoy
Followed you guys' advice and did some shooting today with HS - 6 loads, running from 11.5 grains up to 13.0 grains. Made up 3 cylinders full, of 11.5, 12.0, 12.5, and 13.0 grains of HS-6, with Starline cases (1.270''), WLP primers, and 255 grain Mid-Kansas SWC's.
Accuracy was non-existent in my Blackhawk at 11.5 grains, a little better but still erratic at 12.0 grains, and suddenly, at 12.5 grains, OH BOY !!
Started actually hitting where I was aiming. This Blackhawk has been a challenge since I got it: really tight chamber throats needed reaming, sloppy lock up, you know, all the usual Ruger stuff. But I love the Blackhawks, and after a little bit more tuning I might just have a decent shooter on my hands.
Thinking that cutting an 11 degree forcing cone is my next chore, given that I'm wanting to shoot lead SWC's, Keiths, and the RCBS-SAA bullets pretty much exclusively in her.
I'm going back out tomorrow with a batch of 12.5 grain loads, and 13.0 grain loads to see which works better for me. Today might just be some of the most fun I've had with this revolver since I bought her. Thanks again to you guys for steering me back to Linebaugh's article and the 13.0 load. - DixieBoy
When the People Fear Their Government There is Tyranny; When the Government Fears the People There is Liberty.
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Glad to hear it's working out, Dixieboy. Personally, I'd get that cylinder reamed before I messed with the forcing cone. Anyhow keep us posted on your results!
People were smarter before the Internet, or imbeciles were harder to notice.
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Dixie Boy,
I've tried HS6 and 7 extensively a few years ago. I really wanted to make them work but I just couldn't. My mid range load for all my vaquero's and blackhawks is 18.5 2400;top loads are H110 and bottom end loads are Unique.I'm afraid that w/ so many I was unable to just narrow it down on a "each gun shoots best w/ what load basis " but every one of them will shoot these loads very good. Also the HS6 seems to have very sharp recoil that I just didn't have w/ the other powder choices. YMMV
I've tried HS6 and 7 extensively a few years ago. I really wanted to make them work but I just couldn't. My mid range load for all my vaquero's and blackhawks is 18.5 2400;top loads are H110 and bottom end loads are Unique.I'm afraid that w/ so many I was unable to just narrow it down on a "each gun shoots best w/ what load basis " but every one of them will shoot these loads very good. Also the HS6 seems to have very sharp recoil that I just didn't have w/ the other powder choices. YMMV
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
gimdandy - I've looked at the mid-range loads listed with 2400 while searching for these HS-6 loads. Got a question for you: how would you describe the recoil of your 18.5 grain 2400 load compared with the 13.0 grains of HS-6 load ?
The recoil of the HS-6 load does seem a little snappy, but not overly so. More than anything, I'm happy to finally see bullets going where they're aimed !
After reaming the chamber throats months ago I still was having trouble getting even close to accurate loads until I upped the power level slightly. I think this is due to the need for a bit more pressure to get properly sized bullets to slug up.
The top power levels for the Blackhawk are not what I'm after with the HS-6, just enough "ooomph" to slug up the bullets and get 'em on target. I'll look into these 2400 loads now that you've got me thinking about it.
By the way, for the guys who've used HS -7, I read that this powder is discontinued by Hodgdon's. You might want to get your hands on some while you can. Hopefully they won't stop making the HS-6; I'm enjoying this powder right now. - DixieBoy
The recoil of the HS-6 load does seem a little snappy, but not overly so. More than anything, I'm happy to finally see bullets going where they're aimed !
After reaming the chamber throats months ago I still was having trouble getting even close to accurate loads until I upped the power level slightly. I think this is due to the need for a bit more pressure to get properly sized bullets to slug up.
The top power levels for the Blackhawk are not what I'm after with the HS-6, just enough "ooomph" to slug up the bullets and get 'em on target. I'll look into these 2400 loads now that you've got me thinking about it.
By the way, for the guys who've used HS -7, I read that this powder is discontinued by Hodgdon's. You might want to get your hands on some while you can. Hopefully they won't stop making the HS-6; I'm enjoying this powder right now. - DixieBoy
When the People Fear Their Government There is Tyranny; When the Government Fears the People There is Liberty.
