1886 Browning inertia firing pin

[twoguns]

What is the function of the rear section of the firing pin that is spring loaded? It seems that the spring takes a lot of the energy out of the hammer strike requiring a heavier main spring which causes other functioning stiffness issues. With the firing pin locked in place by the lever and the lever retracting it upon extraction, I can't see what this rear spring and center piece is all about.

[Leverluver]

The answer is in your question. It is an inetia pin. The pin is shorter than the hole in the bolt it travels in. Non-inertia pins, if you push on the rear of the firing pin, you will see the nose of the pin protruding out the front of the bolt. With inertia, if you do the same thing, the pin will not protrude. The spring has to hold the pin to the rear so that it absorbs all the smack of the hammer and gives the pin enough inertia to move forward with sufficient energy to extend beyond the bolt and strike the primer.

[Mike D.]

All that the inertia firing pin is good for is misfires. I'm replacing the bolt on my Browning carbine with an original bolt from a .33 WCF 1886 Winchester. Totally reliable and certainly not a hazard.

[Lastmohecken]

I have not had any problems with inertia firing pins by theirselves, but add in rebounding hammer to the lot, and then I see problems sometimes, espacally the Reproduction Winchester 1886 Extra Lightweight, that came out a few years ago.

This the first time I have ever heard of problems with the older Browning reproductions. And I have owned several Browning BLR's, once again the older steel framed models, with inertia firing pins and never had a misfire, after hundreds of rounds.

The Colt 1911 has an inertia firing pin and it's been working fine for a hundred years.

[twoguns]

All that the inertia firing pin is good for is misfires. I'm replacing the bolt on my Browning carbine with an original bolt from a .33 WCF 1886 Winchester. Totally reliable and certainly not a hazard.

Mike, "misfires" ...Figured that before I posted. I am wondering if there is a replacement firing pin or a mod that would negate replacing the bolt. I have spent a lot of time knocking off the high spots and would hate to start over. I'm still wondering why they designed this firing pin this way.

And besides, I think you can have an inertia firing pin without that stupid springed rear end mechanism.

[firefuzz]

Inertia firing pins will prevent discharges caused by the hammer being left down on the firing pin with a round in the chamber, I have no problem with them. They are a valid safety feature that causes no cosmetic changes to the gun. I was having a LOT of misfires with my Miroku made '86 Winchester. Removing the rebounding hammer feature cured the problems, but I didn't touch the firing pin. From what I've read even if you replace the hammer, spring and strut with the older versions most smiths recommend leaving the firing pin alone. It probably slows down the lock time of the gun a little, but in a lever action who cares?

My B92's don't have inertia firing pins, but they have a true half-cock notch on the hammer, my '86 doesn't, it's much shallower on that gun. If I was going to replace the inertia firing pin, or bolt if necessary to do this, I'd make sure to either replace the hammer or cut a real half-cock notch in the original one for sure.

Rob

[twoguns]

Firefuzz, like your 92s, my Browning has a full-cut half cock notch.

[Malamute]

If you want to remove the multi-piece firing pin from the 86, I believe you could either aquire a replacement firing pin from an old style 86 or 71, modifying the tip if needed to fit your bolt, or just have one made to fit your bolt. I have a Browning 92 one piece firing pin I'm going to put in a Miroku 92. The tip profile is different, but it should be possible to match the front end profile to fit. Same for the 86, I have a replacement 71 firing pin I'm going to see if it will be close enough to fit the 86, perhaps with a little adjustment.

I havent had any problems with the Browning 86's firing pin, but it is a multi piece unit, when it doesnt need to be. Several small parts, vs one piece. Maybe not a big deal, but I do carry mine in places that I really want it to work, every time.

[Mike D.]

I had better correct mu original post to add that the browning two piece firing pin set up is very reliable, but the Miroku EL 1886 is not, despite hammer and trigger changes and strut mods. Some times, it takes several strikes to ignite the primer. Not good. This one most definitely get a NOS 1886 bolt assembly from the late '30s. It should be a drop in application.

[twoguns]

I think the main reason I am trying to understand the purpose of the multipiece rear section of the Browning firing pin is the fact that in order for everything to work as intended with this particular design, the mainspring must be overly strong to light up the primer. Even with the bolt rails and slots in the receiver slicked up in the proper manner, the heavy mainspring, through the hammer-pressure on the bottom of the bolt, puts a larger than needed upward force on the bolt at its rearward third of travel. This is when the front third of the bolt rails are only bearing on the rear third of the receiver slot recesses. There is not much contact area to distribute the force evenly as the mainspring and hammer try to force the bolt in the vertical direction. The results are stiffer movement of the lever through this area of the ejection and cartridge pickup portion of the of the cycle and probably faster wear of the respective sections of the slots and rails. I'm 90% certain that my modified mainspring would fire my primers with a solid firing pin, but I want to find out the function of the dogleg piece of metal at the rear of the firing pin on the browning parts drawing (winchester drawing is the same http://www.winchesterguns.com/customers ... /parts.asp) before I make some changes. It appears to me that this dogleg provides 2 functions;
1) it provides a seat for the inertia spring.
2) You have to press in on the rear of the firing pin center section against the dogleg spring and dogleg to allow the dogleg to drop into a slot on the center piece of the firing pin assembly to release the firing pin from the bolt. (a redundant function - the lever straddles and holds the firing pin in its position in the bolt. )

My thought is to attempt to make this firing pin into a solid firing pin sans rear spring as long as I have a healthy half cock notch and I am not defeating any other necessary safety assembly (unlike the rebounding hammer on the newer winnys.) I think I can replace that rear spring with a solid piece of drill stock of the proper length and file the upper nub off that dogleg and accomplish my goals. I can tell you all that after two weekends of stoning and polishing internal parts, the lever cycles and functions easily (buttery smooth) with one-finger pressure, but with the original mainspring it is sticky and much harder to cycle.

