General 92 questions

[Peter M. Eick]

What is the best manufacturer or importer of the 92's?

Is it better to go older or NIB?

What is the general opinion of the take down models? Reliable, or more of a gimmick?

I am idly curious about the 92's for general plinking, target shooting and general use. Not for cowboy shooting or anything. Just idly thinking about how to expand my lever collection.

[twobit]

Hello Peter,

Takedowns are certainly not a gimmick. They make cleaning the rifle oh so easy without anything
getting into the receiver. You can also take the rifle apart and put it in a suitcase for easy travel.
Do not try checking luggage though.

I don't know about the reproductions as I my eleven 1892's are vintage Winchester's. There is certainly
nothing wrong with them! Since there are no NIB original Winchesters out there then older is just fine
with me.
http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... ey#p343093
http://www.winchestercollector.org/foru ... php?t=3460

There are lots of old ones around so you might look at them.
Good luck
Michael

[olyinaz]

For plinking and general use a stainless Rossi 92 in .357 is very hard to beat. The Japanese and Italian copies are more nicely finished, but they cost quite a bit more.

Best,
Oly

[Peter M. Eick]

Thanks.

I found that Cimarron makes 92 takedowns and I have been quite pleased with my Cimarron 1860 Steel framed so I would probably go with them. Besides they are in Texas here so I keep the business in the state.

I see Classic Winchesters are availble but quite expensive.

[COSteve]

Be careful with the Cimarron '92s as they are made by Chiappa and they have had some internal issues. Be sure to inspect it carefully and most of all function check it before you buy one. They are much more expensive than the LSI/Braztech imported Rossis too.

Bud's has a SS 357mag Rossi HERE. As well as a bunch of 44mag and 45LC versions.

Able's has 44mag and 45LC ones too HERE.

[DPris]

Cimarron doesn't make anything, they are an importer.
Denis

[Bigahh]

I do not own any 92 configuration, but I hunt with someone who uses a Browning 92 in .44 Mag. I cannot compare it to any other brand, but I know I would like one just like it some day! It is as smooth as silk!

[sullkat]

I have a taylor (armi sport)take-down in 45 colt, bought it from a guy on this forum a couple years ago, and it is absolutely a great rifle.

[gak]

Get what your budget comfort level is and you'll do fine. The older Japanese (Miroku manufacture Brownings) are great, but the .357 in particular is pricey and scarce...but none of the Brownings (B92s) have the safety and rebounding hammer junk like the newer Winchesters made in the same excellent plant. Those "features" are fixable, but with an extra dose of cost and hassle. Some find these fine as-is, so it's an individual thing.

The Chiappas (Armi Sport) available through Cimarron, Taylors or LSI (Legacy) are gorgeous, safety-less and period correct. These are anywhere from a few to several hundred more than the Rossis.

Rossis are fine guns, sometimes needing (or at least desiring) a tune up for slicker operation. Most of the newer (decades) ones have a dumb safety perched atop the receiver, but that too is "fixable" if you find it objectionable as many do. Older Rossis (Interarms and EMF imported "Hartford 1892s" before 2006) were safety-less, but all Legacy (aka Puma) models made by Rossi and current Rossi-labeled imports have the safety. As of 2009 Legacy--previously the largest Rossi disteributor--started importing the Italian Chiappas instead,...confusingly keeping the old "Puma" model name they and Interarms used for their Rossis dating back 30+ years. To muddle things further, they're even using the name on their new Chiappa 1886s.

[Griff]

What is the best manufacturer or importer of the 92's?

Winchester. Please note period after the name. The Miroku plant in Japan makes the finest reproductions of the Winchester 92 available today... or yesterday for that matter. Yes, they're pricey, and yes they have added some internal and external parts (safeties, not very likely needed, but... they're there). BTW, "best" to me means strictly quality... you have qualify that with "value" for me to change my statement above.

Is it better to go older or NIB?

Hmmm... judgement call, if you can inspect and fondle it, older doesn't trouble me... and as said above the Browning imported B92s were the cat's meow. Some of the later Brownings (all make at the Miroku plant also), like their mdl 53 were just plain sweeeeet! (mdl 53 is a 1892 variant).

What is the general opinion of the take down models? Reliable, or more of a gimmick?

I like 'em, want one or more...

I am idly curious about the 92's for general plinking, target shooting and general use. Not for cowboy shooting or anything. Just idly thinking about how to expand my lever collection.

