Loads for Win. 45-90 BPCR

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 7:56 am

Just picked up a new Winchester Classic 1886 in 45-90 BPCR. In a post on the old Leverguns Forum this was discussed a little bit. But now that I have one I'd like to hear what other experienced levergunners are using in their 45-90's.

IIRC, someone said disregard the "blackpowder only" warnings as there were no SAAMI guidelines for 45-90 smokeless or something like that at the time of manufacture and to go ahead and use smokeless. Just work the loads up.

Plus experiences in shooting 45-70 in a 45-90. And does anyone know the twist rate on the bbl.? I'm lazy and would rather ask.

What say ye?

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:20 pm

I would like to thank crs from the leverguns forum for his links to past threads on leverguns. I only hope he runs around here. I can't reply to his posts.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 12:43 am

kimwcook wrote:I would like to thank crs from the leverguns forum for his links to past threads on leverguns. I only hope he runs around here. I can't reply to his posts.

I sent him an email saying he was being paged. In the interim, you can email Accurate Powder, Inc. and ask for their suggestions for AA5744. I use it in two of my large capacity BP calibers.

KirkD · Post by **KirkD** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:15 am

Here are some loads I used and chronographed in my original Winchester 1886 .45-90 (made in 1888) out a 26" barrel:

25.6 grains IMR 4227 and a sheet of 1-ply toilet paper filler under a 330 grain Gould bullet for 1,369 fps and an E.S. of 47 fps and an S.D. of 18 fps.

27 grains IMR 4227, no filler, under a 330 Gould bullet for 1,466 fps, and E.S. of 31 fps, and an S.D. of 12 fps.

29.3 grains of XMP 5744, a sheet of 1-ply toilet paper filler under a 330 grain Gould bullet for 1,430 fps, and E.S. 38 fps.

30.5 grains of XMP 5744, a sheet of 1-ply toilet paper filler under a 330 grain Gould bullet for 1,477 fps, an E.S. of 15 fps, and an S.D. of 6 fps.

32.2 grains of XMP 5744, no filler, under a 318 grain GC bullet for 1,484 fps and an E.S. of 31 fps and an S.D. of 11 fps.

30 grains of SR4759, no filler, under a 300 grain cast bullet for 1,557 fps, and E.S. of 55 fps, and an S.D. of 18 fps.

34.1 grains of IMR 4198, no filler, under a 330 grain Gould bullet for 1,562 fps, and E.S. of 67 fps, and an S.D. of 25 fps.

Note: original BP velocity (according to 1896 catalogue) with a 300 grain cast bullet was 1,480 fps. Starline brass was used for all loads. These loads are safe in an original BP '86 that is in good shooting condition, and I'm sure they'd be even safer in a modern BP '86.

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:42 am

Thanks Griff.
I felt bad that he'd replied and spent time working on getting me information and everytime I tried to post, it'd kick me out. Arrrgggh.

KirkD
Thanks for the info. I have a question on the single ply of TP. The reason for it's use was to keep the powder back against the prime pocket for pressure spike reasons, reliable ignition, etc...

KirkD · Post by **KirkD** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 9:28 am

kimwcook wrote: I have a question on the single ply of TP. The reason for it's use was to keep the powder back against the prime pocket for pressure spike reasons, reliable ignition, etc...

The reason I use TP filler in many loads is twofold:

1. It keeps the powder against the primer, producing more consistent burning. The velocities are more uniform and the ES and SD are lower.

2. It acts as a gasket around the base of the cast bullet, improving accuracy in many cases.

The TP is loosely folded and rolled to fill the gap between the powder and the base of the bullet. I would advise against TP in high end loads, with fast powders (faster than 2400), and with bottle neck cases. For those who do not wish to use TP filler, I'd recommend some of the non-filler loads I posted.

crs · Post by **crs** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:38 am

Hello Kim;
You are welcome and I hope the information was interesting and useful.
Can you describe your 1886 rifle? You saw the picture of mine, is your like that or what?
Regards. crs

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:00 pm

crs,

First let me thank you for the links. They were great.

Second, my rifle looks just like yours, Marble tang sight and all, except for mine's not a take down model. I think yours is by the looks of it, or am I wrong? I love it.

Thanks again.

Mike D. · Post by **Mike D.** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:29 pm

Kim, your rifle is by no stretch of the imagination a BP gun. I really have no idea why Miroku chose to misname the new .45-90 as a BPCR other than there being no current loads for that caliber.

Whatever, your gun is capable of handling whatever you choose to feed it and how much recoil you wish to subject yourself to. The steel is no different than that of the Miroku .45-70s and you know how strong they are. Without exception, they are the STRONGEST traditional leverguns made. By the way, I DO NOT include the Browning BLR in that category. It is a bolt gun in lever disguise.

crs · Post by **crs** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:07 pm

You are correct, mine is a takedown, which makes it easy to clean the chamber and barrel. Some folks have complained about the 9.5 pound weight, but it holds steady, shoots straight, and has no discernible recoil in the field.
WRT handloads, last year I did extensive research on .45-90 loads on bullet weights of 300, 325, 350, 400/405, and 450 grains with many different powders and wrote the results onto old accounting spreadsheets. My intent was to key this information into my computer spreadsheet, but this project has been "overwhelmed by circumstances" and remains unfinished. Hope to get back to this one day, but meanwhile, I just hunt with the 1886 every chamnce I get. They are fun to shoot.
crs

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:49 pm

That's to cool and what it's all about, having fun and enjoying the trip there. Where ever that leads.