OT: Move over Columbus??

Ray Newman · Post by **Ray Newman** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:42 pm

Gents: I should have typed December 2012 as the date when the Mayans supposedly predicted then end of world. I am a two-fingered typist and a poor proof reader.

Anyway, seems that since the Mayan calendar "ended" (??) sometime December 2012, it was interpreted by many that the Mayan predicted the end of the world. If I recall correctly, it was to happen around Christmas?? And here it is September 2014.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:44 pm

Ray Newman wrote:Gents: I should have typed December 2012 as the date when the Mayans supposedly predicted then end of world. I am a two-fingered typist and a poor proof reader.

Anyway, seems that since the Mayan calendar "ended" (??) sometime December 2012, it was interpreted by many that the Mayan predicted the end of the world. If I recall correctly, it was to happen around Christmas?? And here it is September 2014.

Yeah, I know but it was fun to play with a new end of the world prediction for a moment. However, in the case of the Mayans, I don't think the predicted the end at that point, they simply stopped their calendar there for reasons of space/time/etc.

Ray Newman · Post by **Ray Newman** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:49 pm

Brent: you are onto some thing there.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:56 pm

In the Mustang mountains of Az. there is a gravestone with the name of an Englishman on it.
It is inscribed in some form of Old English, the date is pre- Columbus.
That would suggest there were at least two.

Ray Newman · Post by **Ray Newman** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:07 pm

Mescalaro: could it be another "Drake's Plate" ??

For those not familiar with the Drake's Plate hoax/forgery, see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake%27s_Plate_of_Brass

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:14 pm

Anything is possible, but the geologist thought the stone matched the date.
The writing on the stone, depth, weathering, etc.

765x53 · Post by **765x53** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:18 pm

bulldog1935 wrote:I know the Canadian flows into the Red - I bet the Cimarron does, too.
But the Red flows into the Atchafalaya and that into the Mississippi.
In case you don't know, the Mississippi delta is now a manmade artifact.
The whole river would turn into the Atchafalaya now except for a series of dams that make the two rivers flow backwards to divert 70% of the flow to NOLA.
Nature would have the tides washing away NOLA and the new delta would be growing faster at Morgan City.

According to my Oklahoma map, the Canadian and the Cimarron flow separately into the Arkansas, which flows into the Mississippi.

Gallo Pazzesco · Post by **Gallo Pazzesco** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:10 pm

I think it's pretty-much a given, a foregone conclusion, that both the Vikings and Polynesians came to American centuries before Columbus.

They have found Polynesian skulls, bones and boats on the coast of California dating back 3,000 years, Viking boats on the coast of Washington and elsewhere. (sic: Norse, led by Leif Ericson) They've found 2,000 year old arrowheads on the Hawaiian Islands made from New Mexico quarried obsidian.

Italians are not happy.

Heck, there is even some dispute now as to whether or not Columbus was Italian but possibly rather Spanish or Portuguese living in Genoa.

bdhold · Post by **bdhold** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:15 am

Ray Newman wrote:Gents: I should have typed December 2012 as the date when the Mayans supposedly predicted then end of world. I am a two-fingered typist and a poor proof reader.

Anyway, seems that since the Mayan calendar "ended" (??) sometime December 2012, it was interpreted by many that the Mayan predicted the end of the world. If I recall correctly, it was to happen around Christmas?? And here it is September 2014.

if you asked a Mayan they would say it had to end somewhere.
Gregorian calendars end every 4 years.
The Mayans had greater vision.

Okinawans sailors assimilated in South America and California before Columbus

bdhold · Post by **bdhold** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:18 am

765x53 wrote: According to my Oklahoma map, the Canadian and the Cimarron flow separately into the Arkansas, which flows into the Mississippi.