Go over to Steve Young's website for his shop (Steve's Gunz) and contact him and ask about the various imports. He works on them for cowboy shootin', hunters and others; is probably the most conversant about all the various makers and importers. But... just for starters, there isn't an American maker manufacturing a model 1892 in the US, so any you see here (outside of "antiques), will be imports. And that ain't to say that if you find an original in good condition it wouldn't be among the top on my list! But, dang that Armi-Sport take-down in nice! However, if I had the disposable income, a new Winchester TD in either 38- or 44-WCF would be on my short list.

[Arminius]

I do not own any 92 configuration, but I hunt with someone who uses a Browning 92 in .44 Mag. I cannot compare it to any other brand, but I know I would like one just like it some day! It is as smooth as silk!

That´s true!

I want one in .357 to accompany my .44 ( LNIB! )

Hermann

I think, that LOTS of Browning 92´s, THE PERFECT 92s, are destroyed by SASS .....

:/

Hermann

[Griff]

I do not own any 92 configuration, but I hunt with someone who uses a Browning 92 in .44 Mag. I cannot compare it to any other brand, but I know I would like one just like it some day! It is as smooth as silk!

I think, that LOTS of Browning 92´s, THE PERFECT 92s, are destroyed by SASS .....
Hermann

How so? They aren't modified to compete in the manner of the '73 & '66 clones. Just plain shootin' them, even runnin' 'em fast doesn't "destroy" them, sure they may break and wear a bit faster then their safe queen counterparts... but then, safe queens have never interested me. Then also, the '92 action isn't even recognized as a "good" competition action. Rugged, reliable, and certainly handsome, but... for serious competition, they're too long in the throw and have feed issues that require resolving when run at speed.

And by the way... SASS doesn't do anything to them, their stupid owners are the ones that do all the doin'! Lastly, of all the models in use, the B92 is among the least found. Their numbers were never vast, they were far more expensive than the Rossi, and they were recognized pretty quickly that the Marlin 1894 was far superior to run fast, and after the development of the short stroke kits for the toggle link actions... '92s are used by the neophyte, where required by category and by the stubborn! And the VAST majority of those will be Rossis... even silly rich folks recognize that tearin' up an out of production firearm is counter-productive.

Oh yeah, that's my opinion, and like 'em all, you might think it stinks... and that's ok also.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

This is only one man’s opinion but I have been working the 92's for the last 20 years so take it for whatever you think it's worth.
Over the years there has been several makers beside Winchester that have made 92’s. In the 1930's there was a Spanish copy known as the El Tigre. These were used a lot in the Hollywood "B" westerns when a throw down guns was needed. There were 3 rifleman 92's, one of which was an El Tigre used as the throwdown gun.
Some folks think the El Tigre was the fore runner of the Rossi but it's not. Rossi's are and have always been made in Brazil.
Next, and I believe the finest 92 ever made was the B92 made for Browning by Miruko of Japan. It's as close to the ordinal design as possible and is made with modern steel. No tang safety, no lever activated trigger block, no stiff to cock rebounding hammer, no spring loaded 5 piece firing pin. But sadly it is no longer available and they only made 20" all blue carbines in 357m and 44mag. Production stopped in the late 80’s.
Recently, about 2004 Winchester re-introduced a 92. The Winchester/Miruko 92's were a reincarnation of the B92 and are just as finely fitted and finished but Winchester added all those liability safety parts like those mentioned above. Besides making the gun awful bumpy those add-on parts consist of several tiny parts that don't hold up well for the long haul. They will probably out live most of us but they will never be as durable as the original Winchester 92. Besides feeding issues some folks have had in consistent ignition problems with the Win Miruko. Early on they were prone to stovepipe because the carrier detents were wrong. All of these problems can be cured but why bother if you are paying that kind of money.
The newest maker of the 92 is Armi Sport/Chiappa of Italy imported by LSI, Taylors and Cimarron. It is well finished but may incur feeding problems. Both the New Wins and these Chiappa guns use cartridge guides configured much like the original Wins. The problem with that is the originals guides were setup for bottleneck cart. and most of the modern 92's are chambered for straight wall ammo. Some of these newer guns will be really ammo sensitive.

You have to take in to account that about 30 to 40% of the cost to build a gun usually goes toward the final fit and finish. What that means is just because it look well fitted nad finish that doesn't guaranty it will work right.

