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I bought the Lee Pacesetter dies..... my assumption is one of the 3 dies is to just use some time of charging system while on press? (30-30)
Since, I am a little new to reloading I have been loading a little light....
Federal primers
Unique 11 gr
Cast 155 RN Gas checked
So, I was a little baffled for a while and then went forward with the assumption that you don't bell the mouths?
First couple I finished had WAY to much crimp and wouldn't chamber. I backed the crimp back to almost nothing and ended up seating them with an OAL at around 2.4 ... Does one need to be careful to ensure the round sits deep enough even though it cycles fine?
.... It also didn't dawn on me that likely if you are going to crimp you need to be on the crimp groove Live and learn i guess.
Again thank you for answer many of my noob questions......
You do need to expand and bell the case mouth so the bullet can be seated without damage.
If you use a roll crimp and over do it and seat at the same time you may have buckled the shoulder and the resulting bulge right at the shoulder may be preventing the round from chambering. Also some bullets are too large to enter the chamber throat area
and need to be seated deeper.
So, you see there are many things that could be going on there.
Try to chamber your brass after each step in the process and maybe you will fine the problem. Resize a piece and chamber that empty case. seat a bullet without crimping and try to chamber it. Crimp and try to chamber it. You will discover what is going on that way. I seat and crimp as separate steps.
The 3rd die in your set is likely the Factory Crimp Die. It is noticable by the small adjustment ring on it and the obvious insert if you look through it. When using the resizing die, you need to run it down to touch the shell holder with your handle pulled. Then lube the brass and run it through the die, priming at this step if you are going to do it that way. Next, I recommend a chamfer/de-burring tool that smooths the outside and inside of the case mouth. There are some bullets that will crinkle or collapse the case neck every time if you don't chamfer/de-burr both in and out. A dab of case lube in the neck helps too but first throw your powder charge. Now using the seater die, seat the bullet a little at a time looking for case neck integrity. Seat it to the case overall length specified in your manual for the bullet you are using. If the cases are sized properly and the bullet made a clean entry into the case and the cartridge is correct OAL, there is one more suspect if the cases don't chamber. Some rifles have a snug chamber or short throat and will not readily seat wide-flat-nose bullets or some bullets with a long ogive. Less suspect is the size of your cast bullets. Some rifles prefer .309, .308 or .307. Each is an individual and it would also depend on whether or not you're using gas checks. I hope this helps some. There are more experienced reloaders here that should chime in to provide additional info.
I generally agree with the other posters, in particular those of 86er. One thing I noticed, though, were the comments about belling the case mouth. This is not necessary unless you are loading cast bullets. Most loading manuals address this issue, at least in passing. The 30-30 is the caliber that I first began loading for, and have now been loading it in all variants, for close to 40 years. When loading jacketed bullets in 30-30 or any other rifle caliber with a bottleneck, you need to make sure that the case length is within specs, as published in your loading manuals. Still, you need to chamfer and burr them inside and out, as 86er describes. You can carefully seat a jacketed bullet without problems if you do this. Your 3-die Lee set doesn't come with a belling die. Straight-case calibers like 45-70, and most pistol calibers do, and it's a necessary step for loading straight cases. Loading cast bullets in anything generally requires flaring (belling) the case mouth before bullet seating, but cast rifle bullets are a whole other situation that you may want to read up on and try later on, once you are more comfortable with what you're doing. Good luck and stay safe.
antilley, since you are loading cast bullets and need a bit of a bell to load them right, you've got some options. Lee makes a "universal" belling die that will do many different calibers. But Lyman's "M" die, caliber specific, does a nicer job (as in easier to manage when case lengths aren't perfectly uniform). Back in the days when I didn't have one of these dies I used to grab up a larger diameter bullet (like a .338 or .35 for your 30/30) and set it point down in the case mouth and tap it gently with a stick or small hammer until I got a little "bell". The belling dies are much quicker and more uniform, but the old bullet trick will work in a pinch.
Also I note that your load is very polite. You wouldn't need to full length size every time if you are loading only for the one rifle. I would just run it in the sizing die far enough to get plenty of the neck sized down to hold the bullet. For something with a long neck like the 30/30 you could be a quarter inch from sizing all the way and be just fine (but try chambering one before doing a bunch this way). In fact, I've got a 300 savage die that makes a perfect "neck-sizing only" die for my 30/30 and will use that a number of times before I do a full-length size on a batch of cases that are getting light to moderate loads. My .308 die, that you'd think would work as a neck die, doesn't squeeze the neck down enough, but the 300 savage die does, at least with the particular dies I own.
And with that "factory crimp die" that you were thinking was a powder-thru die, you don't actually have to be on the crimp groove if the groove isn't in the right place for you. Makes it easier, though, if crimping in the groove works out ok for length.
The greatest patriot...
is he who heals the most gullies. Patrick Henry
When I started out with 30-30 I used the sizing die with no extra belling of the case and I got lots of lead shavings coming off the cast bullets when I seated them. And some buckled cases too. Got the Lee Universal Expander and the Lyman M Die and fixed that problem. Now I use the Lyman to enlarge the entire neck by .001 and then flare the mouth only with the Lee.
"I'll tell you what living is. You get up when you feel like it. You fry yourself some eggs. You see what kind of a day it is."
And after flaring or expanding the case mouth, I always use a chamfering tool because I prefer to make the case mouth as smooth as I can. I had a bullet somehow catch a minor flaw sticking out one time and buckled the case. In my opinion the .30-30 buckles easily, so I just attempt to avoid the possibility.
D. Brian Casady
Quid Llatine Dictum Sit, Altum Viditur.
Advanced is being able to do the basics while your leg is on fire---Bill Jeans
Don't ever take a fence down until you know why it was put up---Robert Frost
The next time your at a gun show, buy a 50MG slug. Use the slug and a small hammer to flair your case mouths. Just be careful it doesn't take much of a hit to flair the mouths.
Live and learn i guess.
