opinions please

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 11:58 am

It looks like for the short term, my long guns will need to go to a inside storage faclity.
I would be interested on your thoughts on such action?

harry · Post by **harry** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:15 pm

Do you mean away from your house? Or just need a safe.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:21 pm

Away from all the houses.
If I bring them back to Phoenix, I will have to go through a border patrol checkpoint.
I can imagine the excitement 36 long guns will generate.

wm · Post by wm » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:21 pm

Opinions......oh to be sure I got them. How many would you like?

I have a friend who got a really nice deal on a safety deposit box at a local bank (but he does a lot of business with them so they probably gave him a deal most folks off the street would not get) The box he got was 4' X4'X6' so you could expect it to hold 8 or maybe 12 rifles depending on circumstances.

Or you could do what I did a couple years ago when I had to leave town for a couple months on business........took all my rifles and pistols to a local gunsmith to have them cleaned. Told him to take his time and why and I would pick them up when I got back. Cost me $20 or $30 per gun but he stored them in his vault and they were covered by his insurance against theft or fire damage. On the plus side all of them were cleaned and because things were slow and he was breaking in a new guy he went through all the revolvers and did reliability packages for free and returned all the old parts to me so I have a nice little collection of replacement parts if I need them.

Once you start pricing stuff out for long term storage a real firearms vault starts to become more and more affordable. Check out Zanotti vaults. They can be assembled in a closet or a second floor or whatever because they come disassembled. I know that sounds strange but check them out and they will demonstrate.

http://www.zanottiarmor.com/pdf/brochure.pdf

Malamute · Post by **Malamute** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:22 pm

I've had to do that at times in the past. I used a facility that had a full time resident manager, 8 foot fence around it, the gates closed at 6:00 every day, and I was able to access my locker in a way that nobody could see what I was doing.

Holding cased (or uncased) guns vertical against your body helps, rather than carrying them horizontal by the carry handles for all the world to see what you have is a good idea.

Good luck.

ETA: Why would they know what you have in your vehicle at a checkpoint? I believe they are not legally able to search without a reason or permission. I've seen vids where the BP guys were getting very annoyed, by the peoples polite refusal to give them any information or let then know what was in the vehicle, but there wasn't anything legally they could do unless they had probable cause to search. Even then, its not illegal to own guns, theres no limit on how many anyone can own for the most part.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:35 pm

They are all good to go, I just have bad feelings about sitting in a cell while they run all the serial numbers.
Remeber I am right on the Mexican border and my route gets real close to it.

harry · Post by **harry** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:38 pm

Talk to the BP and see if they have any input. Sad times when a gun owner can't move his firearms without worring about LAW ENFORCEMENT taking them.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:41 pm

I would bundle them up well and put them inside an old refrigerator or chest freezer (or two), than fasten the refrigerator well with strapping (or maybe a few concealed threaded rods clear through the thing, so the door doesn't pop open at an inopportune time.

Get that in your storage unit with a bunch of other furniture (go to a garage sale if you don't have any to store with it), and get the furniture all piled around the refrigerator/freezers. Prior to final piling-on, a stout chain around the refrigerator might be a good idea, optionally.

People won't try to steal what they don't know is there...

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:57 pm

So, has Arizona and or New Mexico seceded from the union, and do they have an International Border now????

If I move from Illinois to Arizona I'll have all my toys in either a box truck or a trailer ... So I'm gonna have to cross an International border patrolled by US Border Patrol agents to get to AZ? Ummm, no I don't think so. At least I hope not.

As the previous poster said, it is not illegal to own guns and without a warrant they can't search your vehicle without PC.

So unless you are coming through Mexico I'm not sure what the problem is?

Not trying to be a smart aleck, just trying to understand your worries. And since I don't have all the facts, maybe I'm totally out of contact with reality. After all I've been stuck in The Peoples Democratic Republic of Illynoise for way too long.

Joe

Malamute · Post by **Malamute** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 1:00 pm

Mescalero wrote:They are all good to go, I just have bad feelings about sitting in a cell while they run all the serial numbers.
Remeber I am right on the Mexican border and my route gets real close to it.

Check the local laws. I've seen a number of comments by LEO's that unless they have probable cause or reasonable articulable suspicion a crime has been committed or is about to, they cant seize your guns for any reason (some state they can "for officer safety", but not to run them). They also shouldnt have any reason to search your vehicle, or legal reason to unless the PC or RAS, they cant search your vehicle without your permission,...and why ANYONE would grant permission to be searched is beyond me, whether they are crooks or not. It's supposed to be up to them to come up with a reason to detain and search you, not up to you to prove yourself innocent if they go for a fishing expedition in your vehicle. And giving them a fishing permit is retarded in my opinion.