Think about this. All the folks that made the original 92's are long dead and gone. The folks with the most experience building 92's now are the Rossi folks. They have been doing it for 30 something years. They aren't finished as nice as the others but they don't cost twice as much either and functionally it's closer to the original than the others so the dang things work. The cartidge guides are setup to run straight wall ammo so they are not as ammo sensitive. They don't have all those tiny add-on parts to fail and if you want it to run smoother they aren't that hard to work on.

The Rossi's generally get a bad rap because of the older very stiff pre-2000 guns. But, even those guns clean up well. The current Rossi's are the best bang for the buck, hands down. And, if you want it to look as nice spend the extra money and have it done or DIY.

[Cimarron Red]

Steve,

Very well presented as all of your discussions are. I like the Miroku guns very much, dispensing with the lawyer appendages to my satisfaction. I will differ with you on a minor point: Winchester began importing Miroku-made, Winchester-marked 1892's in 1997. I bought my first gun in February of 1998.

[Peter M. Eick]

Thanks Steve.

You are just down the road a bit (I am in Katy). Do you do face to face sales of the Rossi's off your web site?

I am just thinking ahead to when I decide to pull the trigger so to speak.

[Driftwood Johnson]

I think, that LOTS of Browning 92´s, THE PERFECT 92s, are destroyed by SASS .....

Whatttt? What an over generalization! Do you shoot CAS? Do you have first hand knowledge to make such an outrageous statement? Generally speaking, if any guns get beat to death in CAS, it is the replicas. Replicas are replaceable. Originals are not. Nobody in his right mind who shoots cowboy is going to destroy a nice old gun. Those of us who do shoot nice old guns in cowboy action are smart enough to treat the old guns with the respect they deserve. We do not destroy them.

Anyway.............

Sometimes you get lucky. I found this one last summer in a local shop. Bore looked like it just left the factory. I couldn't believe the price, so I ran home to check the SN. Turns out it was made in 1919. I ran back the next day and it was still there. I grabbed it and ran straight to the checkout counter. 44-40, my favorite Winchester cartridge. Refinished, so not much collector value. $450 out the door.



I found this one about ten years ago and only paid about $600 for it. Again, refinished so not much collector value. Bore is pitted but it is a tackdriver anyway. 44-40 of course.



So if you want the best, take your time and hunt up an old Winchester. They are out there.

[pricedo]

Thanks.

I found that Cimarron makes 92 takedowns and I have been quite pleased with my Cimarron 1860 Steel framed so I would probably go with them. Besides they are in Texas here so I keep the business in the state.

I see Classic Winchesters are availble but quite expensive.

I looked on the Winchester website & apparently a second generation of legacy model (86s, 92s, 94s) Winchesters are available but get ready to take a second mortgage on the house because they are going for around $1500.
The new Winnys are made in upstate Japan & the only activity around the New Haven plant site lately is from squirrels & pigeons spring cleaning their nests.
Many of the Americans whose sweat built Winchester haven't seen a paycheck in 4 years.
That's just plain WRONG.

[pricedo]

This is only one man’s opinion but I have been working the 92's for the last 20 years so take it for whatever you think it's worth.
Over the years there has been several makers beside Winchester that have made 92’s. In the 1930's there was a Spanish copy known as the El Tigre. These were used a lot in the Hollywood "B" westerns when a throw down guns was needed. There were 3 rifleman 92's, one of which was an El Tigre used as the throwdown gun.
Some folks think the El Tigre was the fore runner of the Rossi but it's not. Rossi's are and have always been made in Brazil.
Next, and I believe the finest 92 ever made was the B92 made for Browning by Miruko of Japan. It's as close to the ordinal design as possible and is made with modern steel. No tang safety, no lever activated trigger block, no stiff to cock rebounding hammer, no spring loaded 5 piece firing pin. But sadly it is no longer available and they only made 20" all blue carbines in 357m and 44mag. Production stopped in the late 80’s.
Recently, about 2004 Winchester re-introduced a 92. The Winchester/Miruko 92's were a reincarnation of the B92 and are just as finely fitted and finished but Winchester added all those liability safety parts like those mentioned above. Besides making the gun awful bumpy those add-on parts consist of several tiny parts that don't hold up well for the long haul. They will probably out live most of us but they will never be as durable as the original Winchester 92. Besides feeding issues some folks have had in consistent ignition problems with the Win Miruko. Early on they were prone to stovepipe because the carrier detents were wrong. All of these problems can be cured but why bother if you are paying that kind of money.
The newest maker of the 92 is Armi Sport/Chiappa of Italy imported by LSI, Taylors and Cimarron. It is well finished but may incur feeding problems. Both the New Wins and these Chiappa guns use cartridge guides configured much like the original Wins. The problem with that is the originals guides were setup for bottleneck cart. and most of the modern 92's are chambered for straight wall ammo. Some of these newer guns will be really ammo sensitive.

