Rossi 92 - My next move

[Scottyboy67]

Hello,
This is my first visit to the forum, but I have been following for a little bit. I bought a Rossi 92 .357 ss 20" as a companion to my Security Six .357 ss 4".
I shot the 92 today and... I was disappointed. Man, I really wanted it to be fantastic, but alas...
First, it looked great. I was really pleased, and next to my Ruger, I was all smiles. So, I grabbed some ammo and took it to the range. I was using the Remington .357 125gr, hornady lever .357 140gr, and umc Remington .357 125 gr hollow, umc Remington .38 125 gr.
So, I liked the feel, weight, balance. I was indoors and the max range was only 25yds. But I was impressed with its accuracy out of the box. However, there were issues.
1) The ammo would hang up the gate. Not that it felt stiff, but it actually felt like the casing all ready loaded was preventing others from pushing the gate down. Had to shoot the gun to get them out.
2) The Remington 357 cartridges would hang up as they were lifted into the barrel.
3) The 38s wouldn't, but would remain in the barrel.
4) Hornady feed best and ejected well.
5) As the barrel heated, the casings seemed to stick when the eject in general.
So I got Steve Young’s video and kit and I am waiting for it to arrive. If it works well and the issues with the gun are resolved, I’ll be happy. But here is my question.
Why would Rossi release a gun that doesn’t seem “finished”? What would it increase the cost of the gun to have it slicked up during the manufacturing? My fear is that I will go through the steps of fixing the gun and there will be a more significant flaw and my tampering will void my ability to return it (bought it from Bud’s).
I am relatively handy, but was wondering if I shouldn’t just send it out to get the work done.
Well, enough crying from me, I would be grateful for your thoughts.

Scott

[pwl44m]

Welcome, take Ur shoes off and sit a spell. Just shot My Uberti 66 carbine 38 sp today. It functioned without a hitch.It is a little stiff on open and close.
Let us know how the video works. Thinking about getting one for the Uberti and My 94 trapper in 45c

[AJMD429]

The six of us in our family have bought a variety of Rossi's over the past four or five years, and so far all have functioned pretty well, with the 'usual' non-smooth stuff that either wear and regular use, or some judicious emory-papering, will take care of.

I think sometimes you just get one that got picked off someone's work-station while they were on break, and the cart came by with bins to fill to take to the next work-station.

I'll bet you find the GUN is basically sound and functional, and just needs some screws tightened, parts de-burred, and so on...so don't give up yet!

I've had more disappointment with Marlins lately than Rossi's, although they've eventually smoothed out and made excellent shooters.

If all else fails, and I know you shouldn't "have to" do it, you can send it TO NKJ, and I'm sure it will come back fit as a fiddle, for a price that added to the gun's modest cost, still will leave you less broke than if you'd bought many other brands, and they could just as well have had similar problems anyway. Hardly any brand is exempt these days.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

Hello,
This is my first visit to the forum, but I have been following for a little bit. I bought a Rossi 92 .357 ss 20" as a companion to my Security Six .357 ss 4".
I shot the 92 today and... I was disappointed. Man, I really wanted it to be fantastic, but alas...
First, it looked great. I was really pleased, and next to my Ruger, I was all smiles. So, I grabbed some ammo and took it to the range. I was using the Remington .357 125gr, hornady lever .357 140gr, and umc Remington .357 125 gr hollow, umc Remington .38 125 gr.
So, I liked the feel, weight, balance. I was indoors and the max range was only 25yds. But I was impressed with its accuracy out of the box. However, there were issues.
1) The ammo would hang up the gate. Not that it felt stiff, but it actually felt like the casing all ready loaded was preventing others from pushing the gate down. Had to shoot the gun to get them out.
2) The Remington 357 cartridges would hang up as they were lifted into the barrel.
3) The 38s wouldn't, but would remain in the barrel.
4) Hornady feed best and ejected well.
5) As the barrel heated, the casings seemed to stick when the eject in general.
So I got Steve Young’s video and kit and I am waiting for it to arrive. If it works well and the issues with the gun are resolved, I’ll be happy. But here is my question.
Why would Rossi release a gun that doesn’t seem “finished”? What would it increase the cost of the gun to have it slicked up during the manufacturing? My fear is that I will go through the steps of fixing the gun and there will be a more significant flaw and my tampering will void my ability to return it (bought it from Bud’s).
I am relatively handy, but was wondering if I shouldn’t just send it out to get the work done.
Well, enough crying from me, I would be grateful for your thoughts.

