Please recommend a hunting peep sight.

[savagefan]

Hi me peepers are getting a bit slow especially at twilight. Rifle is a 1956 Win 94 30-30, main purpose for the sight is deer hunting, 100 yds or less. All opinions enthusiastically welcomed, thanx.

[TedH]

I like the Williams FP. You can use the aperture for longer distance precision shooting, or unscrew it and use the larger threaded hole for a fast ghost ring type sight.

[AJMD429]

I posted lots of comments and pictures down a bit on the first page of this thread:

http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... =1&t=20342

I like the Williams FP 'ghosted' by removing the aperture, but the Marble's is the best 'fast' sight I've ever used; it's just hard to adjust (it adjusts the same way the factory open sights do - but I don't like that way).

I hope the pics in the above thread help some...

[medicdave]

I would prefer a steel Lyman they just look right, the Williams look wrong on a classic gun like that.

[mod71alaska]

I posted lots of comments and pictures down a bit on the first page of this thread:

http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... =1&t=20342

Doc, that's a very informative posting. I missed it before. Good work...thanks!

[jlchucker]

I would prefer a steel Lyman they just look right, the Williams look wrong on a classic gun like that.

I agree, as long as it's the old Lyman when made out of steel and machined with some precision. The Lyman design looks like it belongs on a 94, takes up less room, and will accept Williams arpertures. That having been said, the aluminum Lymans that they've made in the past few years are a hit-or-miss proposition. I put a couple of these on a 94 and a Rossi 92. I discovered that the part that holds the arperture had a bit of wobble, fore and aft. I called Lyman, and a lady on the other end told me that they were built with some movement in them. I was astounded to hear that. Whoever heard of a rear sight that is designed to wobble? I used Williams FP sights for years. They don't look as nice, but have click adjustments like the Lyman--only a bit less handy. They may not be pretty, but they are a SOLID design. Whatever happened to Lyman gunsight quality, like they had when they made them out of real American steel, on real American machine tools?

[J Miller]

I've used both Williams and Lyman. I prefer the Lyman and have both the old steel and newer Aluminum.

They should be tight with no slop, if they are loose or sloppy just write Lyman a letter and send it back. The phone operators are basically worthless.

For a gun / cartridge such as the Win 94 in 30-30 I usually use a Williams FP. Set it - forget it. Once you get that combo sighted in you'll almost never touch the sight again.

For a handgun caliber such as my Win 94AE Trapper in .45 Colt I prefer the Lyman with the quick elevation adjuster. For the trajectory on that one push button release can save you a lot of clicking.

Joe

[jlchucker]

I've used both Williams and Lyman. I prefer the Lyman and have both the old steel and newer Aluminum.

They should be tight with no slop, if they are loose or sloppy just write Lyman a letter and send it back. The phone operators are basically worthless.

For a gun / cartridge such as the Win 94 in 30-30 I usually use a Williams FP. Set it - forget it. Once you get that combo sighted in you'll almost never touch the sight again.

For a handgun caliber such as my Win 94AE Trapper in .45 Colt I prefer the Lyman with the quick elevation adjuster. For the trajectory on that one push button release can save you a lot of clicking.

Joe

Joe, it's too late to send my Lymans back now--time has passed, and somebody wanted those sights worse than I did. you're ablsolutely right about phone operators at Lyman being basically worthless. These days you can't even get through to the worthless ones, most of the time. I've grown less and less impressed with that company of late. Even their bullet molds, which once were the Cadillacs of the industry, are now a Take-your-chance-in-getting-a-good-one proposition. I tried to order a Lyman Great Plains lefty hunter barrel from them a couple of weeks ago--their website wouldn't load, and their phone was set on permanent elevator music. I ended up getting one from Midsouth the other day. We'll see how it shoots within the next couple of weeks.

Williams FP sights are great. You're right--once you get them set they stay that way.

JLChucker

[Blaine]

http://www.xssights.com/store/rifle.html
Probably the strongest and least likely to "slip".

[Pete44ru]

The Williams Fire Sight Peep Set



.

[Blaine]

A Williams 5D being drug thru the really thick stuff will pick up leaves, twigs, etc on and under it everytime. The FP or XO does away with that.

[Chuck 100 yd]

also don't forget to look at the Skinner sight for hunting. I have one on my .44 Mag. Marlin 1894 and it is just great.
http://skinnersights.com/

[OJ]

I like the Williams FP. You can use the aperture for longer distance precision shooting, or unscrew it and use the larger threaded hole for a fast ghost ring type sight.