You have to take in to account that about 30 to 40% of the cost to build a gun usually goes toward the final fit and finish. What that means is just because it look well fitted nad finish that doesn't guaranty it will work right.

Think about this. All the folks that made the original 92's are long dead and gone. The folks with the most experience building 92's now are the Rossi folks. They have been doing it for 30 something years. They aren't finished as nice as the others but they don't cost twice as much either and functionally it's closer to the original than the others so the dang things work. The cartidge guides are setup to run straight wall ammo so they are not as ammo sensitive. They don't have all those tiny add-on parts to fail and if you want it to run smoother they aren't that hard to work on.

The Rossi's generally get a bad rap because of the older very stiff pre-2000 guns. But, even those guns clean up well. The current Rossi's are the best bang for the buck, hands down. And, if you want it to look as nice spend the extra money and have it done or DIY.

I've heard so many incongruous stories involving Rossi, Puma, Chiappa, LSI, Braztec, Taurus that it's become a nightmarish kaleidoscope of confusion.
Every anecdotal "source" has its own version of the interactions among the above players & the chronology..........none of which happen to agree.
Looks like the post 2000 & pre-Braztec Rossi 92s (sold under the LSI owned "PUMA" moniker) are the best ones.
My understanding is that Rossi retooled their factory around 2000 & the guns made after the retooling are quite an improvement over the older Rossis.
Quite recently Taurus bought Rossi & called the new corporate hybrid Braztec.
It appears that Braztec has let the lawyers onto the assembly lines & the second generation Rossi M92s come with an ugly little safety switch on top of the receiver that voids the warranty if removed.
I lucked out with 3 guns of the above named post-tooling/pre-Braztec (approx 2000-2009/2010) era .......a .357 Mag, a 44 Mag, a .454 Casull.
The guns work good & don't have the ridiculously redundant, legacy look marring safety switch on the receiver. The only thing I didn't like was the cheap looking yellow plastic magazine followers that were readily replaced with stainless steel ones available from Steve's Gunz.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

I've heard so many incongruous stories involving Rossi, Puma, Chiappa, LSI, Braztec, Taurus that it's become a nightmarish kaleidoscope of confusion.
Every anecdotal "source" has its own version of the interactions among the above players & the chronology..........none of which happen to agree.
Looks like the post 2000 & pre-Braztec Rossi 92s (sold under the LSI owned "PUMA" moniker) are the best ones.
My understanding is that Rossi retooled their factory around 2000 & the guns made after the retooling are quite an improvement over the older Rossis.
Quite recently Taurus bought Rossi & called the new corporate hybrid Braztec.
It appears that Braztec has let the lawyers onto the assembly lines & the second generation Rossi M92s come with an ugly little safety switch on top of the receiver that voids the warranty if removed.
I lucked out with 3 guns of the above named post-tooling/pre-Braztec (approx 2000-2009/2010) era .......a .357 Mag, a 44 Mag, a .454 Casull.
The guns work good & don't have the ridiculously redundant, legacy look marring safety switch on the receiver. The only thing I didn't like was the cheap looking yellow plastic magazine followers that were readily replaced with stainless steel ones available from Steve's Gunz.

If you have LSI imported Rossi's without the ugly bolt top safety you either have a gun that has had the safety's removed and the holes filled or you have a gun that I have never seen before.
The only post 2000 Rossi's that didn't have the safety were the guns imported by EMF up to 2006. EMF's from 2006 had it. There was a very limited number of presafety guns imported by Navy Arms, too.
LSI is the reincarnated InterArms company. It is my understanding after the InterArms owner passed away the employee's started LSI importing the Rossi's. Those guns were the first to have the safety's.

This is the bolt top safety I'm speaking of.

