To scope or not to scope...

[AkHunter45-70]

that is the dilemna I am in right now. The sights on my XLR are crappy and i need them changed out but I cannot decide if I want to use a low power scope or WWG ghost ring setup. I want to use this rifle for close rnage hunting, less than 75 yards but there's always the possibility that I may have to go 100 to 150. Looking for opinions and I know you guys have some!

[Jeff Quinn]

Personally, a scope helps me to more accurately place my shots, so that's what I would use. I like a low poer variable, like a Leupold 2 to 7 power, or the Trijicon Accupoint 1.25 to 4.

[Nath]

My trapper 30/30 is scoped and my 9422. Yes there has been neg vibes by some in the past but I not care as it is me doing the shooting see
The 94 has a Nikkon 2-7x on it and it is very good. The 9422 has a cheapie on it and it is not so good. I hope to replace it with a Nikkon when I have saved enough.

[J Miller]

For 75 to a hundred yards I'd use a receiver sight and post front sight. I don't like scopes to start with and see no reason to use one for that short distance.
They are nothing but excess baggage on an otherwise handy rifle. Not to mention they will fail at the moment you need them the most.

Joe

[Blackhawk]

I do the same as Jeff. If I can hit better with a scope than open sights then that's what I use.

Just another 2 cents for the pot.

[awp101]

I do the same as Jeff. If I can hit better with a scope than open sights then that's what I use.

Same here, either a 2x7 or 3x9.

I'm just getting started with tang sights, no receiver sight experience yet so my opinion may change down the road.

I use what works for ME and I don't worry about what's trendy or what others who aren't doing the shooting for me think.

[jbm1968]

I match my sights to the hunting and equipment. I prefer receiver sights on my leverguns but I just bought a Savage 99 with a scope for hunting in areas with 150-250 yards shots. If you know you will max out at 150 yards and have the eyes for it a receiver sight is fine in my opinion. A low power scope will not look out of place on your XLR if that matters to you, it is already big and heavy so the scope wont make much difference. Most importantly, practice, practice, practice!

[Pete44ru]

[I cannot decide if I want to use a low power scope or WWG ghost ring setup.]

JMO, but if you know somebody that already has either sight system (on any rifle), it would be a good idea to at least handle both for comparison, if not shoot with them.

Different strokes, for different folks - and YMMV.

Some of my rifles are peeped, while others are glassed - because hunting and shooting situations differ/change, as do folk's physical abilities.

[Jeff Quinn]

I also want to add that I like a good peep sight. I like the XS Ghost ring setup very well. However, at five minutes before the last legal shooting light is gone in the evening, when that buck slips out of the shadows, nothing beats a good quality scope, I don't care how good your eyes are.

[jbm1968]

Jeff,

You are absolutely correct in that!

[Griff]

I'm with ya Jeff. Although I only have two rifles that are wearing scopes, a Rem 700BDL and a Marlin 375. A 2nd Rem700 needs one, but something else always get put ahead of its scope on the "need" list!

Since the Marlin is uncomfortable to carry, I figured a handle was just the ticket! No, seriously, the Weaver K4-1 fills its needs quite nicely. While largely, my bear tags over the years remain unfilled, this combo is light yet packs a punch.

I may tease, but I'd rather see a hunter cleanly take game than struggle w/inappropiate sightse

[Pete44ru]

[However, at five minutes before the last legal shooting light is gone in the evening, when that buck slips out of the shadows, nothing beats a good quality scope, I don't care how good your eyes are.]

Very true, Jeff, but therein lies the rub - sometimes.

Up until a few years ago, Maine (where I've done the bulk of my non-resident deer hunting since 1967) Game Laws required hunters to unload their gun at the State Dept of Inland F&G timetable's published sunset time for each particular day - a full 15-20 minutes before prime shooting (IMO) light at dusk/dark.
I've had Maine Game Wardens sit nearby, where my party hunted, and checked guns as hunters entered & exited the hunting grounds - seizing the guns & licenses & citing of any who failed & got caught with a loaded gun.

That law's now been changed to 1/2hour after the published time - and, Yes, a scope does throw some light on the picture, at that time. The rest of the day, I don't usually use a scope.

I stand by my statement: Hunting situations change/vary.

[Jeff Quinn]

I like using open sights and peeps, especially out in New Mexico at the Whittington Center busting rocks on a hillside out to almost 600 yards. However, the hillside is always in the sunshine when I am shooting, and I can clearly see those sights. Also, when hunting, I like to slip that bullet just about an inch behind the shoulder on a broadside shot, and a good scope will let me do that at long range. At 200 yards, the front post on a levergun appears almost as wide as the dern deer. I can't be as precise as I like, so limit my shooting without a scope to those times when I really do not care if I harvest a deer or not. If I am looking to put meat in the freezer, my rifle wears a scope.