OK, thanks, I didn't check a map

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:01 pm

here's a for instance about my assertion that it is highly likely that ocean crossings were made in paleo times. this is not a paleo boat, but there is nothing about this modern day arctic voyage that could not have been achieved by an umiak or log canoe or a variety of other vessels. the arctic can be circumnavigated in these conditions and was done so by the northern peoples. it is not much of a stretch to drop down into europe, or cruise up and across from europe or asia, either one is equally accessible.

anyways, this is interesting reading:

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/09/out ... /index.htm

Grizz

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:27 pm

Hot off the presses - the peopling of the Nearctic.

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/345/6200/1004.full

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:36 pm

I would have liked to read it

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 1:14 pm

Grizz wrote:here's a for instance about my assertion that it is highly likely that ocean crossings were made in paleo times. this is not a paleo boat, but there is nothing about this modern day arctic voyage that could not have been achieved by an umiak or log canoe or a variety of other vessels. the arctic can be circumnavigated in these conditions and was done so by the northern peoples. it is not much of a stretch to drop down into europe, or cruise up and across from europe or asia, either one is equally accessible.

anyways, this is interesting reading:

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/09/out ... /index.htm

Grizz

Of equal interest was their statement that the arctic ice was MUCH heavier than normal....Bite Me, Al Gore

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:33 pm

yeah, and the kicker is the trip was in 2009

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:45 pm

You anti global warming guys amuse me.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 12:46 am

Mescalero wrote:You anti global warming guys amuse me.

that's not me, I'm not against it. I am 100% for global warming. the world is a much nicer place to live today than it was twenty thousand years ago. people grow food where ice used to be a mile thick.

you ever try to grow a tomato on a glacier? I think you would pray for a warm globe if you had.

rest assured, exactly like a market reversal inflection point where the highest offer is rejected, and the crash down takes off from that point, exactly like that, when the globe stops warming and starts cooling, the mile high ice will be on the plains in a geological heartbeat.

global_temp_map.jpg

study this climate map and you will soon see that warm spells are narrow timeframes and they end suddenly, almost instantly. the only time you can eat what you like when you like to is when you are in a warm period. if you look at the map you will see that they are few and far between.

AND, MORE TO THE POINT, THE ICE STARTS COMING BACK THE INSTANT THE GLOBE STOPS WARMING UP. STOPPING GLOBAL WARMING WILL START GLOBAL GLACIATION. HOW PATHETIC IS THAT?

BAGTIC · Post by **BAGTIC** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 10:25 am

Now why would Chinese or anyone else come here looking for Port Orford cedar for their boat masts. They obviously had good enough masts to get all the way here before they left home. Furthermore how would they know that Port Orford Cedar existed here until after they were already here which precludes it being the reason they came in the first place.

Much of these historical interpretations depend on someone having an agenda to further in the first place.

Did Marco Polo discover China? There is some doubt. Why would someone who made such a trip neglect to mention the Great Wall of China the largest structure on earth. Did he really go or just assemble a collection of tales told by others, an anthology like the Bible.

Why do Italians celebrate Columbus Day? There is no evidence he was Italian and good evidence that he wasn't. Good case for his being Greek. He wrote in Greek and Spanish, not Italian. Italian Americans just wanted a holiday?

It is like American Hispanics claiming Farragut was the first Hispanic admiral in the USN when in fact he was American born and his father was a British citizen. Political agenda.

Why aren't Spaniards 'Hispanic'? Political agenda.

piller · Post by **piller** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:33 pm

The Cimarron used to flow out near Liberal in SouthWestern Kansas. It is now dry. Has been since Colorado stopped the flow of water to the Arkansas river, and thus to the Cimarron. Looking for artifacts near the Cimarron would be easy now.

As far as who got to where first, that will always be up for debate. I am wondering if the people who were actually first were here before continental drift broke up Pangea. They might have been subsequently attacked and wiped out. Then, another wave of invaders may have taken over from the second group, and so on.