[DPris]

And Braztech has been around for at least ten years, I believe.
I was seeing that name associated with Taurus back then.
Denis

[pricedo]

I've heard so many incongruous stories involving Rossi, Puma, Chiappa, LSI, Braztec, Taurus that it's become a nightmarish kaleidoscope of confusion.
Every anecdotal "source" has its own version of the interactions among the above players & the chronology..........none of which happen to agree.
Looks like the post 2000 & pre-Braztec Rossi 92s (sold under the LSI owned "PUMA" moniker) are the best ones.
My understanding is that Rossi retooled their factory around 2000 & the guns made after the retooling are quite an improvement over the older Rossis.
Quite recently Taurus bought Rossi & called the new corporate hybrid Braztec.
It appears that Braztec has let the lawyers onto the assembly lines & the second generation Rossi M92s come with an ugly little safety switch on top of the receiver that voids the warranty if removed.
I lucked out with 3 guns of the above named post-tooling/pre-Braztec (approx 2000-2009/2010) era .......a .357 Mag, a 44 Mag, a .454 Casull.
The guns work good & don't have the ridiculously redundant, legacy look marring safety switch on the receiver. The only thing I didn't like was the cheap looking yellow plastic magazine followers that were readily replaced with stainless steel ones available from Steve's Gunz.

If you have LSI imported Rossi's without the ugly bolt top safety you either have a gun that has had the safety's removed and the holes filled or you have a gun that I have never seen before.
The only post 2000 Rossi's that didn't have the safety were the guns imported by EMF up to 2006. EMF's from 2006 had it. There was a very limited number of presafety guns imported by Navy Arms, too.
LSI is the reincarnated InterArms company. It is my understanding after the InterArms owner passed away the employee's started LSI importing the Rossi's. Those guns were the first to have the safety's.

This is the bolt top safety I'm speaking of.

STEVE:
I am aware of the safety indicated in the quoted graphic & my Rossi 92s don't have them.
I bought the guns from the same store & they had been in stock there for about a year.
My 16" .357 Mag has a front sight that is part of the front barrel band rather than a separate dovetail.
A triangulation point on my Rossi .454s lineage is that it was sold under the moniker "Puma" & has the magazine tube with the threaded cap & push rod & loading slot capability as well as the cheap yellow plastic follower which you were kind enough to sell me a metal replacement for.
These guns are your stock in trade & you deal with them on a daily basis so I will defer to your chronology of the somewhat convoluted history of the Rossi Puma/M92 rifle.
Thanks for the clarification.
As for the true version of the Puma, Rossi, Interarms, Chiappa, LSI, Taurus, Braztec saga I'll quit speculating & wait for your book to hit the shelves.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

I've heard so many incongruous stories involving Rossi, Puma, Chiappa, LSI, Braztec, Taurus that it's become a nightmarish kaleidoscope of confusion.
Every anecdotal "source" has its own version of the interactions among the above players & the chronology..........none of which happen to agree.
Looks like the post 2000 & pre-Braztec Rossi 92s (sold under the LSI owned "PUMA" moniker) are the best ones.
My understanding is that Rossi retooled their factory around 2000 & the guns made after the retooling are quite an improvement over the older Rossis.
Quite recently Taurus bought Rossi & called the new corporate hybrid Braztec.
It appears that Braztec has let the lawyers onto the assembly lines & the second generation Rossi M92s come with an ugly little safety switch on top of the receiver that voids the warranty if removed.
I lucked out with 3 guns of the above named post-tooling/pre-Braztec (approx 2000-2009/2010) era .......a .357 Mag, a 44 Mag, a .454 Casull.
The guns work good & don't have the ridiculously redundant, legacy look marring safety switch on the receiver. The only thing I didn't like was the cheap looking yellow plastic magazine followers that were readily replaced with stainless steel ones available from Steve's Gunz.

If you have LSI imported Rossi's without the ugly bolt top safety you either have a gun that has had the safety's removed and the holes filled or you have a gun that I have never seen before.
The only post 2000 Rossi's that didn't have the safety were the guns imported by EMF up to 2006. EMF's from 2006 had it. There was a very limited number of presafety guns imported by Navy Arms, too.
LSI is the reincarnated InterArms company. It is my understanding after the InterArms owner passed away the employee's started LSI importing the Rossi's. Those guns were the first to have the safety's.

This is the bolt top safety I'm speaking of.

STEVE:
I am aware of the safety indicated in the quoted graphic & my Rossi 92s don't have them.
I bought the guns from the same store & they had been in stock there for about a year.
My 16" .357 Mag has a front sight that is part of the front barrel band rather than a separate dovetail.
A triangulation point on my Rossi .454s lineage is that it was sold under the moniker "Puma" & has the magazine tube with the threaded cap & push rod & loading slot capability as well as the cheap yellow plastic follower which you were kind enough to sell me a metal replacement for.
These guns are your stock in trade & you deal with them on a daily basis so I will defer to your chronology of the somewhat convoluted history of the Rossi Puma/M92 rifle.
Thanks for the clarification.
As for the true version of the Puma, Rossi, Interarms, Chiappa, LSI, Taurus, Braztec saga I'll quit speculating & wait for your book to hit the shelves.

