BEST 110gr jacketed 30-30 for 336??

[JohndeFresno]

Please excuse the sacrilege, cast bullet shooters.

I am looking for the best 100-110gr. jacketed bullet component to load for the Marlin .30-30 Model 336
Criteria:
1) For standard 336, not one that needs to be smithed, stoned, or otherwise modified

2) One that you can load with several in the tube, if at all possible - not one at a time

3) Preferably with a cannelure that can be used (some apparently must be crimped above or below to work in a levergun)

4) An off-the-shelf brand; that is, one that is reasonably affordable and available like the Speer, Hornady, Sierra.

In looking through my manuals, I find one that looks good but that doesn't have a cannelure (Hornady); one that has a proviso that it may not fit all leverguns properly (Speer); or there is limited real world information. And then looking at reviews by customers for the various bullets gives me further pause.

Purpose:
Moderately high speed varmint plinking from a loaded .30-30 tube at 100 yards or slightly less. Some accuracy would be nice, and accuracy over speed and expansion gets the nod for me. With all of the experience represented here, what do you folks suggest for the Marlin 336?

Thank you in advance for your help!

[J Miller]

John,

The only 110gr bullets I've used in the 30-30 were M1 Carbine bullets.
No cannelure. I loaded them long enough to function in my Win 94 over a max charge of 3031 and whet out in the desert to play. They fed fine, none of them pushed back into the case, (all I'd done is just touch them a bit with the crimp ring in the seating die). There was never any problems with them in the magazine either.
And surprisingly I hit everything I was aiming at.

I'm pretty sure the Hornady's are similar as they are round nose bullets.

I've also used the old Speer 100gr Plinker. It fed just fine, but accuracy was hit or miss depending on the gun.

If you have or would be willing to buy a Lee FCD, the lack of crimp groove is irrelevant. The FCD will crimp them anyway.

Joe

PS: A 110gr bullet over a max charge of 3031 made a 3 foot blinding white fire ball at night. Lots of fun!!!!

[Hobie]

IME no bullet of that weight range (100-125 gr.) going over 2600-2650 fps has been all that accurate from the leverguns (including my two 336s). However, that Sierra 125 gr. JHP is a dandy both terminally and running through the magazine (it has a cannelure, too).

[cshold]

For what it’s worth,
I have found the 125 gr. Federal Classics to be more accurate than anything else I
have ever fired through my 1961 Win 94.

[JohndeFresno]

I will look into these options for my gun.

I see that the Hornady 3015 RN is the same bullet listed as both a 110 gr. 30 M1 Carbine and 30-30 Winchester load (Hornady Sixth Edition); the Speer 30 HP "Varminter" is shared for 30 M1 Carbine and 30-30 Winchester (Speer Nr 13).

Additionally, Speer lists a 30 Carb. RN-FMJ with a better BC (.179 for the military ball vs. .136 for the "Varminter").

I am guessing, Joe, that the latter FMJ round is the one that you loaded, if it was a Speer; or one like it.

Sierra 5th Edition shows #2100 as a 110 gr. RN and #2105 for the FMJ 110 grainer as the only M1 30 Carbine offerings; their .30-30 125 grain load is the #2020 HP/FN.

I have a Lee FCD for practically every caliber I load, so that allays a large part of the perceived problem with the 110's without the crimping grooves.

The 125 grain Sierra, no doubt a bit more pricey, sounds very interesting - especially with its accuracy + expansion. I might just lean that way, instead. My intent is to handload a passle of these rounds and - if they are pretty accurate - put a passle of 'em away for "hard times" - small critter meat gittin' with the scoped levergun.

Thank you, gentlemen.

[J Miller]

John,

I should have mentioned it above but the 110gr bullets I used were a mix matched batch of FMC and SP bullets. All intended for the M1 carbine round. Some I got loose, some I actually pulled from live rounds.
None had crimp groves.

Joe

[JohndeFresno]

John,

I should have mentioned it above but the 110gr bullets I used were a mix matched batch of FMC and SP bullets. All intended for the M1 carbine round. Some I got loose, some I actually pulled from live rounds.
None had crimp groves.

Joe

Joe,

That is interesting that you had acceptable accuracy from the mixed lot.

[w30wcf]

John,
Beginning in the mid 1920's to late 1940's Winchester and Remington offered 110 gr. 30-30 ammunition. The velocity was cataloged at 2,720 f.p.s. THe bullet was a hollow point and the current Sierra 110 gr. hollow point is a close replica of the factory loading. I have found it to be very accurate out to 300 meters.