Several years ago, I saw some sort of Discovery Channel special where there were red haired, green eyed mummies found in China that the carbon 14 dating showed them to pre-date the Chinese people. Then, there was a Native American tribe that tended to be blond haired and blue eyed. In modern times, we had Ishi come out of the wilds in California. Though his tribe was thought to be extinct, they were related to another tribe who are still around in Northern California. What I am saying is that we don't know it all, and what we think we know may be based on incorrect information since humans have a habit of moving from place to place and our ancestors did not always leave evidence that would last.

As far as the end of the World, I don't know and am trying to just be ready to accept it when or if it comes in my lifetime. I have no control over it, and cannot be disappointed if it does not happen in my lifetime.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:37 pm

piller wrote:As far as who got to where first, that will always be up for debate. I am wondering if the people who were actually first were here before continental drift broke up Pangea. They might have been subsequently attacked and wiped out. Then, another wave of invaders may have taken over from the second group, and so on.

Check your old calendars for the dates of the break up of Pangaea and Gondwanaland.

piller · Post by **piller** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:43 pm

I know, that supposedly happened before modern humans existed. Funny thing, there are not many fossil records of the smaller species from back then. We would have been a smaller species back then, and would have been on the menu.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:49 pm

Pangaea broke up about 200 million years ago, give or take a few months

.

Mammals have been around only 65 million years, and so the whole class Mammalia wasn't available for the ride. Within mammals anything even remotely human like is not older than 3-4 million years as I recall. So, I think your idea of epic battles for the continent just aren't really plausible given scale of the differences in time.

Putting humans on North America prior to 25 thousand (not even close to 1 million, never mind 200 million) just doesn't hold up.

bdhold · Post by **bdhold** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 2:40 pm

Koreans believe they're the ancestors of native Americans.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 4:23 pm

glad to see this one resurface. was just reading this one today, it doesn't answer everyone's questions, but it does give a reliable picture of what is going to happen if the brilliant ones manage to stop climate warming:

http://hugefloods.com/Pleistocene.html

fun links too

Grizz

jeepnik · Post by **jeepnik** » Fri Oct 10, 2014 5:43 pm

Ray Newman wrote:Gents: I should have typed December 2012 as the date when the Mayans supposedly predicted then end of world. I am a two-fingered typist and a poor proof reader.

Anyway, seems that since the Mayan calendar "ended" (??) sometime December 2012, it was interpreted by many that the Mayan predicted the end of the world. If I recall correctly, it was to happen around Christmas?? And here it is September 2014.

Just one more prediction of the end of the world that didn't come true. Then again, if it had I guess we wouldn't be talking about it.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:59 pm

The calendar in my kitchen ends on 31 December of this year. I guess the new End of the World is only 2.5 months away.

BAGTIC · Post by **BAGTIC** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 12:54 pm

The fact that some Norse long ships had jade Buddhas does not prove that the Norse traveled to China. I have things in my house from many different countries none of which I have ever visited. It only shows that there were trade routes along which goods were passed.

Why did Marco Polo never mention the Great Wall of China in his diary. Perhaps he was never in China but was merely retelling tales pass along from one merchant to another. It was unlikely that he had been to China without seeing he Wall and why would he not have remarked on it considering other relatively trivial observations?

Do to others as you would have them do to you. Jesus prior to approximately 35 A.D.

Do not unto others what you would not they should do unto you.” Confucius prior to death in 479 B.C.

Does this prove Jesus knew Confucius? Had been to China? Read Chinese? None of the above?

Why do Italians celebrate Columbus Day when Columbus was not Italian and apparently did not even read Italian as all his writings were in Spanish, Greek, or Latin?

People with an ax to grind or a cause to promote often make wild leaps in their furtherance.

sore shoulder · Post by **sore shoulder** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 6:59 pm

octagon wrote:How do you "Discover" a country when kajillions of folks are already living there, having already formed a complex society? There were Native Americans living quite nicely all over the dang place before Chris or anyone else (Vikings) showed up. I guess I "discovered" Mexico on my last visit.

There's more an more evidence that what is currently being called the "native americans" were not here first. In spite of the fact that they conspire to stop all archaeological study by declaring areas with remains "sacred burial sites".