I have the utmost respect for law enforcement, and a number of friends in that line, but they have rules they have to operate under as well. Making up the rules as they go, or walking all over citizens rights is beyond their legal limits.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 1:06 pm

The line at the BP station is not the place to debate constitutional law.
They would be in the bed of my 6ft. bed Ranger.
Hard to ignore.

Malamute · Post by **Malamute** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 1:12 pm

Apparently some do.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... nt+refusal

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 1:21 pm

If you are worried, you could always go way north and avoid them.

92&94 · Post by **92&94** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 1:34 pm

You're right that the line at a checkpoint is no place to debate your rights - while you could one day prevail in court, why go to all that hassle if you needn't?

One option is to take the more northern route back to Phoenix - takes a bit longer but there are no checkpoints.

A less practical option is to ship them to yourself - you can do so since there is no transfer taking place. Expensive and a PITA though.

Really the trouble is more with the general law enforcement mind than the BP itself - you could come to as much or more grief from a Highway Patrol officer or local cop. Even doing everything right there is the occasional traffic stop.

I used to worry about having guns in the car when passing through one or another of the checkpoints - but with very short hair and a cowboy hat on the dash they usually just wave me right through. The only time I got more than that it was about 3 questions and I was driving a uhaul truck in the middle of the night.

One time they were training the dogs and asked if they could put the training decoy on my pickup - I wasn't exactly happy with that idea, but let them do it. Lousy training, you could see the dog checking the same spot on each vehicle until he got to mine and found the decoy right where he expected to find it. Dog was smarter than the guys training him

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 1:36 pm

All roads going away from the border have checkpoints.
It seems silly to me to argue with BP, it seems even sillier to do it with a bunch of guns in the truck.

92&94 · Post by **92&94** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 2:24 pm

I keep forgetting that you're in the south end of the mountains. Must be easier to get down to 54 than all the way over to Cloudcroft and down to Alamo from there. I guess that even rules out crating them up and sticking them in a storage locker in Alamo.

I remember you mentioning that the control point on 54 is more inclined to hassle people than the two I pass through a lot.

Dusty Texian · Post by **Dusty Texian** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 2:32 pm

I go through Federal Border Patrol check points along the Texas/ Mexico border all the time,with many of my firearms in the truck with me. True not my whole collection but often six or more long guns and always 3 or so pistols. I can never remember being ask if I had firearms in the truck or how many, and most times they are visible. The normal question's are /Are you a US citizen? Where are you heading? or Did you do any good hunting? Most times they hear my voice and that answers the citizen part.This is close to Old Mexico but still the US . And I treat it that way! It is my right to go up and down the road packing my guns ,and I will continue to do it ! ,,,,,DT

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 5:17 pm

Pretty sad that you should have to show more than a driver's license. I live less than thirty miles from an international border
and have yet to be stopped by the BP. Maybe being a Yankee isn't so bad.

jb

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 5:38 pm

J Miller wrote:As the previous poster said, it is not illegal to own guns and without a warrant they can't search your vehicle without PC.

Thanks to

a) the Holy War on Drugs, and
b) the Aren't-you-a Patriot Act,

They can basically search anything they want, any time they want, IF they want to badly enough.

The big question is, whether or not having a bunch of toys that they'd like to have for themselves, gives them enough reason/temptation to decide to 'run' them in hopes some aren't provably yours, or worse yet, enough to accidentally find some 'drugs' in your vehicle.

Most cops are honest, but then again most citizens are as well; the difference is that if you are unfortunate enough to get a dishonest one, you have a much harder time defending yourself against the latter.

. . . of course you may be lucky and get THIS guy. . .

(sorry if that was the one you posted about earlier)

williamranks · Post by **williamranks** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 6:36 pm

Mescalero wrote:It looks like for the short term, my long guns will need to go to a inside storage faclity.
I would be interested on your thoughts on such action?