Left - factory 110 H.P. 30-30
right - 110 Sierra H.P. reload


These rounds are safe in a tubular magazine since the nose does not rest directly on the primer of the preceeding cartridge.

w30wcf

[JohndeFresno]

John,
Beginning in the mid 1920's to late 1940's Winchester and Remington offered 110 gr. 30-30 ammunition. The velocity was cataloged at 2,720 f.p.s. THe bullet was a hollow point and the current Sierra 110 gr. hollow point is a close replica of the factory loading. I have found it to be very accurate out to 300 meters...w30wcf

Help me out here, John -
Sierra 5th Edition:
Page 505: Intro to 30-30 Winchester
Page 506: #2020 30-30 125 gr HP/FN
Page 507: #2000 30-30 150 gr. FN
Page 508: #2010 30-30 170 gr. FN
Page 509: Intro to 30-40 Krag

Was this the 110 grain item introduced after Sierra's 5th Edition? Is there a newer edition somewhere?

EDIT: Well, paint me green and call me Kermit! The rather pricey and bulky Sierra Rifle and Handgun Reloading Data book makes no mention of this mysterious round; but there it is on the 2008 wall catalog that I stuck in the back of the book!

What's the matter with those clowns, anyway?

[w30wcf]

John,
The 110 Sierra H.P. has been made for a long time. It is not listed in the Sierra manual for the 30-30 since its typical use would be in a bolt action .308 or .30-06. Its profile closely resembled the original 30-30 110 factory cartridge so I decided to give them a try. They shoot very well from my Winchester '94 Centennial and 336A Marlin rifles.



w30wcf

[JohndeFresno]

Hmmm...no load data in their own manual.

So I quickly check with LoadData.com, which shows actual data from manuals and magazine articles in addition to unknown/unverified testers. I found some listings for this round with the bolt-action and the notes that it is inaccurate, and stopped there.

Er...and Sierra's are expensive. Nope - think I'll start elsewhere for my levergun critter gitters. Thanks anyway!

[Griff]

2nd Edition:


You'll like the 125HPs. They're great!!!

The 110HPs were also very accurate in my mdl94, but I had to keep them down below 2600...

[JohndeFresno]

Thanks, Griff.

That definitely helps.

I recognize that WC30WCF knows his loads. But I don't have unlimited time and range access to safely work up a load from scratch without minimum and maximum parameters as a safety net that 110 grain loading.

The 125 grainer sure is starting to look good for a bulk purchase. Especially since even the bullet company decided to drop the lighter load from 30-30 listings. They should have just added a note within the 110 grain selection that the bullet might not be as stable in some guns for that caliber. I'm going to photocopy that page and put it in my current book.

[1894cfan]

Hornady .30cal 86gr JSP on top of 11.0gr Trail Boss works for me out to about 50yds. And it even has a cannelure! HTH

[Hobie]

John,
Beginning in the mid 1920's to late 1940's Winchester and Remington offered 110 gr. 30-30 ammunition. The velocity was cataloged at 2,720 f.p.s. THe bullet was a hollow point and the current Sierra 110 gr. hollow point is a close replica of the factory loading. I have found it to be very accurate out to 300 meters.

Left - factory 110 H.P. 30-30
right - 110 Sierra H.P. reload


These rounds are safe in a tubular magazine since the nose does not rest directly on the primer of the preceeding cartridge.

w30wcf

I haven't used that bullet... Looks interesting, might work for the .30 Herrett, too!

[w30wcf]

John,
I tried several loads with the 110 gr. Sierras and they were all accurate. If I were to recommend a recipe, either the 4198, RL7 or BLC2 loads in the Sierra manual that Griff so kindly posted should work very well.

CAST BULLETS - 2600 f.p.s. I have had good luck with the 113 gr. Lee FNGC aka "Soup Can" made from Linotype at 2600 f.p.s. Groups run a bit less than 1" at 50 yards and 2" @ 100.


Hobie,
Yes, it should be a good bullet for the Herrett.

w30wcf

[J Miller]

John,

I should have mentioned it above but the 110gr bullets I used were a mix matched batch of FMC and SP bullets. All intended for the M1 carbine round. Some I got loose, some I actually pulled from live rounds.
None had crimp groves.

Joe

Joe,

That is interesting that you had acceptable accuracy from the mixed lot.

John,
Each rifle is a law unto itself. The one I was using was my 1980 Win 94 TE Trapper. This little Trapper is not overly picky about what it shoots well.

I do know what you mean about the cost of things. I'd be tempted to look at the cast bullet makers and see if they made a bullet in the range you're looking for. Might just be the way to go.

Joe

[fisheadgib]

I've used the Speer #1835 110gr HP in my 336. The Speer manual shows data pushing them anywhere from 2000fps to 2700fps and I remember them being fairly accurate. It's probably been about 25yrs since I messed with them but I'm pretty sure I used around 34 or 35 grains of 4064. (max charge in the Speer manual is 37)

[JohndeFresno]

Folks, I asked for jacketed information because I didn't expect that a cast, short bullet driven at higher velocities would be a good choice for the levergun. Once again, I am surprised at all of the options available to a seemingly narrow application.

