357 Revolver Accuracy Question

[Tycer]

I'm practicing for Whitetail hunting with my Smith model 66–8 357 with 180 grain cast LBT wide flat nose over 14.7 grains of LilGun just shy of 1400 fps. Using factory sights, I am able to consistently (a box of 50, each outing) hit a paper plate at 50 yards but it is all over the plate. Is this normal? Should I be better than that for whitetail?

[Griff]

Do you mark an aiming spot on that plate? If so, how close is your first & second shots? What position are you shooting from? My feeling is that if your 1st & 2nd shots are within a couple of inches of that aiming spot, you'd be good to go. After about the 3rd shot, if shooting off-hand you begin to tire, and accuracy falls off. The ban of any bullseye shooter. Rested, you should be good for the 1st 5 to 10 shots, then eye fatique will begin to creep up on ya... sooner the older you get.

[Tycer]

Sitting on my hunt comfort cushion in a field my elbow on my knee. No, there is no rhyme to my pattern. The target is a gray ram with a bullseye on 8 1/2 x 11. I'm always within an 8 1/2" circle on and around the bull. I can't really see the bull if the front sight is clear. Shooting this revolver, I'm really appreciative of the aperture sights on my rifles. Yes, by the end of the box I'm fatigued and things are blurry. Still hit the paper though. Starting tomorrow I'll add an elevated heart rate to the mix.

[Hawkins]

Tycer,

I'd say that is quite good shooting. Not a whole bunch of people could consistently put every shot in an 8" circle, from the shooting position you describe, using an iron sighted revolver.

Have you had a chance to test your load off a bench rest, at a well defined bullseye, to see how much of the group is due to the gun? A typical "good" revolver/ammo combination might be expected to shoot a 4" group at 50 yards, once you eliminate any shooter error. Of course, if you can find a more accurate load, so much the better. You might also do a little research into ways to slightly modify your shooting position to be more stable.

Another way to look at it is that an 8" circle is about the size of a smallish deer's vitals, so you can reliably take shots out to 50 yards. Which again, is not bad at all with the gun you are using.

Hawkins

[TedH]

I'd say you're good to go at normal bow hunting distances. You're doing better than most would be able to do.

[Booger Bill]

I wouldn't want you hunting me.

[Blaine]

In my not so expert opinion, that is perfectly good for deer hunting.....
IMO, a more realistic hunting practice would be setting the shooter down for awhile and shoot something else, then pick it up and try a shot after you get cold....You ain't gonna have 10 shots to warm up on the deer stand (but, you know that). If you're feeling frisky, figger out which cyl shoots best, and mark them.

[AJMD429]

Shooting this revolver, I'm really appreciative of the aperture sights on my rifles.

Consider an aperture sight on your handgun. I have a couple set up that way and like them pretty well.


viewtopic.php?f=1&t=43463

[tman]

I'd be more than happy with the accuracy results and the load that you are using. Good Hunting.

[Griff]

Personally, I agree with TedH & Hawkins, you're doing far better than most. But, I also think you're shooting too much at a time. 5 to 10 shots during a session should be the max. As one coach puts it, practice perfectly for perfect practice. If you slip down into forcing yourself to maintain, you also run the risk of reinforcing bad habits or form, both of which affect your accuracy.

If you're using an archery type target, (colored with simply a circle outline to define the internal organs), then your 8" group is quite good.

Your shooting position sounds like it's not very stable. If your knees are not at your chest level, you may be hunching over to get that elbow on the knee, then you're craning your neck to align your eye with the sights... that adds a significant level of physical stress to your position. A lot of the positioning depends on your physical conformation... I'm fairly equal in height from the ground to my hips, and from the hips to the eyes, but I still need to get my heels quite close to my butt to get my knees high enough so I'm not hunched over to get aligned with the sights... I find leaning back against an upright (a tree in the field), when sitting eases my discomfort level and I can better place my shots. When that's not practical, I actually try to put my elbows in front of my knees, leaning forward so more of my upper arms are in contact with my shins. This gives better than a simple point of contact, but rather a "plane" of contact. Wish I could draw...
http://www.handgunhunt.com/promo/member ... php?oid=11
Actual hunting, I would be happy with that, but in practice... I'd expect better at 50 yards... in practice.

[Chuck 100 yd]

That is pretty good shooting IMHO. I would not hesitate to hunt Whitetails with those results. Keep your shots within 50 yd. and post a pic of your buck when you get home.

[Grizz]

I agree you are shooting well. I suggest a different approach to combine with your current drill: either use pop cans and spread them around at lots of different distances, or one of the orange plinker thingys that you can bounce around, and walk around the targets so all aspects are changing.

I used to walk beaches and plink seashells for this drill. Teaches a lot and tells a lot. You might enjoy it too.