Scott

Hi Scottyboy,
Welcome to the fire and thanks so much for purchasing my stuff. Before you get totally put out with this gun and If you haven’t done so it would be a good idea to try several different loading. There are so many different brands and shapes and OAL`s of 38`s and 357m’s out there it’s impossible for one gun to cover them all. All our leverguns are length and bullet shape sensitive to some degree. Like semi-auto handguns, they can be picky about what they will run and the faster we try to go with them the more these problems tend to show up. What Rossi, Marlin and Winchester have done with these 38/357 guns is compromise the timing to handle both lengths. Generally, they don’t work well with really long 357’s or really short 38’s. Bullet shape can have a bearing too. Some don’t work well with semi-wad cutters or any bullet that has an exposed driving bands or poor crimps to hang up on.
If you try different ammos and it still gives you problems then yes the gun may need some timing work. If that’s the case let me know and I’ll get you the info about prices, other options and lead times.
As for not extracting that may require so adjustment of the extractor. Do the DVD stuff and if it persist let me know.

If you have any questions please feel free to call or email.

[GregT]

Hello! I had just written a long reply re this discussion and when I hit "post" I found I had been disconnected by the ISP as I was not "active" after 10 minutes! If there is any way of rcovering this, let me know...
Howver, the gist of what I finally came to saying is that in addition to my two .45 Rossi's that I got from Rossi warranty after they couldn't or wouldn't fix the initial two I sent them, I bought a Rossi 16" barrel carbine in .357/.38. . I have never had any trouble with this one, in fact it shoots and ejects nicely. I have always used the longer .357 casing in this carbine. If you shoot the shorter .38 special round, the fouling from the shorter casing will foul up the front of the longer .357 chamber, making extraction and ejection hard or impossible. If this occurs, the only way out is to spotlessly clean the chamber. Could this be perhaps the problem you are having? I also had extraction/ejection problems with both of my .45 Colt Rossi's. I made the mistake of sending both to Florida for warranty repair. After two months of me hounding them, they finally spit out two rifles that work. I could not be happier with the rifles now, but that Rossi "Customer Service" is the absolute worst experience I have ever had in over 40 years of working with guns. This includes the 15 years I was in the retail sales of firearms, our shop averaging out about 1500 guns per year! Any questions I will be glad to answer off list. Send your rife to Steve if necessary, that's what I will do now if they need further work!
Greg T.
Hayward. Wi

[Ysabel Kid]

Welcome to the fire!

[Newtmaker]

Welcome Scottyboy! I have had my 92 several months now, and thanks to Steve Jones and his great video it is a fine shooting and handling gun. Mine actually worked pretty well out of the box, but after I finished with Steve's instructions it really is sweet!

I haven't found a single ammo combo that it doesn't feed on well. Naturally some are more accurate than others. I have found that it likes mildly hot loads for best accuracy. It also likes very mild cast loads using Trail Boss, but only out to 30 yards or so. I tried some shots out to 100 meters and they were all over the place

The best thing you can do is shoot the gun, a lot! It will respond well to tinkering using the video as a guide, and you will learn to like the 92. I can't wait to get another, just haven't decided on which one yet.

Walt

[Scottyboy67]

Wow, how nice it was to see your responses this morning. Thank you Gentlemen.
From what I have been reading, I won't be sending the gun to Rossi for the fix. I’ll try Steve if I get too intimidated or frankly struggle to find the time over the holiday. I’m more worried that I would do harm. I just don't understand why they don’t add $100 to the gun and sell it sweet. Then they wouldn’t have to rely on customer service so much.
I put 200 various rounds through the gun yesterday and woke up with a bruise on my shoulder, which made laugh they way you might when a buddy punches you in the arm and you get a bruise. It wasn’t the recoil as much as the shape of the butt fitting my shoulder so that the point on the butt doesn’t dig in. Human error.
Now for some romantic notions: When I opened the box at the gun shop I was so impressed. I was thinking the whole time, please work, please let mine be the one that some guy in Brazil fell in love with and gave it a little extra time and attention. Then I go to the walk over to the range and … jam, jam, jam. Although I have to say, I actually giggled out loud when the first 38 went off. FUN!