[Lastmohecken]

A scope is the best sight, for 90% of all hunting with a rifle. And I like iron sights, for many reasons on leverguns. To me it would be a sin to scope a Winchester model 71, 86, or 92, etc. But at the same time, I want a scope on my Browning BLR, the Marlins can go either way.

And in reality a good scope sight in good mounts is more rugged then lots of iron sights. And after over 40 years of using both irons and scopes, I presonally believe that a good low powered scope is faster then irons and more percise, most of the time.

And some people will tell you that a higher powered scope does not help you shoot better. To that comment I say that it depends on the targets involved and the range involved. It used to be said that about 4 power was all that could be handled on a pistol, that is pure bunk. My friends and I proved that to be false back in the 80's when we were shooting Hunter pistol Silhouette. We were shooting iron sights and 4power scopes on our pistols, but one day a friend of mine and I decided to put a rifle scope on a pistol. We both went to the next match with 3x9 rifle scopes on our pistols, we got a few laughs, but noone was laughting when the match was over, because we had beaten everone by a good margin. I later settled on 12 power for that game, but I knew others who went up to a Weaver T16 power on their pistol.

However that being said, my favorite scope for big game hunting is a Leupold 2x7 variable and I always keep it on 2 power for a close quick shot, and 7 power is enough for even a long shot.

I still use iron sighted rifles, for the fun and pleasure of carrying a vintage hunting rifle, but I never fool myself into thinking that I can do the same kinds of shooting that I can do with a scoped rifle, and I don't think anyone else can either. But you can still take a lot of game with good quality iron sights, but as I get older and my eyes are not as good, I know that when using irons I need to be prepared to accept the limitations of range and light conditions, when using irons, and be willing to let a few more animals walk.

[win92]

i like a scope on a rifle from a stand or blind and then prefer williams peeps for a walkin around gun. A scope really takes away from the handiness of these little carbines, though I have to admit I use one more than the peeps. Gives a few more minutes of huntin time too. It will allow you to thread a bullet between the branches that sometimes won't be seen thru peeps if you have time to study the game.
my .02 cents

[jbm1968]

I am the same as Jeff and Win92. I like to carry around my levers especially after I have filled my first tag. In the past, I always carried my M70 when "serious" hunting (yes I know and agree, all of it is serious) or first thing in the season. After that, or when I KNOW the shots will be short (boar in the swamps) I carry my levers. Even in the rough back country of the Big South Fork where I grew up, I carried my mountain rifle to keep the weight down. That is why I bought my savage99 w/scope, I get to use a lever the whole season now!!!

[nemhed]

Just adding my 2 cents. I've been hunting with a levergun for about 30 years (I got my 39a when I was 12). I've been hunting with a scope for about 29 years. I didn't take me long to figure out that if I wanted to use the accuracy potential of my 39a, I needed a scope on it. I've deer hunted here in Indiana with a sidelock muzzleloader for several years with no scope and I was successful, but I jumped at the chance to use a pistol caliber Marlin this past season. My 1894c is wearing a scope and feels just like hunting with an old friend. With the compact 4x scope I can see every leaf,twig or branch that may be in the way of a clean shot.

[El Chivo]

I just installed my first scope, and was practicing getting on target with it, comparing it to tang sights. It's faster, about 1 second vs. 3 seconds. Haven't shot it yet, but I like it so far.

I believe I will probably go to scopes as my eyes age and my presbyopia increases. Lots of times my eyes are watering by the end of a silhouette match because of the strain of peep sights. Of course, that's a lot of shooting, vs hunting where you don't shoot much. But there's none of the worry of interpreting a blurred front sight and target.

[Swampman]

The XLR isn't handy anyway, so why not scope it?

I prefer the Bushnell Banner 1.5-4.5X32 or the Bushnell Elite 2-7X32.

I have scopes on nearly all my leverguns. As soon as I can afford it, they all will have scopes.

[jsimmons]

My advice is to configure your gun in a way that makes it more comfortable and accurate *for you*. If you want to scope it, by all means, do so.

I have a scope on my bolt gun (CZ-452), but I use a tang/globe sight set on my Henry .22LR Frontier. I don't hunt, and my rifles are all configured for a specific kind of Silhouette competition.

If I was going to scope my Henry, I'd use a 2x scout scope with a minimum of a 8-10 inch eye relief.

[centershot]

PEEP SIGHT!!! I promise you, if you put a Williams FP-Firesight set on your rifle, and give them an honest workout for 6 months, you won't want any other sight on your rifle! It happened to me!

centershot

[Jason_W]

Ammo and/or coponents ain't exactly cheap right now. I say do whatever you need in order to make sure more shots hit the target with minimal tweaking.

[RAC]

Not to mention they will fail at the moment you need them the most.

Joe

Inquiring minds want to know. How many times have you had a scope "fail" when you needed it the most? And what scope brands were you using when these particular scopes failed?

[wm]

I would advocate trying aperture sights. You might be surprised how good you can shoot them out to 200 yards. The trick is learning 'the hold over' at those longer ranges.