Regards

[Blaine]

A bit off topic, but when I hunted with my 629PP (6.5 inch ported) I had a Burris Speed Dot on it....Holy cow, I'm usually an average handgun shot, but with that Burris on there, I could do paper plates at 100+ with a good rest. At 25 yards, it was ORH.....

[Malamute]

Consider an aperture sight on your handgun. I have a couple set up that way and like them pretty well.

I'll suggest an aperture on your glasses, a Merit device. They make a big difference in making both sights and target all in focus.

As for "doing better than most.....", I'll just say I try to do the best I can as a goal, not to just be better than most. That can be a wide spectrum, but if one applies themself, they can often far outdo what's "average".

[flatnose]

It sounds like your accuracy is quite fair, especially with the recoil from heavy bullets at that velocity. I think I would try a lighter bullet and fire 5 or 6 at a time with a break in between.

[Buck Elliott]

You don't want to hit the plate.. You want to hit a Spot on that plate.. Just like on a deer, don't shoot at the deer; shoot at a particular spot on that deer..

[MrMurphy]

What they said, pretty decent shooting.

If you really want to see what you can do accuracy wise, shoot prone off a sandbag, no more than one cylinder at a time.

Crank off six, close your eyes and rest them (don't fall asleep) wait a couple minutes, try another six. Eye strain will significantly affect groups.

When we qualify at 25 (pick your position but shooting from cover), most of our guys stare too long and their hits wander around. Look, aim, shoot, close eyes for a few seconds, repeat.

[Ji in Hawaii]

I too would be very satisfied with every shot in a paper plate at 50 yards with a hunting handgun, easy minute of deer.
As mentioned earlier hunt like a bow hunter, and you should do just fine.

[Grizz]

You don't want to hit the plate.. You want to hit a Spot on that plate.. Just like on a deer, don't shoot at the deer; shot at a particular spot on that deer..

this.

plus the value of varying distances. my sbh was zeroed at around 60 or so yards (paced off on a beach) and I missed a head shot on a deer about 8' away. held under on the second try and dropped it. the value of varying the distances. [ it stood still for two shots]

paper plates aren't realistic hunting targets once the gun is on paper, unless one is hunting from a fixed location, I guess.

[crs]

Plenty good for hunting accuracy. The lung area is larger than the paper plate and a 180 grain .357 will shoot through both lungs (or anything else, for that matter), and you have your deer (or anything else, for that matter).

Back when I shot pistol silouhette with my 6 inch Model 19 regularly at the Dallas Pistol Club I could score 70% standing and off hand at all ranges, but it took lots of practice. I always planned to take a deer with it and wore it on all my hunts, but when the opportunity came, I always used my .308; just habit I guess. So, do not take a rifle with you and you will likely get your pistol-deer.

[Hawkins]

I think of it maybe a little differently than a couple of folks have explained here. You absolutely want to pick a precise spot on the deer. Otherwise, you'll just kind of aim in the middle of the deer, which will be a gut shot. But, once you've picked that spot, you are going to wobble around, unless you've toted your concrete bench and Ransom rest out to the deer stand. For me, if I worry about hitting that exact spot, it makes me want to jerk the trigger as it wobbles by. Instead, so long as my "wobble zone" is close enough to that spot, i.e., still in the vitals, just keep squeezing the trigger. So long as you do everything else right, you'll still make a good shot. In other words, as one experienced shooter told me, if you're still on target, "why aren't you shooting?" I think this is especially true in the field, when you don't always have time to make a perfect shot, but a "good enough" shot will put meat in the pot. As always, what works for me might be a disaster for someone else, YMMV, no warranty expressed or implied, etc.

Hawkins

[jmiller]

If you can shoot that well on a deer you'll be OK. The problem is that deer and paper plates do different things to you when shooting. You'll need to have at least as good a rest on the deer as you do on the paper plate and you'll need to keep the adrenalin under control also. The fine motor skills are the first to go with even the least bit of an adrenalin dump. That all being said, you're still doing a bit better than most who own a handgun. I've shot, and killed, over fifty deer with the .357mag in a handgun (and a few more with other various and sundry calibers in a wide variety of handguns) and can shoot a bit better than that. The biggest thing you need to do is simply operate in the range and conditions you're proficient at. Deer hunting with a handgun usually doesn't involve shooting even at 50 yards in the woods. That's actually a much longer than average shot for woods deer hunting. If you're going to watch a bean field or something like that you might want to consider getting a single shot handgun in a rifle caliber and using sand bags.....but it's not nearly as rewarding as getting it done with a revolver in a handgun caliber. I think if you set yourself up in the right spot and get ready before the deer comes by you'll be fine at your present level and you've always got some room to get better. I wish you the best of luck and I think you'll have a lot of fun.