Testing load accuracy with barrel or peep sights?

[Canuck Bob]

How do you guys work load development when temporary scope installation is not an option? I want to stick with irons and hope practice and some training will help overcome aging eyesight. My vision is quite sharp for 58 still. I got lasered to 20/20 6 or 7 years ago but some decline since.

I'm talking flat blade barrel sights and receiver sights. I will be sighting in the rifles to hit at the top of the front sight as is normal for hunting, no 6 o'clock round target holds. In other words I'm looking to assess groups and have precision POI. I use elbows on the bench for bench rest and crossed sticks while sitting for rests usually.

Anyone have a list of tricks and techniques?
Wondering if I should work 50 yards or 100?
Target type or pattern favored for precision? I've been wondering if something like an upside down T would suit irons better.
Anyone use those little peeps for eyeglasses?

[Griff]

For initial sighting in, I work at 25 yards to see if the sights are "close enough"; the move to 50 for an initial group... once I get that dialed in, I'll move back to 100 and start working on my shootin'. Once I get that down to 2" or there-abouts, (my eyes are no longer young at 61), I like to then plink at 12" steel targets at 200 & 300.

If I don't have a bench, I have a pair of very short X-sticks I made for BPCRS and prone shooting... these'll usually get me what I'm looking for. Them, a mat, and a spotting scope and I'm set! For groups off a bench, I tend to use a length of 4X4, a sand bag and a rest under the buttstock so I'm not actually holding the rifle, just steadying it.

[earlmck]

I like to have my rifle sighted about the same as you are describing Bob, just at the top of the sight at 100 yards. But to shoot at said target I do best with a good old 6" black bull on white background that I can make a 6 O'clock hold on. My friend Larry who is in his mid-70s likes an 8" black bull with a 5" white center. He uses bead front sights and blacks the bead if it is too shiny (like a gold bead) and holds for the center of the white. Both of us can still shoot decent groups with the peep sights and a good load. Just this year, though, I've had to throw in the towel when it comes to open sights. The 67 year old eyeballs just can't see an open sight the same way twice in a row anymore.

I use sandbags front and rear but rest the left hand on the front bag and grip the rifle, pressing it back into the shoulder. That way I am just using the bench and bags to steady me, but trying to hold the rifle like it was being used off-hand. I know that isn't approved bench-rest technique but I am just wanting to test loads and sight rifles for mostly off-hand or sitting position shooting and some of these light rifles shoot differently shot bench-rest style as opposed to off-hand.

[geobru]

Like Earl, I use a 6:00 hold. It is easier for my old eyes to float the round bull on top of the front post. I adjust the sight so the POI is at the bottom of the bull, not the center. That way, when I aim at an animal, the POI will be wherever I hold on the critter.

[JBledsoe]

.

I'm another one who likes the center hold for hunting. So I use the black on white bull for sight-in and use the 6 O'clock hold with the front sight just touching the bottom (6 o'clock) of the black. Then adjust my sight for a 6 O'clock impact which makes it a center hold. Sounds confusing but it works.

[Tycer]

Sandbags. I have to use sandbags for load development. On two piece stocks, I mark the forestock and bag with tape and a marker to locate the rifle the same each shot. For some reason moving the stocks on the bags changes the POI. Harmonics I guess.

[stretch]

Bob, I like to sight in for hunting using the top of
the sight in the center of mass. I think you'll have
no problem getting pretty decent accuracy at 50 and
100 yards. I've got bifocals now, but my corrected
distance vision is still 20/15 or so, and I have no
trouble with open sights.

I like the bullet to hit where the tip of my front sight is
on a hunting rifle. A 6 o'clock hold is preferred for
bullseye shooting.

Most of my development shooting is done at 50 yards, and
then I confirm my zero at 100. In my neck of the woods,
100+ yard shots are rare. For revolver, I like development
work at 25 yards; confirming my zero at 50 or 60.

For sights, I prefer a narrow, square, front post, and
a peep site on the receiver. 2nd choice is a set of partirdge
sights, like on a stock SKS or Mosin-Nagant. I personally
loathe buckhorn sights, and find that round beads on the
front don't give me a precise point of aim. That's quite
possibly a psychological thing, but there ya are.

This year I worked with a number of rifles on the range.
Best 50 yard groups were with a 4X Nikon scope at 50
yards using a Hand-rifle in 243, and with a Marlin 336 in 30-30
using Remington factory ammo (!) and Skinner sights - front
post as described above and a receiver-mounted peep. The
243 shot 2 out of 3 into a 1/4" group, the 30-30 put 3 out of
3 into an inch strung vertically.

For field, or hunting guns, I do not shoot from a rest. I seem to
hold a little differently from a rest than I do from a field position.
Mostly that wouldn't make a difference in the field, but again, it's
probably a psychological thing. I currently prefer to shoot from a
sitting position when sighting in guns for hunting, unless it's a
revolver, when I just shoot offhand. My thinking here is that I'll
be shooting from a field position in the field (really!?), so I should
practice/sight in that way. While I AM interested in accuracy for it's
own sake, field accuracy is really what's important in a hunting
scenario. I like learning about how accurate my gun/load is, but
I'm more concerned about what the combination of shooter, load,
and gun will do in field conditions.

-Stretch

[Pisgah]

Like Earl, I use a 6:00 hold. It is easier for my old eyes to float the round bull on top of the front post. I adjust the sight so the POI is at the bottom of the bull, not the center. That way, when I aim at an animal, the POI will be wherever I hold on the critter.

Same here. The six o'clock hold gives a much more repeatable sight picture than the center-bull hold. What I adjust is my expectation of where the POI will be -- at the bottom edge of the bull instead of in the middle.

[Twodot]

.

I'm another one who likes the center hold for hunting. So I use the black on white bull for sight-in and use the 6 O'clock hold with the front sight just touching the bottom (6 o'clock) of the black. Then adjust my sight for a 6 O'clock impact which makes it a center hold. Sounds confusing but it works.

me too, sort of.
Flat front sight & a round black bull on white paper = "pumpkin on a post" sight picture.
I usually sight in to hit an inch or so high at 100 yards.

Anyone have a favorite color for the front sight on a hunting rig? At the moment mine is painted hot pink.
..

[JBledsoe]

.

Pink fiber optic makes a good front sight, it's easy to see in low light.

[BAGTIC]

Six o'clock hold makes sense when punching paper but I ain't never seen a deer with a bulleye painted on his shoulder. Train the way you fight and practice the way you hunt.

[bdhold]

http://www.bobtuley.com/sight_picture.htm

6 O'Clock Hold is the most accurate sighting method, especially for target shooting. You adjust your rifle to hit a little bit high. Three inches high on a six inch bullseye will put the bullets in the center.

Center Hold Puts Point Of Aim At Center Of Target. Generally Preferable For Practical And Defensive Shooting and for pistol as well. The black sight tip however can appear centered in black bullseye when in fact it isn't exactly centered.

[Ben_Rumson]

Your inverted T idea may be easier and just as effective as a method that has helped me tighten up groups... I make an appropriate proportioned for distance and sight width upside down U out of black construction paper and tack the strips on cardboard... When your sight is in the U it’s very easy to see when you have drifted off and so stop pulling the trigger & resume again when things look good again...Good luck