All that said, the 92 is a tool. And like any other tool I have, it is 100% reliable or it goes away. I want the Rossi to work so bad. I want to be proud of it. But when a guy at the range was looking at me and walked over and asked, “how’s that Rossi working out for you?”, I couldn’t help but take a note of his sarcastic grin. Then he closed with, ”but it sure looks nice”.

I am less worried about the feeding issue as I think they will smooth and the Hornady ammo fed nicely, so it may be just that. I am worried about the extractor. I think I had read that the casings need a crimp for the extractor to grab them. Yes? No?

Finally, Steve mentioned length of cartridge, with some 357 being too long and some 38 being too short. I don’t load. Can you recommend some ammo that I can try to test that theory? I’d like to reduce some of the variables.

[GregT]

Hello again! Try cleaning your chamber real well and see if it extracts .357's at all. Also, I had to pull the plastic magazine follower out of one of the rifles and sand the edges down real good as it was sticking and not pushing the rounds out of the tube reliably. Real easy to do once you get the magazine cap screw untightened... Clean the tube out real well while you are at it. No problems since. (Don't like the plast ic one but the steel ones are costly). Don't know what Steve's price is though? Steve?
Greg T

[dgslyr]

Got my new Rossi back from Braztech today.I sent it to them because I could not zero it at 50 yds. let alone 100.It shot Really high and to the left off the paper.I had to move the rear sight partialy out of the dovetail to hit the paper. With the evlevation all the way down it hit about a foot high.When I got it back today it appaers all they did was put a taller front sight on and drive it .100 " out of the dovetail to the left and shoot it at 25 yards and call it fixed.A staight edge says the barrel is bent to the left.I couldn't get anyone to answer the phone to day.

[GregT]

Get in touch with the dealer who sold you the rifle. Explain that Rossi won't cooperate and you would like to exchange it for another rifle. The dealer will try to return it to the distributor and the distributor can fight with Rossi. Sounds like the start of exactly what I went through. Let us know how it is coming along. I also made the mistake of sending two rifles to Rossi. After two months of nothing, I had to constantly phone Rossi and demand action. Had to become real nasty. Finally with no notice my dealer got two brand new rifles to replace the two I had in to warranty. Both work.
Good luck.
GregT

[dgslyr]

Rossi is sending fedex to pick up the rifle.I would rather they give me my money back as the dealer won't because it's been back once already.We'll see if they have anyone there that can put a new barrel on without screwing it up.

[GregT]

Hello! Rossi also sent FedEx to pick up my second rifle and get it down there in one day. That joined the first one that was down there. Both remained down there another 30 days and then I got steamed and stared phoning. A week after my daily phone calls began, two brand new rifles showed up at my dealer. All no charge. You will probably get a new rifle out of it. If it is down there longer than 30 days, start calling! When you get a rifle that works, you will simply love it!
Good Luck!
GregT

[Scottyboy67]

Well, I am pleased to say that I had a nice day at the range with my Rossi. Not great, but nice. I switched out the plastic mag follower and tried some different ammo and had some good results. I will still be sending it to Steve, because it is a bad times gun and I want to take as many different types of ammo as possible, and I am hoping he can help. I was really surprised at how what looks like four or five very similar cartridges can provoke such different results. Now that said, the more I used the gun the better it seemed to do. By the way, I did clean it thoroughly, and perhaps that helped also. Today I was having success with 38s more than 357.
BEST - PMC 38 Special 132 Grain Encased Metal Jacket Non Toxic
OK - Fiocchi 357 Remington Magnum 125 Grain Semi-Jacketed Soft Point
Good- Hornady 357 Magnum LeverEvolution 140 Grain Flex Tip Expandi
Poor - (Lead of the Hollow point get hung up as it tries to feed) Remington 357 Magnum 110 Grain Semi-Jacketed Hollow Point
Poor - (Lead of the Hollow point get hung up as it tries to feed) Remington 357 Remington Magnum 125 Grain Semi-Jacketed Hollo
Poor - (Feeds very well, but get stuck in the tube) Remington 38 Special 130 Grain Metal Case

It seems like the encased or fully jacketed stuff slips in the tube nicely.

