mh 370

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:58 pm

Well it appears that the black ( orange Boxes ) have been located.
So science and logic may tell us what happened.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Wed Apr 09, 2014 9:04 pm

A sad affair.....My guess is a hijacking gone awry

Maybe a take over by that whacko Muslim Pilot.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Wed Apr 09, 2014 9:17 pm

You are quick to judgement, with no fact.

Pete44ru · Post by **Pete44ru** » Wed Apr 09, 2014 9:43 pm

.

Too bad, that 2 weeks (or more) were wasted, looking in the wrong place(s)........... Not that it would make a whit of difference to the passengers....

.

PaperPatch · Post by **PaperPatch** » Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:20 pm

In 2011 this incident involving a 777 took place while parked at the terminal in Cairo, Egypt. Had a similar event occurred while at cruise altitude...It may explain the events of MH 370.

http://aviation-safety.net/database/rec ... 20110729-0

Scroll down to the box labeled Official Accident Investigation Report. At the bottom of that box go to the Adobe Document high lighted in blue and click on that.

The Adobe file is about 100 pages in length....scroll down half way for the photos.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:47 pm

Mescalero wrote:You are quick to judgement, with no fact.

A guess, and an opinion are not the same as declaring facts....

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:37 pm

PaperPatch,
Most smoke in cockpit events do not progress that far.

plowboy 45 · Post by **plowboy 45** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:33 pm

BlaineG wrote:A sad affair.....My guess is a hijacking gone awry Maybe a take over by that whacko Muslim Pilot.

+ 1. If this hurts a Muslims feelings real AMERICANS shouldn't care.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:51 pm

I don't care about whose feelings are hurt or not.
After 28 years and then retireing from aircraft safety, my only interest is how was the aircraft performing it's function during the time period.
Only the flight data recorders can tell us that.

Post by **Hobie** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:59 pm

They found the recorders? Everything I've seen or read says not so.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 4:07 pm

No, they think they may have the pinger locating signal.

Ray Newman · Post by **Ray Newman** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 4:16 pm

"I don't care about whose feelings are hurt or not.
After 28 years and then retireing from aircraft safety, my only interest is how was the aircraft performing it's function during the time period.
Only the flight data recorders can tell us that."
--Mescalero

BINGO!; we have a winner over here!!

wecsoger · Post by **wecsoger** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 6:39 pm

Heckuva long way from hearing multiple ultrasonic pings to actually putting (robotic) eyeballs on an aircraft several miles underwater.

No discovered debris field so I'm guessing (hey, at least I'm honest about it!) that it was a soft splash and they'll find the aircraft or at least the main fuselage intact.

The team that recovers it (and I'm sure there will be an attempt) will have bragging rights and no end of contracts for /decades/.

They found the Titanic - took couple of decades. They found that French Airbus, that took more 'n a couple years. I'm pretty sure they'll find this one, but actual discovery will be measured in months, not weeks or days.

After that, it gets interesting. Families will want loved ones back, but salvage at these depths is problematic. Just thinking, did we ever scrap the Glomar Explorer? (grin)

At least, they'll crack the fuselage at the backbone and pull the recorders, then punch couple more holes along the fuselage and into the flight deck to see inside. If warranted, they'll try to recover couple of bodies for a quick sea going autopsy, with a quick burial at sea immediately thereafter. They may or may not tell the families about this.

At this point any more speculation goes from the WAG to the SWAG category. I'm leaving it as-is and waiting for the facts. (and completely ignoring CNN)

plowboy 45 · Post by **plowboy 45** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:04 pm

Mescalero wrote:I don't care about whose feelings are hurt or not.
After 28 years and then retireing from aircraft safety, my only interest is how was the aircraft performing it's function during the time period.
Only the flight data recorders can tell us that.

I do apologize I misunderstood.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:29 pm

No problem.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:30 pm

Mescalero wrote:I don't care about whose feelings are hurt or not.
After 28 years and then retireing from aircraft safety, my only interest is how was the aircraft performing it's function during the time period.
Only the flight data recorders can tell us that.