Where are you located. The reason I ask is some of the canadian imported Rossi's came sans the safety. But, the Puma model Rossi would be the LSI. If you have three without you have some rare Rossi's, at least the 454.

A BOOK!!! Who's got time? I make a living working on guns. The problem is it's mostly a labor of love. If you factor everything you have to do to do this you will find you are working for about 2 bucks and hour!!

[pricedo]

I've heard so many incongruous stories involving Rossi, Puma, Chiappa, LSI, Braztec, Taurus that it's become a nightmarish kaleidoscope of confusion.
Every anecdotal "source" has its own version of the interactions among the above players & the chronology..........none of which happen to agree.
Looks like the post 2000 & pre-Braztec Rossi 92s (sold under the LSI owned "PUMA" moniker) are the best ones.
My understanding is that Rossi retooled their factory around 2000 & the guns made after the retooling are quite an improvement over the older Rossis.
Quite recently Taurus bought Rossi & called the new corporate hybrid Braztec.
It appears that Braztec has let the lawyers onto the assembly lines & the second generation Rossi M92s come with an ugly little safety switch on top of the receiver that voids the warranty if removed.
I lucked out with 3 guns of the above named post-tooling/pre-Braztec (approx 2000-2009/2010) era .......a .357 Mag, a 44 Mag, a .454 Casull.
The guns work good & don't have the ridiculously redundant, legacy look marring safety switch on the receiver. The only thing I didn't like was the cheap looking yellow plastic magazine followers that were readily replaced with stainless steel ones available from Steve's Gunz.

If you have LSI imported Rossi's without the ugly bolt top safety you either have a gun that has had the safety's removed and the holes filled or you have a gun that I have never seen before.
The only post 2000 Rossi's that didn't have the safety were the guns imported by EMF up to 2006. EMF's from 2006 had it. There was a very limited number of presafety guns imported by Navy Arms, too.
LSI is the reincarnated InterArms company. It is my understanding after the InterArms owner passed away the employee's started LSI importing the Rossi's. Those guns were the first to have the safety's.

This is the bolt top safety I'm speaking of.

STEVE:
I am aware of the safety indicated in the quoted graphic & my Rossi 92s don't have them.
I bought the guns from the same store & they had been in stock there for about a year.
My 16" .357 Mag has a front sight that is part of the front barrel band rather than a separate dovetail.
A triangulation point on my Rossi .454s lineage is that it was sold under the moniker "Puma" & has the magazine tube with the threaded cap & push rod & loading slot capability as well as the cheap yellow plastic follower which you were kind enough to sell me a metal replacement for.
These guns are your stock in trade & you deal with them on a daily basis so I will defer to your chronology of the somewhat convoluted history of the Rossi Puma/M92 rifle.
Thanks for the clarification.
As for the true version of the Puma, Rossi, Interarms, Chiappa, LSI, Taurus, Braztec saga I'll quit speculating & wait for your book to hit the shelves.

Where are you located. The reason I ask is some of the canadian imported Rossi's came sans the safety. But, the Puma model Rossi would be the LSI. If you have three without you have some rare Rossi's, at least the 454.

A BOOK!!! Who's got time? I make a living working on guns. The problem is it's mostly a labor of love. If you factor everything you have to do to do this you will find you are working for about 2 bucks and hour!!

I'm located 40 miles west of Toronto just off the infamous 401 Hwy. but the Rossis were delivered directly to me by Canada Post mail from a dealer in Saskatchewan (Frontier Firearms).......look Ma!.........no FFL dealer required.

It's sad but true that law abiding Americans are still paying the price for the fact that Lee H. Oswald got his Carcano rifle by mail order........now you're all stuck with FFL > FFL ONLY mail transactions.

Canadian businesses can mail guns to customers & ordinary Canadians can mail guns to each other.

The other dealer I checked with is from Alberta & his Rossis don't have the ridiculously redundant add-on safeties either.

If Rossi M92s were purchased by a Canadian dealer from a third party jobber or reseller in the US rather than straight from the manufacturer I'd guess that they would have the safeties on top of the receiver to comply with the manufacturers US policy.

I guess Americans tend to be much more litigious than laid back Cannucks & that makes the gun manufacturers lawyers more nervous & cautious.