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 8:22 pm

There were Native Americans living quite nicely all over the dang plac

No way were they living quite nicely. They were robbing, pillaging, looting, raping, kidnaping, murdering, torturing, sacrificing, and other forms of mayhem, similar to isis in arabia, for most of their entire history. when they couldn't find any barbarians to murder they turned on themselves. Their societies were similar to all human societies, periods of absolute debauched depravity punctuated by short recovery periods. It's human nature.

Does this prove Jesus knew Confucius?

Of course Jesus knows Confucius, He created Confucius. He knew Confucius in his mother's womb.

Grizz

firefuzz · Post by **firefuzz** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 7:04 am

Lastmohecken wrote:
BlaineG wrote:
octagon wrote:How do you "Discover" a country when kajillions of folks are already living there, having already formed a complex society? There were Native Americans living quite nicely all over the dang place before Chris or anyone else (Vikings) showed up. I guess I "discovered" Mexico on my last visit.
The current iteration of NAs displaced a couple kajillion other NAs themselves. War and conquest has been a central part of humanity. I don't think we can put the genie back in the bottle. Give it a few hundred years. It looks like White folk are on the way out
Yes, except this world don't have a few hundred years left, before divine intervention. But whites do seem to be on our way out, because we are too liberal, too stupid, too lazy to vote, too independent, and too soft-hearten to protect what we have.

I'm hoping you're wrong about this, but fearful that you're not. I just had this discussion with a good friend a couple of days ago. If the liberals don't quit forcing political correctness on us, either that or we just stand up and say "screw you", we're doomed. And until we're ready to get down in the gutter with them and cut off a few heads and light up a few terrorist ourselves we'll never win this.

My cousin retired from the US Army after 30 plus years of service about 2 years ago. Just this last week he finished selling his 80 acre "dream farm" that he's been paying for for the last 20 years and moving to Golfito, Costa Rico. He was so sick of US policy on terrorist and situation like Ferguson, MO that he couldn't stand living here any longer. He bought a small place down there with a nice house on it and it already building another big house to move into. The other house he's keeping for any of our family that wants to come down there to live in until they can get established.

If it wasn't for my grandbabies I'd be packing.

Rob

Gobblerforge · Post by **Gobblerforge** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 7:20 am

Now that we have the ability, look at Google Earth and you can see the ocean depths. If you lower the oceans to glacial levels, you will see that humans could almost walk here from Europe around the north rim with only a few short boat trips. This is no different than the Bearing Strait crossing the Mongols used. Then if you take the lower ocean levels into consideration, you also get this; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bh2QwvR3aOo With Atlantis in the middle, the ocean stretches weren't as long.
Gobbler

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 6:33 pm

Gobblerforge wrote:Now that we have the ability, look at Google Earth and you can see the ocean depths. If you lower the oceans to glacial levels, you will see that humans could almost walk here from Europe around the north rim with only a few short boat trips. This is no different than the Bearing Strait crossing the Mongols used. Then if you take the lower ocean levels into consideration, you also get this; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bh2QwvR3aOo With Atlantis in the middle, the ocean stretches weren't as long.
Gobbler

That was enlightening....I hope that's true, and not a hoax....

More, and more myths, and old stories are proving true.... Science has even found God in the Big Bang....

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 8:16 pm

You are dilusional.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 9:23 pm

Mescalero wrote:You are dilusional.

About God? It doesn't have to be the Christian God...... God, no matter what he's called, just IS.......(Not Izlam....that Alpha Hotel allah is a whole nother story....)

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 10:59 pm

It was a celestrial event, nothing more.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 11:09 pm

Mescalero wrote:It was a celestrial event, nothing more.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 11:13 pm

There was no god involved........................ it just happened.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Sat Feb 07, 2015 11:40 pm

Mescalero wrote:There was no god involved........................ it just happened.

what just happened?

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:22 am

Mescalero wrote:There was no god involved........................ it just happened.

In the beginning there was nothing....how did nothing happen?