Ditto -



I just hadn't removed the aperture here but I remove all apertures for the ghost ring





Had to talk my gunsmith into D/T my 95 - I think he thought that rifle should be just for display - my guns are all shooters and any enjoying the sight of it can do so at the range -



I think it's fine for accurate shooting at 100 yards - I zeroed the sights to point of aim at 25 yards and "fine tuned" it at 100 yards for 2" above POA with the ghost ring - I make no claim to be anything but an average shooter - but I shoot every week and started shooting in 1932 - these were shot using a "fist rest" on a table on the 100 yard range - all done with less than one box of ammo- I credit the ghost ring aperture - my 80+ year old eyes like the Williams sights -



Other singles were off hand shots - hard to beat the Williams ghost ring - IMO

[claybob86]

also don't forget to look at the Skinner sight for hunting. I have one on my .44 Mag. Marlin 1894 and it is just great.
http://skinnersights.com/

+1!

[Pete44ru]

FWIW, AFAIK the Skinner receiver peep sights are all top-mounts for Marlin inline scope mount holes, and will not fit anl Winchester 94's TE or AE.

.

[Hobie]

Steel Lyman or Redfield (premium price), Williams FP 94-36, Lyman 66LA, Williams 5D 94-36, Skinner, XS, Williams WGRS in about that order of preference best to "worst".

[LeverBob]

Lyman for me.....

LB

[BAGTIC]

I like apertures a lot. In fact I have replaced almost all my scopes with peeps. My most used model is the FP but I like to use it with the Merit adjustable iris aperture.

[FWiedner]

I am a fan of XS sights for hunting.

They work, sighting is fast, and it's not like there's a miniature bench vice screwed down on top of your hunting rifle.

Only issue is that it's hard to adjust them in the field on the fly, if you're the sort who just has to fiddle with stuff.

I believe that the XS sights can be ordered with threads to insert smaller (Williams, I think) apertures.

[savagefan]

Thanx so much for the answers, just came back from the bush with my young lads and my Winchester. We had a great time, my 5 yr old called in a doe with a Primus Fawn bleat but blew it when he hollered "Shoot Daddy"! He was wearing 30db muffs and didn't realize how loud he was, so whoops! I've hunted with bolt guns for years and I have my favorites with good reasons. This is the first year I've dragged out the lever for hunting and I can't get over how easy it is to carry and the pointability is perfect (ya I'm preaching to the choir right?) I know when I shoulder the gun in low light the sights line up but I don't see the front as well as I'd like hence this thread. Will I need to drill/tap for the Williams or Lyman sights?

[AJMD429]

I know when I shoulder the gun in low light the sights line up but I don't see the front as well as I'd like hence this thread.

I'd strongly consider a Williams Firesight, or other 'fiberoptic' front sight.

I've used the Williams ones, as they are often available with their FP rear sights as a package from MidwayUSA.com at no added cost. I bought a pack of fiber-optic strands in various colors (also from MidwayUSA or Brownells, I forget), and I usually clip out the 'orange' that they come with, and replace it with green (hunting in daylight) or yellow (hunting in twilight), unless I'm going to mostly plink or target shoot, when I still like the orange the best.

[savagefan]

And do the Williams rears require drilling the receiver for mounting on a top eject Win 94?

[J Miller]

And do the Williams rears require drilling the receiver for mounting on a top eject Win 94?

Win 94s from about 1952 or 53 to the introduction of the AE models are factory drilled and tapped for side mount receiver sights.
Williams FP or 5D 94/36 or Lyman 66A is the correct rear sight for them.
The Williams FP model does also come with the fiber optic front sight.

Joe

[savagefan]

Awesome! Thank you so much.

[savagefan]

Got the sights today, put them on and can't believe the difference! Thanx for all the help guys, if the snow eases up I might even take it to the range this weekend, yeehaw! Williams are great people to deal with.

[El Chivo]

OK I know you already made your choice, but if this thread is for future reference, I would pick the cheapest/smallest Williams sight - the WGRS I believe.

You set it for your point-blank range and keep it there, and it accepts the apertures. It has infinite settings, as precise as you want, then nail it down. It's small and light and not boxy, sits quite low, and is very sturdy.

The thing is, for hunting you aren't really going to use the clicks the FP has, so why defile your rifle with a clunky receiver sight? Now if it's for the range or for silhouette, that's a different story.

[Mike D.]

In 1956 Winchester 94s were drilled to accept either the Lyman 56 or the than recently introduced 66. IMO, nothing looks classier than a fine old Lyman 56 mounted on a vintage levergun.

[savagefan]

OK I know you already made your choice, but if this thread is for future reference, I would pick the cheapest/smallest Williams sight - the WGRS I believe.

You set it for your point-blank range and keep it there, and it accepts the apertures. It has infinite settings, as precise as you want, then nail it down. It's small and light and not boxy, sits quite low, and is very sturdy.

The thing is, for hunting you aren't really going to use the clicks the FP has, so why defile your rifle with a clunky receiver sight? Now if it's for the range or for silhouette, that's a different story.

I have the catalog on my lap and they don't list WGRS for a Win 94. Probably cuz the sight uses two drilled/tapped holes on the side of the receiver.

[BigSky56]

Ive found that the williams twilight peep sure helps at dawn or dusk and if you hunt dark timber, it has a brass ring inset for gathering light for the peep they have them in various diameters and opening sizes. danny

[AJMD429]

The thing is, for hunting you aren't really going to use the clicks the FP has, so why defile your rifle with a clunky receiver sight? Now if it's for the range or for silhouette, that's a different story.