I have installed Steve's ejector Spring (can't seem to find the instructions on the video) maybe that will help.

I'll try more ammo, and see if the gun continues to "loosen" up.

Scott

[Scottyboy67]

Huh, I used the acronym for *deleted* and system translated it into "bad times" when I submitted. Wow.

[Hobie]

Huh, I used the acronym for *deleted* and system translated it into "bad times" when I submitted. Wow.

Because we don't talk that way here.

[Old Ironsights]

Well, I am pleased to say that I had a nice day at the range with my Rossi. Not great, but nice. I switched out the plastic mag follower and tried some different ammo and had some good results. I will still be sending it to Steve, because it is a bad times gun and I want to take as many different types of ammo as possible, and I am hoping he can help. I was really surprised at how what looks like four or five very similar cartridges can provoke such different results. Now that said, the more I used the gun the better it seemed to do. By the way, I did clean it thoroughly, and perhaps that helped also. Today I was having success with 38s more than 357.
BEST - PMC 38 Special 132 Grain Encased Metal Jacket Non Toxic
OK - Fiocchi 357 Remington Magnum 125 Grain Semi-Jacketed Soft Point
Good- Hornady 357 Magnum LeverEvolution 140 Grain Flex Tip Expandi
Poor - (Lead of the Hollow point get hung up as it tries to feed) Remington 357 Magnum 110 Grain Semi-Jacketed Hollow Point
Poor - (Lead of the Hollow point get hung up as it tries to feed) Remington 357 Remington Magnum 125 Grain Semi-Jacketed Hollo
Poor - (Feeds very well, but get stuck in the tube) Remington 38 Special 130 Grain Metal Case

It seems like the encased or fully jacketed stuff slips in the tube nicely.

I have installed Steve's ejector Spring (can't seem to find the instructions on the video) maybe that will help.

I'll try more ammo, and see if the gun continues to "loosen" up.

Scott

I bought mine directly from Steve "pre-slicked up" for all the same reasons you state... and can definitively say that I have had ZERO problems even with my "right on the edge" (case OAL etc) handloads.

You won't be sorry.

[Tycer]

Huh, I used the acronym for *deleted* and system translated it into "bad times" when I submitted. Wow.

Because we don't talk that way here.

We have a very family friendly forum with kids and ladies posting. The auto-censor can be pretty funny sometimes. It does teach me that some of my vernacular could stand to be cleaned up.

Welcome to the fire. Hope you stick around.

[Scottyboy67]

Hey, I can play by the rules. However, I thought the point of using the Acronym was to clean it up.

My mentioning it was a reflection of my suprise, nothing more. I have, and will continue to appreciate everyones advice.
Scott

[Old Savage]

The shop where I deal has had many of these through there and I have looked most of them over. I bought one that worked particularly well and missed one that I had intended to buy. They are like individuals but the late ones have been better. I can't imagine what the one I have might need. But, it is a 45 Colt and needs large diameter bullets in the 45 range to shoot well.

[Scottyboy67]

It's funny. I found myself thinking, "hmmm, maybe this thing will break in over time". I had a good time all in all. I've put 400 to 500 rounds through it and each area that was a problem seems to be a little bit better. That said, it is surprisingly accurate. And it is great looking.
I would say, it moved from a D grade to a C grade.

I loaded it first with the PMC 38s, and they entered the tube and ejected so nicely I thought I was home free. But, when I got to the Remingtons, it was bad. Better, but not trustworthy to hunt with.

Like I said, not a bad day. If it can operate a nicely as it did with the PMCs with other Ammo, I will be very happy.

[Griff]

Don't know if I've said it before... but... and Welcome to the Forum.

Listen to Nate's advice. Now, on to important stuff... this forum is visually motivated... you keep saying how good looking this carbine is...

To plagarize someone else's enginuity:

[Scharms]

I recently acquired the same rifle and other than the action being a little stiff, I was pretty happy with it. Having said that, I consider all factory guns a project with my end goal to make it more accurate, smoother, slicker etc... I was researching this rifle before I bought it & found some great M92 tuning tips from the sass forums. I really wanted the new S/S Marlin 1894 in .357 but couldn't locate one anywhere. For the price difference I can live with the Rossi.