22 TCM, And The 5.7

[Blaine]

Are these fads, or something that will take hold? I'm inclined to say a 9mm +P with light boolits would be better.....Or, not?

[harry]

Blaine I don't have a pistol in 22 TCM but I do have a 22" barrel for my G2 contender in this caliber. It has taken the place of my 22 mag for the most part. They list it at 1875 fps out of the pistol with 6" barrel, I get just over 2600 fps in my G2. If I were to get the pistol as a kit with the 9mm/22TCM barrels I would use it for shooting jack rabbits or such but would not bet my life on it.
These are the components I currently use, their 40 gr bullets don't hold up well with the higher velocity in the rifle barrel.
http://www.ammosupplywarehouse.com/cgi- ... egory=TCM0

[Blaine]

Blaine I don't have a pistol in 22 TCM but I do have a 22" barrel for my G2 contender in this caliber. It has taken the place of my 22 mag for the most part. They list it at 1875 fps out of the pistol with 6" barrel, I get just over 2600 fps in my G2. If I were to get the pistol as a kit with the 9mm/22TCM barrels I would use it for shooting jack rabbits or such but would not bet my life on it.
These are the components I currently use, their 40 gr bullets don't hold up well with the higher velocity in the rifle barrel.
http://www.ammosupplywarehouse.com/cgi- ... egory=TCM0

With 22 Mag ammo running WAY more than some centerfire, I don't blame you.

[AJMD429]

I wanted a 9mm 1911, and we've had two Rock Island 1911's (single and double stack) that I really like - plus their service was great (after I killed the single action one trying to do an 'action job' on my own... ). So, when I saw a Rock Island in 9mm at the local gun shop for a good price, I told the guy I wanted it. He handed it to me and said "You'll like that, it's a real screamer, and the recoil isn't much at all." I thought he was just talking up the 9mm round, until he got the box and rest of the gun, and I saw the second barrel had a 22 caliber hole in the end. I figured it was a 22 LR adapter of some sort, but then he said "...and you can use the same magazines for both calibers..." When he asked if I wanted a few boxes of ammo to go with it, I said "Well, if you have a bunch, I'd by a brick of 500, but don't need it that bad otherwise..." He said "We have a couple thousand rounds, but can get more with no problem, so I'll sell you ten boxes." I'm thinking Oh cool, boxes of 100, maybe they have CCI in stock. Then he gets out these big boxes of 22 TCM, and I say "No, I don't need any 9mm - just the 22's".

Finally he realizes my elevator is stuck shy of the top floor, so he opens a box and says "These ARE the 22's....!"

So.......I took it home, shot it a bunch, and it has functioned flawlessly, and it goes through my soft steel gongs if they are closer than 75 yards.

I would trade my 22 Hornet rifle for one in 22 TCM, just so I had 'compatability', and also I'm betting it could be more accurate and flatter shooting than the Hornet from an equivalent rifle.

If ammo ever gets scarce, it can be made from 223 Rem (the 9mm case is not long enough for the conversion).

[Malamute]

Are these fads, or something that will take hold? I'm inclined to say a 9mm +P with light boolits would be better.....Or, not?

Better for what?

The discussions I've seen from door kicker/people shooter types seem to indicate nobody is all that impressed with the 5.7 so far. In a pistol its inferior to most service caliber rounds with good modern ammo, and in a carbine its inferior to 5.56. Not saying it couldn't be interesting or fun or a good varmint load, that's the reason for asking "better for what?"

[Blaine]

Are these fads, or something that will take hold? I'm inclined to say a 9mm +P with light boolits would be better.....Or, not?

Better for what?

The discussions I've seen from door kicker/people shooter types seem to indicate nobody is all that impressed with the 5.7 so far. In a pistol its inferior to most service caliber rounds with good modern ammo, and in a carbine its inferior to 5.56. Not saying it couldn't be interesting or fun or a good varmint load, that's the reason for asking "better for what?"

My "better than what" comment referred to the 9mm. I was positing that the 9mm with +P+ 115, or less grain bullets would be more effective than the hopped up .22s.....

[MrMurphy]

You have to remember the 5.7mm was designed with the intent on shooting Soviet Spetznaz troopers doing raids on NATO headquarters. Spetz wear armor (in the 80s, soft armor, no plates) and the 5.7mm was designed to be an idiotproof, almost no recoil personal defense weapon. Four or five office clerks going full auto throwing a lot of these around would give the Russians ample reason to "go away" and let the infantry handle them.

Thus the P90 was designed to be as protrusion-less as possible, ambi everything "the everyone gun" you could always have on. The pistol, obviously, came along since hey, why not.

They knew the round would not be a .700ThermonuclearMagnumbearkiller. Something like the M1 carbine, not an FAL in a tiny package.

Having spoken to several people who have shot guys with the 5.7mm and the 4.6mm (HK MP7) you basically have to either "sprinkle" 10-25 rounds into the center mass in a hurry, or (easy to do with either weapon) do a burst to the head.

None of them were particularly impressed with the rounds in "sprinkling center mass" as you use up a lot of ammo in a hurry, but the targets "do" die.....eventually.

Personally, I'll go with a 9mm in a pistol, and aim for non-armored parts as best I can. Even after penetrating armor (their more or less sole design intent) the 5.7 and 4.6 aren't super impressive in terminal ballistics.

[wolfdog]

I have the 22TCM/9mm full size double stack. Gun has given me no issues. For self defence I would use the 9 with a mag full of 115 grain +p. The 22tcm is just plain fun. Accurate as heck, will punch through mild plate and will turn an apple into juice at 30 yards.

[Panzercat]

Within it's range, 22tcm will nearly do what .45acp ball does. The results are only slightly less destructive against a side of ham and definitely better than 9mm ball. The youtube video is out there, which also shows penetration against steel plate and bulletproof glass; neither of which 45 performed well against for obvious reasons. As a throwback to a previous conversation, 22tcm will breach 3a body armor sans trauma plate.

The only thing that has kept me from getting serious about picking one up is the mag problems I've heard. Not sure if those have been fixed or not, but it looks like they're making a glock conversion variant of the round now.

[cas]

One of the RIA 22TCM/9mm is on my "next" list.

Of course there are about 4 other guns also in the next slot with no funds to make it happen. It's a lower priority next as I know it won't have staying power in terms of my interest.

I think a 1911 22TCM could nicely fill the roll my Ruger Bisley .22 Long Snapper does now.
(That being something something really neat, that most people don't have, that sits in my safe for 3-4 years at a time without being used. lmao)

[kaschi]

I've had no experience with the 22TCM but sure would like to change that. My hunch is that this caliber will catch on and more manufacturers will be offering conversion barrels for the caliber. Kinda makes a guy wonder why it wasn't developed years ago.

[cas]

Well there was the .224 Boz. i think they started testing with a 9mm case necked down to .22, then went 10mm for more velocity.

But they did just about everything possible to keep that from being a success. Kept a tight grip on it as a propriety round so no one would sell it or make guns for it...

[piller]

I can see a use for the 22 TCM. It might be a good small varmint caliber, and it is easily switched to a 9mm. For woods walking where nothing bigger than a coyote is likely to be seen, it should be really nice. You would have the benefit of using the gun which you are familiar with. I do not know anything about reloading it, but that might be a bonus. Can it be reloaded using the .22 caliber bullets which are available at most gun stores?