Done it a few times. I used a storage that has double security, pass code for the gate and don't open any door not listed for your pass code or someone will come see you.
I put everything in silicon gun socks and into hard cases. Then I put the cases on saw horses with a center shelf so I can have two levels. Last thing is cover it all with a plastic tarp, in case the sprinklers go off. I leave the ammo there too instead of the house, firefighters stand waaay back, or go have coffee, when the first round goes off.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:09 pm

williamranks,
that is very helpful,
Thank you.

vancelw · Post by **vancelw** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:27 pm

2ndovc wrote:...Maybe being a Yankee isn't so bad.

jb

You keep telling yourself that if it gives you solace. Bless your heart.

I ventured out in southwest Texas back in April and was a little unsettling to have to stop at checkpoints in my own state I've lived in most of my life. They were very low pressure. Stalled us long enough to run the dogs around the truck and check out or accents. No DL check. They are supposedly trying to stop drug trafficking and illegal immigration, but I saw 5 or 6 illegal border crossings in Big Bend and no one cared. I don't care if that village has been across the river for 100 years, it's a weak point in our security.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 8:09 pm

Candalaria?

harry · Post by **harry** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 8:55 pm

Go to walmart and get yourself a FBI tee shirt, when you get to the BP station tell them you are with the "fast and furious" and the guns are for government.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:19 pm

williamranks · Post by **williamranks** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:22 pm

Mescalero wrote:williamranks,
that is very helpful,
Thank you.

I'm not just good lookin.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:23 pm

Says who?

flatnose · Post by **flatnose** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 1:47 am

I have been stopped many times at the california check points on I94 and on I8 , and never had any issues even with a pickup bed full of guns and ammo. The border patrol was not interested, and didnt even look in the back after I told them what I was carrying.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 9:40 am

Now with more information I'll make another comment.

When I lived in AZ and drove a PU I NEVER transported my guns in the open bed. Not even within the state. I put a camper shell on it, put the guns in cases under a big blanket and other things so their outlines would be obscured and locked the camper door.

Or the guns went behind the seats, again out of sight.

That way a look see by anyone wouldn't show guns.

Never had a problem.

Traveled across country with guns and ammo in a locked U-Haul trailer and again no problems.

That is my current suggestion. Rent a lockable box trailer and secure them out of sight. You're moving and taking your possessions with you. End of story.

Joe

Bill in Oregon · Post by **Bill in Oregon** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:06 am

Sad thread indeed. The prospect of BP checkpoints raises all sorts of allusions: "polizei," "papers," "dossier." What a country this has turned out to be ...

Larkbill · Post by **Larkbill** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:42 am

"I would bundle them up well and put them inside an old refrigerator or chest freezer (or two), than fasten the refrigerator well with strapping (or maybe a few concealed threaded rods clear through the thing, so the door doesn't pop open at an inopportune time.

Get that in your storage unit with a bunch of other furniture (go to a garage sale if you don't have any to store with it), and get the furniture all piled around the refrigerator/freezers. Prior to final piling-on, a stout chain around the refrigerator might be a good idea, optionally."

The Storage Wars folks are going to wet their pants when they open this one!

jeepnik · Post by **jeepnik** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:47 am

J Miller wrote:So, has Arizona and or New Mexico seceded from the union, and do they have an International Border now????

If I move from Illinois to Arizona I'll have all my toys in either a box truck or a trailer ... So I'm gonna have to cross an International border patrolled by US Border Patrol agents to get to AZ? Ummm, no I don't think so. At least I hope not.

As the previous poster said, it is not illegal to own guns and without a warrant they can't search your vehicle without PC.

So unless you are coming through Mexico I'm not sure what the problem is?

Not trying to be a smart aleck, just trying to understand your worries. And since I don't have all the facts, maybe I'm totally out of contact with reality. After all I've been stuck in The Peoples Democratic Republic of Illynoise for way too long.

Joe

Joe, what he is talking about is the type of checkpoint we've had in California on the I-5 for decades. They are usually on choke points that illegals would have to go thru. In our case, it's on the freeway as it passes through Camp Pendleton.

Irks the dickens out of me every time I have to slow down. I'd like to see them put a border patrol officer every three feet on the border where they belong, but it's not politically correct to harass folks breaking the law, so the harass those that aren't.

I travel up and down the I-5 for business frequently. I always carry at least two handguns and a long gun. I have been stopped and had my vehicle searched twice. The very first question they as is "do you have any weapons". The first time I smiled and produced my CCW. The result was a very through search. Hmm, you'd think it would be the other way around considering the hoops one must jump through to get a CCW here.

Now, I know darned good and well the reason I was "selected" was the NRA sticker on the window. But, proving that would be impossible.