One thing I had noticed mentioning was using a long eye relief scope in a scout set up on your rifle. You might consider that too.

Wm

[AkHunter45-70]

I probably should have put that in my first post, I am not to keen on the scout scope setup. I prefer something a little more conventional. Am thinking the Vari-X III in 1.5-5x20 with heavy duplex or something along those lines, set up like a dangerous game rifle is about as best as I can describe it.

[Swampman]

I think you'd be a lot happier with the Bushnell 3200 Elite. The Leupolds are ok though. I have both.

[Ben_Rumson]

I really like iron sights ... be it open or aperture..but when the light gets low the scope is the way to go.. The fun I used to have offhand shooting and slapping the 200 yard gongs w/ various rifles & pistols at a range I used to frequent was great.. Well, the fun got spoilt when they enclosed 3 sides of them & covered with a roof... The gongs are in perpetual shade now and barely can be seen in the best light conditions & when they are freshly painted...I go to another range now.. sadly they don't have gongs or 200 yard shooting, but they allow cans & such at a place by the hundred yard targets... So as long as these 61 year old eyes will do it, Ill be banging away with my irons..But for right now I'm loving my 1960 vintage 99, 300 Sav Carbine w/Leupold 1.5-5..What a sweetie!!

[wm]

One last thought....fixed power scopes are generally a little more rugged (fewer moving parts)

And fixed 2X will have a wider field of view then a variable scope set at 2X.

Okay you got me ... two last thoughts

Wm

P.S. I like fixed power scopes....my vote would be a 2X if you were doing a lot woods hunting or 4X for more open spaces but nothing more.

[AkHunter45-70]

Looks like i'm going to give the Wild West Guns ghost ring setup a try, if it doesn't work out then I will probably go to a straight fixed 4 power Leupy. Thanks for all the advice fella's, it's much appreciated!

[edsguns]

I think you open more options by having even a handy carbine scoped with a low powered scope and with a reticle that is quick to use. Some excellent examples would be a heavy duplex, post, or German type with 3 heavy posts, topped by a thin top post(my personal favorite). I do have a peep mounted on a .444 Marlin and think it could be best used in heavy rain or snow, although snow can clog it as well as cover a scope lens. It's my opinion that a low powered scope (1-2x at bottom end) with a good reticle and used with both eyes open for fast or snap shooting cannot be beat. If those of you who are firmly disbelieving of this idea actually tried a well aligned scope such as a Leupold 1-4 30mm with German #4 reticle
with both eyes open at short range, I think you might just change your opinion on such a set-up. Seeing is believing!

[Ben_Rumson]

edsguns... A while back I handled an old Marlin 30-30 that was set up exactly like you said.. It has a 3x scope w/post reticule & a horizontal cross hair....The scope is low mounted and has enough eye relief to sit well ahead of the hammer .... Here's the kicker.. the scope is a Weaver 3-30.. It's a very effective set up even though it's a 3/4" tube scope and at least 65+ years old!! Most today would call a set up like that a cheesy set up.. I wouldn't feel too handicapped with that rig afield today though..

[edsguns]

edsguns... A while back I handled an old Marlin 30-30 that was set up exactly like you said.. It has a 3x scope w/post reticule & a horizontal cross hair....The scope is low mounted and has enough eye relief to sit well ahead of the hammer .... Here's the kicker.. the scope is a Weaver 3-30.. It's a very effective set up even though it's a 3/4" tube scope and at least 65+ years old!! Most today would call a set up like that a cheesy set up.. I wouldn't feel too handicapped with that rig afield today though..

Ben, I think some hunters have been put off in the past by an experience with a malaligned scope with an out of focus or less than prominant reticle. I, myself, have only learned the benefits of using both eyes with a scope for some situations in about the last year or so. Of course I also need to admit that these eyes of mine are also not getting any younger either...lol. But I am very impressed with a couple of my new scopes and just how fast I'm able to align them at close range, when they are set up properly. I'd go as far as to say in a dangerous game, close encounter, I'd want a scope for fastest aimed firepower.

[Old Savage]

No matter what the form of the the iron sights you still don't get the big clear picture of the target. I'll trade that for handling or handiness.

[Lastmohecken]

I like to have some guns, set up both ways. I keep some with scopes and some with ironsights. Ironsight are better if it is snowing hard, or raining, although I have killed deer in the rain with a scope, you just have to be careful what you are doing, but a driving snow will make even a low powered scope useless, or almost useless.

The way I see it, the biggest advantage of ironsight is handiness, and extreem close range dangerous game hunting, but a good scope is superior for just about anything else. But that doesn't mean you have to use a scope. You can still kill a lot of game with iron sights, even at fairly long range if the light is good and you are good. However, I do believe in the old days, a lot more wounded and or missed game was lost to iron sights, because people would take shots that should have been passed up, but would have been easy kills with a scope.