The rash of heavy duty lawsuits against gun manufacturers during the Clinton regime launched as a national anti-gun strategy by the enemies of Freedom put a Fear of God in the gun manufacturers that they never got over.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

I'm located 40 miles west of Toronto just off the infamous 401 Hwy. but the Rossis were delivered directly to me by Canada Post mail from a dealer in Saskatchewan (Frontier Firearms).......look Ma!.........no FFL dealer required.

It's sad but true that law abiding Americans are still paying the price for the fact that Lee H. Oswald got his Carcano rifle by mail order........now you're all stuck with FFL > FFL ONLY mail transactions.

Canadian businesses can mail guns to customers & ordinary Canadians can mail guns to each other.

The other dealer I checked with is from Alberta & his Rossis don't have the ridiculously redundant add-on safeties either.

If Rossi M92s were purchased by a Canadian dealer from a third party jobber or reseller in the US rather than straight from the manufacturer I'd guess that they would have the safeties on top of the receiver to comply with the manufacturers US policy.

I guess Americans tend to be much more litigious than laid back Cannucks & that makes the gun manufacturers lawyers more nervous & cautious.

The rash of heavy duty lawsuits against gun manufacturers during the Clinton regime launched as a national anti-gun strategy by the enemies of Freedom put a Fear of God in the gun manufacturers that they never got over.

Now it makes sense and you are right about the litigious nature here. The libs have figured out, it's just as effective to sue for laws they can't otherwise get pasted. This sillyness has just about killed all manufacturing in this country.

I've said many times, I don't think things will ever really change here until we have term limits and loser pay tort reform.

Also, I learned of your no FFL face to face thing several years ago. Over the years I have sent several gun your way. They all went to an import/export company in Blains Wa. ther on the US/CA border. They just walk them acros to a Van Couver Dealer that just mails them to the new owner.

[pricedo]

I'm located 40 miles west of Toronto just off the infamous 401 Hwy. but the Rossis were delivered directly to me by Canada Post mail from a dealer in Saskatchewan (Frontier Firearms).......look Ma!.........no FFL dealer required.

It's sad but true that law abiding Americans are still paying the price for the fact that Lee H. Oswald got his Carcano rifle by mail order........now you're all stuck with FFL > FFL ONLY mail transactions.

Canadian businesses can mail guns to customers & ordinary Canadians can mail guns to each other.

The other dealer I checked with is from Alberta & his Rossis don't have the ridiculously redundant add-on safeties either.

If Rossi M92s were purchased by a Canadian dealer from a third party jobber or reseller in the US rather than straight from the manufacturer I'd guess that they would have the safeties on top of the receiver to comply with the manufacturers US policy.

I guess Americans tend to be much more litigious than laid back Cannucks & that makes the gun manufacturers lawyers more nervous & cautious.

The rash of heavy duty lawsuits against gun manufacturers during the Clinton regime launched as a national anti-gun strategy by the enemies of Freedom put a Fear of God in the gun manufacturers that they never got over.

Now it makes sense and you are right about the litigious nature here. The libs have figured out, it's just as effective to sue for laws they can't otherwise get pasted. This sillyness has just about killed all manufacturing in this country.

I've said many times, I don't think things will ever really change here until we have term limits and loser pay tort reform.

Also, I learned of your no FFL face to face thing several years ago. Over the years I have sent several gun your way. They all went to an import/export company in Blains Wa. ther on the US/CA border. They just walk them acros to a Van Couver Dealer that just mails them to the new owner.

Considering the clear track record of a continuous litany of "the sky's the limit" liability & damage law suits about anything & everything in America you can't blame the gun manufacturers for being cautious to a fault.

In the fullness of time a Good Ole Boy with 3 parts of a crock of Jack Daniels in his gullet would shoot himself through the foot & want $10 Million in personal injury damages from Braztec because there was no safety on the gun.

A Cannuck who did the same thing would say "What a stupid a-hole am I, Aye" & then hobble down to the nearest clinic, pull out his free health care card & get his foot fixed.

[slimster]

Like many here, I too think the added bolt safety is unnecessary, but choose to think of it as a pre-drilled hole for one of Nate's bolt mounted peep sights!

[pricedo]

Like many here, I too think the added bolt safety is unnecessary, but choose to think of it as a pre-drilled hole for one of Nate's bolt mounted peep sights!