Joe, I want to put together a good small game and extended range .30-30 load - and just one - as cheaply as possible for purchasing and loading in bulk. This is after proper fine tuning and workup, of course. But I don't want a load so finicky that it doesn't work with some measure of success in any .30-30 that I might need to load in the future. If the rounds cost more, so be it. But if the cast option is available, that would even better, providing leading doesn't enter in.

[JohndeFresno]

I've used the Speer #1835 110gr HP in my 336...

Welcome to the fire, Fisheadgib - and thanks for the info!

[JohndeFresno]

Hornady .30cal 86gr JSP on top of 11.0gr Trail Boss works for me out to about 50yds. And it even has a cannelure! HTH

That seems a bit light for my purposes, but it sounds like a good short range, cheap plinking round!

[Griff]

I bought one of the six-cavity molds for that "SoupCan" GC several years ago in a group buy over at Cast Boolits. I've cast up a few hundred, I just haven't had time to work up a good load with it. Otherwise, I'd be braggin' on it or warnin' ya off it. Out of a hardcast mix of lino/WW (1:6 respectively), with my 150 grain GC bullets I've been getting 2190 average with NO leading whatsoever. I suspect that little 113 grainer can be pushed well above that without any leading with such an alloy.

[Nath]

I used a few boxes of the Speer 110 HP over the years in my 94. I got very good accuracy out to the 150yd mark on varmints.

In the 94 though they would sometimes hang up going in the chamber.

The Hornady 110 soft point was good too but quite a bit tougher. No hang ups.

H322 I used but even got a good load with H4350 and H414 that needed using up, down in vel but still good groups.

For the life of me I can not remember if the Speer would hang up in the Marlin or not now

Nath.

[Bob A]

John,

I shoot quite a bit of the Sierra 110 HP with 2 Marlin 336 30-30s. They are accurate in both (in this case "accurate" means holding 2" in 100 yards consistenly). I did a lot of testing with several different light bullets a couple of years ago and settled in the Sierra HP because it was accurate and explosive. If you are looking for a small game bullet, you might not like the way this Varmint Bullet destroys critters. Its exactly what I was looking for - blowing up coyotes - I don't eat coyotes.
I found that my rifles liked most of the 110 gn bullets. The VMax, Hornday RN, Hornady SP all did very well. The Remington RN was another story. This bullet is sized .307 and is not accurate at all in my micro groove Marlins.
If you want a small game bullet, I would recommend the Hornady or Sierra RN or the Hornady SP. The SP has to be loaded 2 at a time but is just as accurate as the HP and has a much better BC. If you have to be able to load up the tube, the Sierra RN is also accurate in my rifles. Also, the Sierra RN is available at Powder Valley and Natchez for 16 cents a copy.

I am using Reloader 7. Max in my Marlins is about 34 gr but I found the best accuracy at 32.5 gr.
I know one guy how uses BL(C)-2 and H335. Hornady does have data for the 110 RN / 30-30 in their book. I haven't seen any diff between the Hornady RN and Sierra RN.

Bob A

[Bob A]

OOPs,

I just looked at your first post again. You wrote Varmint and I guess I read Small Game.
I would definately recommend the Sierra 110 HP.

Bob A

[JohndeFresno]

Nath,

That's pretty impressive for that 110 grain round - 150 yard accuracy. And John Kort (W30WCF) reports accuracy at more than double that range. That is even more than I would hope for.

Bob A,
You were right in observing "varmint" and "game" in my posts. I found a place where I might be able to get in some varmint thinning and therefore practice.

At the same time, I want to put away some of these loads as a small animal getter for tough times, should they ever come to this part of the world. Forget about the copper bullet laws, if that happens. Today's varmint (like coyote, stray dog, etc.) might be tomorrow's stew. And bringing down a neighbor's cow might not go over too well.

The 125 grain load sounded like a good option to try out; but with all the favorable posts regarding the smaller load, I am now considering a hollow point and less expansive load, as a pair, in the 100 grain weight - one for meat and one for pest eradication. I know that 110 grains in the right warhead can be pretty effective. The Secret Service and SuperVel .38+P and .357 Magnum defense loads with that tiny bullet were quite popular in the wheelgun days.

[Nath]

Back when I used them alot I destinctly remember shooting two crows at about that distance and a few rabbits.

My last 94 that I had alot of problems with even did ok with that load!

Nath.

[dgr416]

I used the 110 gr Speer FN Hp in both my 308 and 30-30.It worked awesome in both of them.Its my fun load in my H&K 91 and my 30-30.I hope to pop off some more.It was very accurate.I dont rember my power but I will look at my load tables to see.Its the best fun for the money.I let a friends kid who was 7 shoot up the 2 boxes of 55 gr rem acc 30-30 he loved those.

[H_Talon]

would this work ?????

Barnes TAC-X Bullets 30 Caliber (308 Diameter) 110 Grain Hollow Point Flat Base Lead-Free Box of 50

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?p ... ber=736459

I wonder how a 110 would work in my 336 in 30 GNR ... hmmmmm

I wish you guys would stop giving me ideas

Talon