Gobblerforge · Post by **Gobblerforge** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 7:10 am

[/quote]In the beginning there was nothing....how did nothing happen?

[/quote]
Oh, that's easy. I planted some flower seeds one time and watched them for days. Nothing happened.

BAGTIC · Post by **BAGTIC** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 11:30 am

bulldog1935 wrote:Koreans believe they're the ancestors of native Americans.

I believe the general consensus is that Amerindians originated in Siberia in the Amur River watershed. Not far from Korea.

BAGTIC · Post by **BAGTIC** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 11:35 am

Grizz wrote:
There were Native Americans living quite nicely all over the dang plac
No way were they living quite nicely. They were robbing, pillaging, looting, raping, kidnaping, murdering, torturing, sacrificing, and other forms of mayhem, similar to isis in arabia, for most of their entire history. when they couldn't find any barbarians to murder they turned on themselves. Their societies were similar to all human societies, periods of absolute debauched depravity punctuated by short recovery periods. It's human nature.

Does this prove Jesus knew Confucius?
Of course Jesus knows Confucius, He created Confucius. He knew Confucius in his mother's womb.

Grizz

Confucius predated Jesus. Jesus did not create anything or any one. He was the letter carrier delivering a message not the OEM.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:27 pm

Confucius predated Jesus. Jesus did not create anything or any one. He was the letter carrier delivering a message not the OEM.

How about the Trinity? Maybe Jesus was with His Father, and was sent down like you said.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:27 pm

Confucius predated Jesus. Jesus did not create anything or any one. He was the letter carrier delivering a message not the OEM.

Thank you for your opinion Sir. You are incorrect, and I will offer factual evidence for the Truth, because Truth matters. I only contest this because "it is appointed to man to die once, and after that judgement before God". Your soul is worth more to Christ than all the wealth of all the world we inhabit, which is why He died bearing our sins, so we could live with Him after this life.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

John 1. The darkness referred to here includes the misinformation you believe. The Word refers to Christ. He created the universe and everything in it and all life.

"Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own authority, but the Father who dwells in me does his works. Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me, or else believe on account of the works themselves."

John 7. Christ declares Himself to be God in the flesh. He came this way specifically to enable men to relate to their Creator. But unlike all the other claimants, Christ PROVED His credentials via His resurrection from the grave, and He authenticated His claims by fulfilling hundreds of ancient prophesies that predate Him by hundreds of years.

“Let not your hearts be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in me. In my Father’s house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you? And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also. And you know the way to where I am going.” Thomas said to him, “Lord, we do not know where you are going. How can we know the way?” Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you had known me, you would have known my Father also. From now on you do know him and have seen him.”

John 14. Again Christ assures his followers, and reassures them. And states that there is one and only one way to live with God in His kingdom.

After His death on the cross, burial, and resurrection:

"Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you.” Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe.” Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

John 20. This passage is where the quote "doubting Thomas" comes from. Christ showed Himself to his followers over a period of 40 days after His resurrection. When He ascended to heaven He did it in public before 500 witnesses.

Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

John 20. Everyone lives forever. Not everyone lives in the same place forever. The life that Christ promises here is eternal life in His presence. He creates this life because He is the Creator, the only God in existence, the only hope of everlasting life.

25 And he said to them, “O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken! Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?” And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he interpreted to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself.

John 20.

And this last is God's certification of the Truth, and God's authentication of the evidence so that all us doubters can be persuaded of the Truth, and believe Him, and receive eternal life. Christ made this connection many times during his ministry years.

HERE IS THE EVIDENCE: Christ referred to "all that the prophets have spoken." There are more than 300 specific prophesies concerning just Jesus, the time of His birth, the place of His birth, the place of His death, the manner of His death, His foster parents, his childhood, etc. All of which were written hundreds of years prior to His birth, by numerous authors.

The probability of just this subset of 300 fulfilled prophesies NOT being divine revelation is ONE times TEN followed by 168 zeros. 1X10^168, or impossible that it is not TRUE TRUTH.

