Older Kids and Guns

[AJMD429]

The other post on 'Kids and Guns' got me thinking about "What basic 'battery' do you think a kid should have by the time they leave home...?"

I'm not talking the gun enthusiast/hunter type - they will have gone that path themselves, and chosen their own firearms based on a variety of needs. I'm talking the non-gun type kid, who you just want to send out in the cold, cruel world somewhat prepared for contingencies - guns that may be practical but not particularly 'nice' as viewed by those of us who have the hobby.

Think this is too much...? Too little...??

• Double Action Revolver .357 Mag
  Levergun Carbine .357 Mag
  Semiauto Carbine .22 LR
  Semiauto Carbine .223 Rem
  Pump Shotgun 12 gauge

If I were Bill Gates, my list would be different, and surely include an M1A or Garand, and maybe an Abrams Tank, but I figure this gets them a solid set of the basics in easy-to-find chamberings. Specific brands and models still up for consideration...

[jnyork]

Just curious, why all the carbines instead of rifles?

[FWiedner]

A self-defense side-arm and a militia rifle or carbine, each of which they should be able to use and maintain.

Caliber and model are not of particular import, so log as each is suitable for it's purpose, serviceable, and ammunition readily available.

[Hobie]

- 20 Ga. pump (870) with both a short smoothbore barrel with choke tubes and a rifled slug barrel

The non-enthusiast child can do just about everything with this combo, self-defense, hunting, and skeet or trap for fun/practice with friends. Seriously, if they want to get more than this then they ARE an enthusiast at some level.

I'd like them to get a "militia carbine", i.e. M4 type, but let's face it, with the above they are already demonstrating they are past a bunch of "kids" today and most aren't this politically tuned in.

[RustyJr]

I would say . . .

Glock 19/23 - 9mm/40S&W
Pump Action Shotgun in 12 or 20 gauge
Ruger 10-22 22LR Scoped
Ar-15 Carbine - 5.56/223
Bolt Action 308 - scoped


I went with the same number of firearms that were listed in the original post but modified the choices a bit. Some may argue that the handgun should be a revolver for simplicity but I think that Glock handguns are simple enough that with a little training there would be no issue. I saw people in the academy that had never handled a firearm before that picked up a Glock and were able to qualify with it and to me in a self defense situation the semi-auto has enough of an advantage to warrant what little extra training might be needed. If I were only going with two of the above I would say the Glock and the shotgun.

RustyJr

[samb]

I try to buy two of everything so Jr. can take half of all I own. By the time he is grown I will be happy to give him everything I have except for my 3006 and a 44 mag Single action Ruger.

My short list for him is:
Rem M870 12 Gauge
Henry lever .22
1911
Left hand scoped bolt gun in 7mm-08.

[Griff]

Non-enthusiast kid? What's that? I wouldn't call mine particularily an enthusiast, but he has 2 lever-guns, w SA revolvers, a pump & side x side (both 12 ga.), and if he asked, a 1911 in 45ACP. We're still discussing whether grandpa's (unwitnessed), promise of his 10-22 takes precedence over grandma's giving it to me in front of witnesses!

[olyinaz]

What they like to shoot! I'd rather they have a few guns they actually LIKE vs. my dream arsenal.

Oly

[horsesoldier03]

I recently came into this same question in my mind when my oldest daughter moved out. She has shown little interest in guns but has some experiance. She has proved to be accurate with any gun she shoots, however, I want to see better gun handling skills before I will be comfortable with handing over an arsenal. What I have given her is a NEF .410 single shot. I purchased a couple boxes of home defense loads and a couple boxes of birdshot and we go shooting as often as we can. I have a Taurus 85 .38 SPC that I would like to pass to her one day, but before I will feel comfortable with that, she has to satisfy gun handling standards to my liking. So for now, it is just the .410 and a Pepper Spray Canister for every room and one for her purse and another for the car. OH I also picked her up a nice little stungun as well.

IMO, before you give a pistol to someone, they best become an enthusiest! Sloppy gun handling will only get someone you love killed.

All that being said, I have had the conversation with my daughter and her current opinion is she is not ready and is uncertain if she would be willing to have to shoot someone in self defense. That is a conversation that needs to take place before providing a gun for self defense.

On the other hand, my youngest is somewhat of an enthusiest and loves to hunt. She has a .22, .410 sxs, .20 ga pump, and an 1894 .44mag. She is only 15 at the time and thankfully I have a few more years to before she leaves the nest. We havent had the discussion on if she is prepared to use a gun in self defense, however I can certainly verify that she doesnt hesitate a lick when it comes to dropping a deer, turkey, or pheasant.

[Sixgun]

Doc,
Here, outside of Philly, I would just let Jr. watch the 6:00 news and then decide for himself.

I bet the list would be an 870 shotgun, a hi-cap .40 and an AR of some type, along with a concealed carry permit.-----------Sixgun (no joking)

[samb]

What they like to shoot! I'd rather they have a few guns they actually LIKE vs. my dream arsenal.

Oly

Great advice! Got the same from a buddy who manages a gun store, he said" I see lots of Dad's overwhelm kids with their idea's let him know your into it, and let him decide when and what he wants to get into, when it comes to shooting and hunting.

That being said last Friday my four year old fired his Savage Lil Rascal for the first time, and loved it!