Honest, I'm not being smart-butt when I ask: Can't an aircraft perfectly perform it's function when it flying in an unintended direction (whether by force, or design)?

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:48 pm

Yes it can.
But there is an established flight path, pre flight.
If it is deviated from, that will also be revealing.

Richardx · Post by **Richardx** » Sun Apr 13, 2014 12:45 pm

I hope that after this incident they will come up with a floating pinger/beacon that will be ejected after it is below 50m and give impact location after a shock of what 10gs? I know that survival in the ocean at the impact speeds that most crash occur is practically nil.
If a plane is "crash" landed, like certain Hudson River landings there is a chance but those occurrences are very low in percentage.
My thoughts of this floating beacon would save a lot of expense and time if not lives of the rescuers and speed up response time and hopefully find any survivors.

My thoughts go out to the families of the crash victims.
Richard X

wecsoger · Post by **wecsoger** » Sun Apr 13, 2014 1:42 pm

An ejectable-on-crashing alerter is a good concept, but will never happen. It's a huge amount of engineering to be done, translated, 'it costs too much'.

Something that probably will happen, but first, a little background. A large majority of newer aircraft are already data capable and there's in-place right now a data network for them to use, ACARS. For most aircraft it's a squirt of data on a regular schedule. There's a wealth of information in that data, very useful for not only knowing what the aircraft is doing, but how it's 'feeling'. Interpreted correctly, it can head off maintenance problems. System is detailed enough to even generate a message for the mechanic at the next stop to have couple extra quarts of oil for the number 2 engine come the next stop.

MH370 had the equipment, but it didn't buy the service (cheap Malaysians!) and that's what generated the pings. Aircraft would contact the ACARS network, network would say, 'I'm here, what'cha got?', aircraft would say, 'nuttin', I'm just moving along here'.

So saying, I can see a big push for real time data transmission for properly equipped aircraft. Now that amount of data would overwhelm the worldwide network in seconds. So they'll have to scale it down, say in the event of couple parameters exceeded, like altitude and ground level intersecting, the plane will do a data dump of the last five or ten minutes then go real-time till the situation gets sorted out or terminates.

Big hold up on that will be the aircrew. Data's fine, but they've fought the cockpit voice recorders from day one. Right within easy reach is a button marked "Erase" which will wipe the CVR and have it start again on its recording loop.

Shame someone in Malaysia Airlines made decision not to buy into ACARS. We would have known the aircraft location down to a couple hundred feet, before, during and after it splashed.

Full disclosure, I used to work for an airline, and part of the time I was an avionics technician. I am intimately familiar with the innards of the Fairchild CVR, amongst other various boxes.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sun Apr 13, 2014 2:13 pm

I would like to know what the TCAS system was doing.

wecsoger · Post by **wecsoger** » Sun Apr 13, 2014 4:59 pm

I'm confused, as TCAS is totally irrelevant here.

For you non-aviation types, TCAS, Traffic (alert) and Collision Avoidance System. An aircraft is broadcasting, "I'm at this location, altitude and heading this direction". If a couple of the boxes come to an agreement they are going to have an "area confliction", i.e. smack into each other, they agree amongst themselves, one box tells their aircrew to dive, the other box tells their aircrew to climb.

MH370 was never reported near any other aircraft.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know the conspiracy theories.

I'm also a firm believer in Occam's Razor.

What we do know. An aircraft has disappeared. Mathematical analysis of last data transmissions (ping) times place the aircraft along a huge arc on the globe. Very close to a spot on that arc, multiple flight recorder beacon transmissions have been received.

That's all we do know. Everything else, i.e. black holes, aircraft shadowing, trench graves and the rest is complete idle speculation.

Pending recovery, for now I'm sticking with my Netflix queue, my Chromecast and Roku.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sun Apr 13, 2014 5:36 pm

I think location, altitude and direction are relevant, but what do I know?

mh 370

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