For reference there are 1X10^80 subatomic particles in the universe, a tiny number compared to the probability above.

This is the corresponding probability that you, Sir, are correct. One chance in 10^168. One slim and impossible chance to hang your hopes on. I urge you to reconsider your position, to repent (change your mind) and turn to this authenticated proven and only God, accept Christ's sacrifice in your place, and receive the gift of eternal life, as promised above. This is the Gospel, and it is truly Good News.

I was a doubter, a hater, a scoffer, a mocker. I heard this message and His Blood covered all my sin, and Christ saved me. He wants to save you'all too.

In Christ,
Grizz

SteveR · Post by **SteveR** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 12:19 pm

Grizz wrote:
Confucius predated Jesus. Jesus did not create anything or any one. He was the letter carrier delivering a message not the OEM.
Thank you for your opinion Sir. You are incorrect, and I will offer factual evidence for the Truth, because Truth matters. I only contest this because "it is appointed to man to die once, and after that judgement before God". Your soul is worth more to Christ than all the wealth of all the world we inhabit, which is why He died bearing our sins, so we could live with Him after this life.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
John 1. The darkness referred to here includes the misinformation you believe. The Word refers to Christ. He created the universe and everything in it and all life.

"Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own authority, but the Father who dwells in me does his works. Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me, or else believe on account of the works themselves."
John 7. Christ declares Himself to be God in the flesh. He came this way specifically to enable men to relate to their Creator. But unlike all the other claimants, Christ PROVED His credentials via His resurrection from the grave, and He authenticated His claims by fulfilling hundreds of ancient prophesies that predate Him by hundreds of years.

“Let not your hearts be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in me. In my Father’s house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you? And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also. And you know the way to where I am going.” Thomas said to him, “Lord, we do not know where you are going. How can we know the way?” Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you had known me, you would have known my Father also. From now on you do know him and have seen him.”
John 14. Again Christ assures his followers, and reassures them. And states that there is one and only one way to live with God in His kingdom.

After His death on the cross, burial, and resurrection:

"Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you.” Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe.” Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”
John 20. This passage is where the quote "doubting Thomas" comes from. Christ showed Himself to his followers over a period of 40 days after His resurrection. When He ascended to heaven He did it in public before 500 witnesses.

Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
John 20. Everyone lives forever. Not everyone lives in the same place forever. The life that Christ promises here is eternal life in His presence. He creates this life because He is the Creator, the only God in existence, the only hope of everlasting life.

25 And he said to them, “O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken! Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?” And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he interpreted to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself.
John 20.

And this last is God's certification of the Truth, and God's authentication of the evidence so that all us doubters can be persuaded of the Truth, and believe Him, and receive eternal life. Christ made this connection many times during his ministry years.

HERE IS THE EVIDENCE: Christ referred to "all that the prophets have spoken." There are more than 300 specific prophesies concerning just Jesus, the time of His birth, the place of His birth, the place of His death, the manner of His death, His foster parents, his childhood, etc. All of which were written hundreds of years prior to His birth, by numerous authors.

The probability of just this subset of 300 fulfilled prophesies NOT being divine revelation is ONE times TEN followed by 168 zeros. 1X10^168, or impossible that it is not TRUE TRUTH.

For reference there are 1X10^80 subatomic particles in the universe, a tiny number compared to the probability above.

This is the corresponding probability that you, Sir, are correct. One chance in 10^168. One slim and impossible chance to hang your hopes on. I urge you to reconsider your position, to repent (change your mind) and turn to this authenticated proven and only God, accept Christ's sacrifice in your place, and receive the gift of eternal life, as promised above. This is the Gospel, and it is truly Good News.

I was a doubter, a hater, a scoffer, a mocker. I heard this message and His Blood covered all my sin, and Christ saved me. He wants to save you'all too.

In Christ,
Grizz

Thanks Grizz,

You explain it very well. Sometimes people just need to hear the Word, then sometime in the future it all clicks together, and they can put their doubts aside, and then hear the truth.

Steve