You still have to grind off, polish & re-blue the "blemish" where the ugly red "F" & green "S" characters were engraved into the metal & likewise fill in & grind smooth, polish & re-blue the "conspicuous as a hair lip on a chimp" gaps around the metal dovetail plug where the original front sight was to make the thing look like a "real" 92 rather than an amateurish looking "patched up abortion".
Not hard to do but a pain in the butt to remove something that was absolutely unnecessary in the first place.
In addition to legal "insulation" adding the ridiculously redundant safety provided a good ploy to allow Braztec to legally circumvent the warranty on the altered guns.
They knew a lot of these safeties would be removed and automatically void the warranty so if something breaks or screws up after you pull the safety you are on your own.

[pricedo]

What is the best manufacturer or importer of the 92's?

Is it better to go older or NIB?

What is the general opinion of the take down models? Reliable, or more of a gimmick?

I am idly curious about the 92's for general plinking, target shooting and general use. Not for cowboy shooting or anything. Just idly thinking about how to expand my lever collection.

You hear much talk about pre-64 Winchesters.
I think there will be a parallel analogy developing with pre-safety/post re-tooling genre Rossis as being the most unadulterated M92 clones faithful to the original Browning design blueprint but better because they are constructed of stronger modern materials & have significant design improvements like the slot chargeable magazine tube on the .454 models.
Looks to me like the pre-safety Rossis made since the factory retooling (I think 1997) like the pre-64 Winchesters are the new M92 standard because they are the optimum hybridization of the original Browning design & modern materials & technology.
I own 3 of them & love them.
The new Chiappas apparently have functionality problems (I can't personally speak to that because I don't own one but my sources are very credible) & the second generation Winchesters are gimmicky with tang safeties, complicated linkages & other finicky stuff you'd never see on or in a legacy Winny 92.
The one thing that the makers of the new 92s have grasped in spades is $$$pricing$$$.......the Chiappas are 2X the price of a Rossi 92 & the Second Generation Winnys are 3X the price of a Rossi 92.
Less gun + much, much more money.........not exactly the recipe for a marketing success.
And what is even more disturbing & perturbing is that none of the above guns are made in American factories & filling pay envelopes of American workers while the New Haven factory shell sits there as a home for squirrels & pigeons........ a hollow reminder of better bygone days............what's wrong with that picture??

[rodeo kid]

I guess I'm weird but the safety on my LSI Puma Model 92 doesn't bother me all that much. It is what it is and I just leave it on fire and shoot the darn thing and have fun. Same with my Marlin's and Winchester's with the crossbolt safeties. Would they be sleeker without the safeties? Yes, but it's not the end of the world. While I like an attractive firearm as much as anyone, it just seems to me it's not enough to make a firearm "ugly" if it has the add on safety. Just one man's opinion. God Bless.

[pricedo]

I guess I'm weird but the safety on my LSI Puma Model 92 doesn't bother me all that much. It is what it is and I just leave it on fire and shoot the darn thing and have fun. Same with my Marlin's and Winchester's with the crossbolt safeties. Would they be sleeker without the safeties? Yes, but it's not the end of the world. While I like an attractive firearm as much as anyone, it just seems to me it's not enough to make a firearm "ugly" if it has the add on safety. Just one man's opinion. God Bless.

Rossi could have done worse & stuck a big "eyesore" button on the side of the receiver like they do on some of their single shot guns.
The safety is not visible from either side of the gun & you'll notice in internet adds they won't mention the safety & angle the guns in the promotional photos so the buyer can't see it.
I had to open the owners manual pdf on the Braztec/Rossi website to find any discussion of the safety or a picture of it & a removed safety (as many owners will do) does indeed give Braztec the legal "grease" to wiggle out of their warranty obligations because the gun has now been altered/modified.
I was discussing the Rossi safety with my cousin the other day & he said the safety was discreetly placed & he would probably use it when he was unloading a Rossi 92 without the loading/unloading slot in the magazine tube.
During the unloading cycle there are times when the gun is cocked, locked & loaded & an inadvertent pull of the trigger could result in a discharged round through a foot or hunting buddy if the gun isn't pointed in a safe direction.
We all like to think we are walking textbooks of gun safety but I've seen muzzles from other very experienced shooters guns sweep me occasionally when they weren't paying attention.
I reload & I like to cycle each & every round through the gun it is intended for in my shop before boxing them for the range or hunting & the safety would make that operation for want of a better word......SAFER.
If you look at it objectively there are positive things to be said for the safety.
But if I had the choice to buy a Rossi 92 with or without the safety I'd definitely pick the one without the safety.