The second time I just told them to take a look. They actually missed one of the handguns. When approached about the ones I they had found, I told them they needed to learn to search better. Yea, I know it isn't smart to tempt fate, but I'd already lost about an hour, and I figured what the heck.

When this happened a "supervisor" showed up and told me that had I just produced my CCW things would have gone much smoother. I told him it didn't work the last time.

I think I'm on some sort of list now. When I approach the checkpoint, they wave me straight through. The letters and emails I had sent up the border patrol chain of command, on an attorneys letter head probably got more attention than had I sent them in person.

Sometimes you need to remind "authority" that it is you that gives them that authority.

Mescalero, I've never needed to do what you need to, but the gun club I belong to has storage available for folks when they do things like show a house for sale fumigate, etc. Any clubs in your area?

jeepnik · Post by **jeepnik** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:50 am

2ndovc wrote:Pretty sad that you should have to show more than a driver's license. I live less than thirty miles from an international border
and have yet to be stopped by the BP. Maybe being a Yankee isn't so bad.

jb

The idiots in California will now issue a driver's license to illegals. The once vaunted piece of identification is now worthless.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 11:51 am

jeepnik,
You " get it "
Yeah I know they are legal and I would eventually get them back, but who needs the hassle.
This one is on I-10 outside of Las Cruces.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:09 pm

I would do as someone else mentioned earlier !

Ship them to yourself !

vancelw · Post by **vancelw** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 1:44 pm

6pt-sika wrote:I would do as someone else mentioned earlier !

Ship them to yourself !

I'd take my chances with transporting my own firearms long before I'd trust them to UPS, USPS, FedEX, or any other well known crushers of boxes.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 2:33 pm

You should have seen my guitar after UPS got done with it.

octagon · Post by **octagon** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 6:04 pm

I got hassled at the Las Cruces checkpoint. When the Boy was a baby he kept disconnecting his belt and crawling out of his carseat. When I saw the sign that said "checkpoint ahead" I turned around and sure enough he was loose again. I stopped and went around the suburban and hooked him back in. When I got to the window the fella said they watched me pull over and wanted to know where were the drugs I had stashed were. I told him about the escape artist, which he did not believe, and said he needed to search the truck, and I told him to go right ahead, I could use a stretch anyway. They waved me through and did not search all the guitar cases I had.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 6:29 pm

Wish I had known you when UPS broke the neck of my guitar.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 6:32 pm

vancelw wrote:
6pt-sika wrote:I would do as someone else mentioned earlier !

Ship them to yourself !
I'd take my chances with transporting my own firearms long before I'd trust them to UPS, USPS, FedEX, or any other well known crushers of boxes.

I ship guns darn near every day , mostly thru UPS and yes we have had some get broken . But for the number we've sent it comes out to about 2% .

I'm not a drugger or a felon etc etc etc , but I genrally take offense at any cop or border patrol etc etc etc . So if I don't give them reason to wanna talk to me then I'm better off and they're better off . I realize border patrol is what it is and those guys can have a rather un fun job . Same can be said for customs officers but some of those customs guys are just plain a..s..s..h..o..l..e..s .

vancelw · Post by **vancelw** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:20 pm

6pt-sika wrote:
vancelw wrote:
6pt-sika wrote:I would do as someone else mentioned earlier !

Ship them to yourself !
I'd take my chances with transporting my own firearms long before I'd trust them to UPS, USPS, FedEX, or any other well known crushers of boxes.
I ship guns darn near every day , mostly thru UPS and yes we have had some get broken . But for the number we've sent it comes out to about 2% .
.

I will ship a gun to someone who has purchased it from me. Obviously I'm not attached to it or I wouldn't have sold it. Insurance (hassle and all) will cover it. (yes I always buy insurance.)
But my own personal guns that I plan on keeping....no way....I've had too many packages (guns included) left where they shouldn't have been. Boxes smashed. Nope, if it's mine to keep I'll keep it with me and take it wherever I go.

If you put it in storage, you better put it in a sealed container with desiccant. Sprinklers, moisture from other sources, chemicals other idiots store in adjacent storage units....

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Sun Sep 07, 2014 8:29 pm

1st, take the "La Raza" bumper sticker off.

2nd, I'd I do as willliamranks sez.

octagon · Post by **octagon** » Mon Sep 08, 2014 6:35 am

UPS keeps me in business! I should have those boys on the payroll. My experience is similar to 6pt, very low damage percentages when shipping with them, airports damage WAY more stuff.