- CowboyTutt
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 3716
- Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:27 pm
- Location: Mission Viejo, CA
Re: OT - Anybody use HS - 6 with .45 Colt loads ?
Hi Dixieboy, I hope I haven't steered you wrong. I'm using a much different bullet (300 XTP non mag) and just wanted something slightly stronger than original 45 Colt loads. The Hodgdon load data from their manual was for a 300 grain Sierra JFP and with 10 grains of powder should only be doing 730 fps out of a 7 1/2" barrel and using the Winchester LP primer. Their pressure data suggests this load is at around 13,700 cup. I was surprised when my velocity was significantly higher (around 900 fps) with the 300 XTP. Clearly, my load is operating at higher pressure. My point is without a chronograph, its hard to "see" what is happening so be cautious. This load has been accurate enough for plinking so I confess I'm baffled with your results.
It could be a mismatch of bullet hardness to load as you mention but you also stated you were using different Bhn bullets.
Keith bullets are sort of picky. I had Frank at Mt. Baldy bullets make up some 360 grain hard cast Keith bullets with gas checked at about Bhn 20 for +P 45 Colt loads using H110. This type of bullet/hardness and load was recommended to me by Mic McPherson for long range pistol shooting. Out of my 5 1/2" Bisley these were doing 1150 fps (the transonic barrier) right where they should be for a max load. Strangely this load was not accurate at all. Thinking I had created a bad batch of ammo I gave them to Old Savage who put them into his '92 Rossi/Puma lever action in 45 Colt. The same loads were doing at least 1300 fps out of his rifle, well over the transonic barrier. They were the most accurate loads he had ever shot through his rifle.
I told Mic McPherson about this later, and he told me the story of a customer who had a terribly inaccurate Keith bullet load/rifle and disposable income. This man kept rebarreling his rifle with faster and faster twist rates trying to make it accurate, all the while ignoring Mic's advice about either speeding up or slowing down his load so the Keith bullet was over or under the transonic barrier at muzzle velocity. The customer eventually ended up with a 1 in 12 twist or something horrendously too fast and this barrel started to shoot accurately but was not what you would call a tack driver.
He eventually took Mic's advice, and the rifle turned out to shoot much better.
So, I think my own Bisley loads were probably experiencing the same transonic phenomena with Keith bullets.
Not sure that this story is at all relevant to your situation, but I thought I would muddy the waters some more for you.
-Tutt
It could be a mismatch of bullet hardness to load as you mention but you also stated you were using different Bhn bullets.
Keith bullets are sort of picky. I had Frank at Mt. Baldy bullets make up some 360 grain hard cast Keith bullets with gas checked at about Bhn 20 for +P 45 Colt loads using H110. This type of bullet/hardness and load was recommended to me by Mic McPherson for long range pistol shooting. Out of my 5 1/2" Bisley these were doing 1150 fps (the transonic barrier) right where they should be for a max load. Strangely this load was not accurate at all. Thinking I had created a bad batch of ammo I gave them to Old Savage who put them into his '92 Rossi/Puma lever action in 45 Colt. The same loads were doing at least 1300 fps out of his rifle, well over the transonic barrier. They were the most accurate loads he had ever shot through his rifle.
I told Mic McPherson about this later, and he told me the story of a customer who had a terribly inaccurate Keith bullet load/rifle and disposable income. This man kept rebarreling his rifle with faster and faster twist rates trying to make it accurate, all the while ignoring Mic's advice about either speeding up or slowing down his load so the Keith bullet was over or under the transonic barrier at muzzle velocity. The customer eventually ended up with a 1 in 12 twist or something horrendously too fast and this barrel started to shoot accurately but was not what you would call a tack driver.
He eventually took Mic's advice, and the rifle turned out to shoot much better.
So, I think my own Bisley loads were probably experiencing the same transonic phenomena with Keith bullets.
Not sure that this story is at all relevant to your situation, but I thought I would muddy the waters some more for you.
-Tutt
"It ain't dead! As long as there's ONE COWBOY taking care of ONE COW, it ain't dead!!!" (the Cowboy Way)
-Monte Walsh (Selleck version)
"These battered wings still kick up dust." -Peter Gabriel
-Monte Walsh (Selleck version)
"These battered wings still kick up dust." -Peter Gabriel