I agree, although I wind up fiddling/changing/adjusting and swapping my sights/scopes from gun to gun that I almost do need the 'clicks' more than I'd like to admit. Even within the relatively narrow domain of whitetail hunting, I haven't yet reached the Nirvana state of "one man, one gun, one load", or even come close. Maybe someday...

[J Miller]

OK I know you already made your choice, but if this thread is for future reference, I would pick the cheapest/smallest Williams sight - the WGRS I believe.

You set it for your point-blank range and keep it there, and it accepts the apertures. It has infinite settings, as precise as you want, then nail it down. It's small and light and not boxy, sits quite low, and is very sturdy.

The thing is, for hunting you aren't really going to use the clicks the FP has, so why defile your rifle with a clunky receiver sight? Now if it's for the range or for silhouette, that's a different story.

I respectfully disagree with almost everything in the quote. First even the steel Lyman 56 and 66 weigh next to nothing nor are they clunky. Their settings are easy to make, repeatable, and on the occasion you need to adjust your sights, you do not need to guess and move then do it again like you do the WGRS and 5D sights. Once locked down the adjustments stay put until you need to change them. This is especially true with the Williams FP models. That's why they called them "Fool Proof".
And the installation of a side mount receiver sight is an enhancement not a defilement to a Win 94.
If you want to discuss defilements, then we go to the AE, CBS, Tang S, scopes and that sort of nonsense.



Joe

[OJ]

OK I know you already made your choice, but if this thread is for future reference, I would pick the cheapest/smallest Williams sight - the WGRS I believe.

You set it for your point-blank range and keep it there, and it accepts the apertures. It has infinite settings, as precise as you want, then nail it down. It's small and light and not boxy, sits quite low, and is very sturdy.

The thing is, for hunting you aren't really going to use the clicks the FP has, so why defile your rifle with a clunky receiver sight? Now if it's for the range or for silhouette, that's a different story.

I respectfully disagree with almost everything in the quote. First even the steel Lyman 56 and 66 weigh next to nothing nor are they clunky. Their settings are easy to make, repeatable, and on the occasion you need to adjust your sights, you do not need to guess and move then do it again like you do the WGRS and 5D sights. Once locked down the adjustments stay put until you need to change them. This is especially true with the Williams FP models. That's why they called them "Fool Proof".
And the installation of a side mount receiver sight is an enhancement not a defilement to a Win 94.
If you want to discuss defilements, then we go to the AE, CBS, Tang S, scopes and that sort of nonsense.



Joe

I'm in total agreement with that - I learned the hard way - by using a WRGS and, even though I zero once and shoot there forever - the small extra cost (amortized over the years of use) of the FP is well worth it.

What I paid for the WRGS I just write off as "tuition", bit the bullet, and replaced it with a FP..

[El Chivo]

I have the catalog on my lap and they don't list WGRS for a Win 94. Probably cuz the sight uses two drilled/tapped holes on the side of the receiver.

Sorry, I was thinking Marlin. I ended up getting the Ashley ghost ring sight for the Winchester 94, nice sight but a little too high, and I think you adjust the height by turning the whole post, which means you can't settle on an adjustment in between two half turns.

They do offer an extra post with threads to accept standard apertures, so you're not stuck with the large ring if you don't want it.

I'm sure the Lymans are nice, but I've seen a couple of bent Lymans in the silhouette club and the owners were anxious to discard them and switch to FP's.

[savagefan]

Came across this today.
http://www.realguns.com/articles/281.htm

[Old Ironsights]

I like apertures a lot. In fact I have replaced almost all my scopes with peeps. My most used model is the FP but I like to use it with the Merit adjustable iris aperture.

+1

Whatever base you use, the Merit (Hunter) is the way to go.

[savagefan]

I got drawn for moose today, will hopefully put my 30-30 with Williams FP to good use this October.

[Hobie]

I have the catalog on my lap and they don't list WGRS for a Win 94. Probably cuz the sight uses two drilled/tapped holes on the side of the receiver.

Sorry, I was thinking Marlin. I ended up getting the Ashley ghost ring sight for the Winchester 94, nice sight but a little too high, and I think you adjust the height by turning the whole post, which means you can't settle on an adjustment in between two half turns.

They do offer an extra post with threads to accept standard apertures, so you're not stuck with the large ring if you don't want it.

I'm sure the Lymans are nice, but I've seen a couple of bent Lymans in the silhouette club and the owners were anxious to discard them and switch to FP's.

i bet they were the aluminum version. The thing is that I have followed or lead others through the woods and one of those guys bent his barrel even though I went through the same space, leading, without an additional scratch. Some folks are just hard on their stuff. I've known infantrymen who, I swear, could bust an anvil with a rubber mallet. To blame the sight is ridiculous, such folks could break off an integral sight.