Were .22 butt-stock fed tube magazines a good idea?

[Fiddler]

As opposed to under-barrel mag tubes?
Which do you think was the better idea? Does anyone make buttstock-fed mag tubes anymore?

[Pete44ru]

Sure, butt-feed tube magazines can be a good idea - it's simply what the designer's trying for.

A butt mag both moves the balance point rearward, giving a somewhat faster-handling arm as opposed to a muzzle-heavier/steadier arm; AND protection for the magazine tube.

Additionally, a butt-feed magazine doesn't require a lifter/etc, since the direction of travel for the cartridges doesn't have to do a 180.

Both are rapidly loaded - I use free speedloaders, available at just about any US fast food condiment counter ( soft drink straws ).

.

[2ndovc]

Grandpa's Win. 63 feeds better than any .22 auto loader I've ever had.
Loads quickly too.

jb

[Blaine]

My forty some year old Browning .22 Auto functions as new....might be the only .22 I have that has never had a failure to fire or a jam of some sort.

[Idiot]

My butt-stock fed Remington Nylon 66 works perfect. I cannot say the same thing for some of the under-the-barrel tube fed or detachable magazine fed 22's I've owned.

[adirondakjack]

They're cheaper to make. Any time parts are internal instead of exposed, they don't require finishing or fancy furniture to hang em from.

[nemhed]

I don't know if it entirely related to the magazine but my Nylon 66 is the slickest semi auto .22 I've ever shot. It seems to be a more intuitive design in that the rounds don't have to change direction when being fed into the action.

[Big Bore 94]

The magazine tube is protected.

[jdad]

The muzzle is always pointing away from you, with butt fed.

Winchester had the 1903, 63, & 74.

Marlin had the 88 & 98.

Browning still makes theirs.

Remington had the 24 & 241.

There were probably more, but these were the most popular.

Winchester made over 400,000 Model 74's in either 22 Short or 22 LR. They had a "gallery" version of the 22short and offered the 88A peep as a factory option. This is one of my favorite 22 semi-autos. You push a spring loaded button, at the back of the receiver, and the whole bolt assembly slides out.

[COSteve]

My Dad's old Winchester model 74 semi-auto was a good shooter. It fed very well even when it was dirty. I bagged quite a few squirrels with it when I was a kid. Sadly, it was stolen during a move in 1988 before he could give it to me.

[Tumbleweeds II]

I like them. I don't have a semi auto rifle any more, but my brother has been shooting a Nylon 66 since about 1963 and has seen no reason to change. His rifle is a real shooter despite its light weight, and he could easily add weight to the front if he wanted to do so.

The problem with an under barrel mag is the 180 degree turn mentioned earlier. The problem with a stack mag, in any rimmed cartridge, is the cartridges stack at an angle like a pile of notebooks, creating jam potential. So, we are left with the butt mag and the Ruger rotary mag.

Winchester 63, anyone?

[awp101]

Winchester made over 400,000 Model 74's in either 22 Short or 22 LR. They had a "gallery" version of the 22short and offered the 88A peep as a factory option. This is one of my favorite 22 semi-autos. You push a spring loaded button, at the back of the receiver, and the whole bolt assembly slides out.

That makes me miss my 74s. I had a Short (1939 production) and a LR (late 40s IIRC). I may have to track another down...

Has anyone ever made a butt-fed bolt action? And FWIW one of the recent Russian imports (I want to say the TOZ78 or TOZ99) was mag fed but the bolt removal and take down were exactly like the Win74.

[JohndeFresno]

My butt-stock fed Remington Nylon 66 works perfect. I cannot say the same thing for some of the under-the-barrel tube fed or detachable magazine fed 22's I've owned.

I have a problem with mine. I put all the rounds down the stock OK. Then, when I lift the '66 up in the air to shove the spring loaded follower in, all the little bitty bullets come flying out all over the ground.

EDIT: Above was probably too subtle. The moral of the story is that I don't like having to point the barrel down towards the ground, and possibly have the muzzle hit the dirt, in order to reload. With the deeply scalloped well on the butt, it is easier cant the rifle steeply to use gravity to drop the bullets in. But that necessitates standing up to reload. In fact, that is the only thing I don't like about my model of the '66; I would have rather had a magazine.

[Mokwaw]

I think it is a good idea and seems to work well. I have had and used Win 74, Rem 66, Browning ATD, all worked very well. I presently have a Norinco ATD (Browning copy) and it works too.

[Gun Smith]

My 1947 M. 63 is the nicest shooting 22 I've ever used. I purchased it in 1960 from a tuna boat captian. It had been on the boat for several years and was a rusty mess. I refinished the stock and had it reblued. Good as new. I've never put a replacement part in it and I don't think it's ever jammed either. I love the "ring" of the steel action when shooting it. The feel of an all steel gun just can't be duplicated by any steel/composite one.

[Adobe Walls]

Howdy:

Just HAD to jump in on this one. My greatest experience with butt fed .22's is the M 74, and I really like the rifle. I also liked the nylon 66's that my nephew and a friend owned as well. It's probably an advantage in more ways than one.AW

[Terry Murbach]

As I look back into 22 gun history I think perhaps it is the best magazine possible for a 22 rifle. You will not lose it as you can a box magazine [ Elmer hated these for this reason..] and you will not bend nor ding the dickens out of it like is easily done with an external tube magazine. It is perfectly protected inside the stock and I have never seen a feeding malfunction in any 22 rifle so equipped.
THIS WAS A GOOD AND INTERESTING QUESTION !!!

[Lefty Dude]

As I look back into 22 gun history I think perhaps it is the best magazine possible for a 22 rifle. You will not lose it as you can a box magazine [ Elmer hated these for this reason..] and you will not bend nor ding the dickens out of it like is easily done with an external tube magazine. It is perfectly protected inside the stock and I have never seen a feeding malfunction in any 22 rifle so equipped.
THIS WAS A GOOD AND INTERESTING QUESTION !!!

I had a Browning 22 S-A Years ago with the butt mag. We had more jams with that piece. Beautiful little Rifle, finally got tired of the thing and traded it off. For a Semi- Auto 22 I now have a Remington 550-1 that will digest any 22 I care to feed the piece. Many consider this to be the best Semi-Auto 22 ever produced.

I agree the external tube is a weak-link for a magazine, however it is better than a clip or box magazine.

My other Magazine tube 22 Rifle is my 1905 Marlin Model 1897. In my opinion this is the best 22 lever-gun every produced. This model has a removeable external sheath over the magazine tube, rather than an internal removeable, which most all use.

[Gobblerforge]

Has anyone ever made a butt-fed bolt action?
Savage model 1911.
Gobbler

[Pete44ru]

[Has anyone ever made a butt-fed bolt action?]

The .22 cal post-64 Winchester Model 141 was one such.

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[Birdman]

My Remington model 66 sure works good. That thing is a work horse.