Thoughts?

[twoguns]

If you want to remove the multi-piece firing pin from the 86, I believe you could either aquire a replacement firing pin from an old style 86 or 71, modifying the tip if needed to fit your bolt, or just have one made to fit your bolt. I have a Browning 92 one piece firing pin I'm going to put in a Miroku 92. The tip profile is different, but it should be possible to match the front end profile to fit. Same for the 86, I have a replacement 71 firing pin I'm going to see if it will be close enough to fit the 86, perhaps with a little adjustment.

I havent had any problems with the Browning 86's firing pin, but it is a multi piece unit, when it doesnt need to be. Several small parts, vs one piece. Maybe not a big deal, but I do carry mine in places that I really want it to work, every time.

Looking around I found this firing pin and decided to by it to see if I could make it work. It was from Midwestgunworks.com. it is the upper FP in this photo.

PO70102 Browning Firing Pin M-1886 & M-71 & M-1886 Carbine $59.25

While waiting for my wood and Mike Hunter to CCH my parts, I tried to make the midwest gun works firing pin look like the four-piece firing pin that came from my Browing 1986-1886. I just used files, a drill press, 200-600 grit sandpaper and a bench grinder and Dremel with buffer wheels. The firing pin head end required thinning as did the mid barrel section which was full diameter from the lever camming section to the rear of the FP.


There are two significant differences on these two firing pins.
The cam slots on the four-piece FP are flat and the same slots on the older on are curved. Also, the hammer cocking butt end of the firing pin is curved on the four-piece, but flat on the replacement FP. I will have to review these when I get my parts back from Mike Hunter to make sure the corresponding action parts (lever and hammer) bear smoothly on these surfaces.

[Old Time Hunter]

All that the inertia firing pin is good for is misfires. I'm replacing the bolt on my Browning carbine with an original bolt from a .33 WCF 1886 Winchester. Totally reliable and certainly not a hazard.

This has been my experience, especially on sub zero days. Did not someone make a solid replacement?

[twoguns]

[quote= Did not someone make a solid replacement?[/quote]
Well I gues this is a "solid" replacement with some fitting.

[vancelw]

Looking around I found this firing pin and decided to by it to see if I could make it work. It was from Midwestgunworks.com. it is the upper FP in this photo.

If I had found one of those a month ago I would have tried to make it work. That rear section appears to me to merely be a brake. The hammer has to hit that rear center to drop the dogleg that is creating friction between the bolt and the interia pin (the brake is then released) and then the hammer can drive the inertia pin forward. I recently had my B71 all apart trying to diagnose a misfire problem. My problem turned out to be caused by the firing pin not being "true". It was bowed in the center. Once I straightened it, the rifle worked flawlessly. With the Browning having a half cock position, a simpler pin would work. The multi-piece inertia pin protects Browning from idiots who carry their rifle with a round in the chamber and the hammer all the way down.

Let us know how your project comes out.

[Grizzly Adams]

My thought is to attempt to make this firing pin into a solid firing pin sans rear spring as long as I have a healthy half cock notch and I am not defeating any other necessary safety assembly (unlike the rebounding hammer on the newer winnys.) I think I can replace that rear spring with a solid piece of drill stock of the proper length and file the upper nub off that dogleg and accomplish my goals.

Thoughts?

My B1886 developed some issues with misfires, and my gunsmith converted it to a solid firing pin in just that way. Works very well.

[Mike D.]

Steve Young will be doing his magic, including a one piece firing pin, on my EL sometime soon. Fitting an original bolt is possible, but more time consuming than necessary and Steve's work speaks for itself. I'll just add the original '86 and 71 bolts to my parts inventory.

[twoguns]

This is similar (but not exactly) to what the upper firing pin looked like before I worked it over.



But it came from http://www.midwestgunworks.com/page/mgwi/ctgy/C-023 (Midwest Gun Works)
P070102 - Firing Pin M-1886 & M-71 & M-1886 Carbine

[Malamute]

I think I'm perhaps missing something. The firing pin you ordered from Midwest is the Browning part number for the 86 and 71 and is the one you had to modify to work in them, and is a one piece that eliminates the extra parts?

[twoguns]

I think I'm perhaps missing something...

...Or I'm confused where I got it. I'll check my home computer for the emails I sent and see if I can track down if MGW is the place. The schematic for the Browning 1886 at MGW definetly shows the multi piece FP. I know I tied at Numrich but they were out of stock - and so right now I don't know where else I could have gotten it. I found the picture of solid barrell FP here http://homesteadfirearms.com/parts/shop ... ct/740.jpg