[bdhold]

what Oly said.
Acquisition itself is half the fun of a firearm.
Load him up with knowledge and skills, and let him do the hunting.

[Betterluckytg]

From my somewhat limited experience, it would be a pretty poor idea to give a "non-enthusiast" kid a bunch of expensive guns as a present for leaving home, unless it's a bribe to get them to do so. It's pretty much guaranteed that sooner, (rather than later) the guns will be lost, stolen or sold/traded. Of course there are exceptions; occasionally one runs across an eighteen-year-old who has his/her/its head out.

[MrMurphy]

I wouldn't give that many to a kid who's not a 'shooter'.

A .357 or 9mm auto, .22 rifle and a 12 gauge would do.

Self defense, plinking/survival and the shotgun for home or hunting depending how they're wired.

If they're shooters, throw in an AR and maybe a levergun in .30-30.

[AJMD429]

From my somewhat limited experience, it would be a pretty poor idea to give a "non-enthusiast" kid a bunch of expensive guns as a present for leaving home, unless it's a bribe to get them to do so.

Hmm.... I didn't think of that angle - "take this stuff and get out...!"

I guess by some definitions my kids are ALL 'enthusiasts' or you're right, I'd give them maybe just one revolver and make sure they at least knew how to use it.

My kids either fall in the "love to shoot and spend my lawn-mowing money on guns and ammo already" category, or in the "know how to shoot anything you hand me, but probably won't spend my own money on guns for along time" category. I'm also thinking ahead for them for if times get rough, only instead of buying them savings-bonds I think investing in 'metals' is more practical.

[Paladin]

I let my daughter pick the weapons she wanted to carry when she got her CCW. I required her load, shoot, unload to qualify with 13 different weapons systems as I photographed the event to attach to the endorsement so no one could say she didn’t do it. She chose a Berretta 84 in .380 that had been an issued sidearm to the Indiana State police and still had their patch on the grips. The last time I was in the area I packed a pelican box with what she calls her “DEER” rifle a Professional Ordnance Carbon 15 with mags, ammo, a camelback and a Browning High-power as her get home kit.

[Blaine]

I'm talking the non-gun type kid

I hope they have had at least a complete immersion in gun safety, and use. My daughter was brought up around guns, and has shot with me (heck, I think she shoots those little J Frames better than I do ) I gave her a nice 3" S&W J Frame 38 Special, and a 9 shot Sentry .22.....I would not want to be a bad guy in front of her if she felt threatened. She is a non-hunter

[jeepnik]

I left the house with thee rifles. Two Remmy 700's one a righty in .243 and a lefty in 30-06, and a Winchester bolt action single shot .22. And two shotguns. One .410 Mossy and a lefty Remmy 870, 12 guage. Those pretty much handled everything I needed to do up to that point.

My kids were luckier, a they had a mix of handguns, rifles and shotguns to their names. What they learned as kids held them in good stead later. If I were to sit down and make a selection of what would suffice it would be,

.22 revolver (single or double action your choice)
.45 acp 1911A1
12 ga shotgun (action/configuration of your choice)
.22 bolt action rifle
30-06 bolt action rifle

That would pretty much suffice for everything in the lower 48, as I like to say, from bunnies to bears. And, two legged critters would be well handled, as well.

[hfcable]

yep, a .22 revolver would be an essential on the list.....so they could afford [ and enjoy ] lots and lots of practice.

[rimrock]

My daughter shoots my FNP-40 better than anyone. She wants a .36 BP revolver, and she'll have it. My son has .308 bolt gun here at the house, and wants an FN SCAR. I'll find a way to afford that one also.

[bakamorgan]

I think also your caliber might change with your location also. I don't tend to be fighting off bears or mountain lions here in the middle of Illinois. Maybe some corn monkeys and methheads lol.


If it was thinking smart maybe something like this:
AR .223 with a conversion kit for 22 lr(less to carry that way, and more room for ammo)
12 guage
pistol of some kind


I think it would all come down to what they are comfortable with. Theres also that dreaded fear that they will hate guns, do to my mother in law LOL. Need to nip that in the bud quickly.

[shooter]

Just curious, why all the carbines instead of rifles?

This is just my personal preference, but I almost always prefer shorter/lighter. In fact, I usually prefer as short and light as I can get without sacrificing too much performance. My longest barrel on any of my rifles is 20". The only barrel I have over that length is an extra 24" for my 870.

As to the OP, I think that arsenal is a very good all around set up if your kid is at all interested in shooting or self defense. I would also throw in a scoped bolt action, most likely in .308.

[Ysabel Kid]

The basics would be a double-action .357 Magnum revolver, a lever-action .357 Magnum (ammunition interchangability), and a pump 12 gauge. This would be a great basic battery for the "non-gun" young man.

Now, for the young gun enthusiast, though all three make the list still, I'd start adding others.

.45 Colt single-action revolver
.45 ACP 1911
Ruger 10/22
Ruger Mark III 22/45
A good quality high-powered bolt-action rifle
AR-15

Others too. Basically, some combination of a a rimfire revolver, pistol, and rifles/carbine (lever, semi, bolt, etc.). Pistol-caliber lever-action with a matching-caliber revolver. Center-fire full-size semi-auto pistol. Military-style center-fire rifle or carbine. Bolt-action high-power center-fire rifle. Pump shotgun. After the basics, then collectables not falling into the immediate needs list.