Any 38-55 loads using slower burning powder ?

[BenT]

I've been load testing my 94 with 26' barrel. What I am finding is that my loads aren't any faster than published data. I figured the extra barrel length would give me some added velocity. But most the powders listed are fast burning. I tried RL7,4198, and H322. Does anyone have any loads with slower burning powder ? Or does slower powder not work well in straight wall cases. I was thinking about maybe trying Varget. Thanks

[1886]

You did not mention the bullet weight or the age of the rifle. I will assume a modern rifle designed for smokeless pressure. You may find that Varget provides nice accuracy and consistency but it will not provide more velocity than the powders you listed. The powders you listed should certainly provide more velocity. Regards. 1886.

[BenT]

The rifle is a mid 70's with a new Numrich octagon barrel. I been using 200grain sierras because I have alot of them. Most the reloading manuals show the powders I mentioned. They are the same powders listed for other straight wall cartridges like the 444.Slower powders seems to require more volume to get velocity. Varget seems to performs good on other cartridges but usually is listed as compressed loads.

[Bill in Oregon]

Ben: I use IMR 3031 under my .379 220-grain softpoints, but load only to about 1900. A friend uses the same bullet and gets to 2300 using RE7 in an H&R Target Classic single, but it may well be stronger than an older lever gun.

[Longfin]

You seem to be indicating that, because you rifle has a 26 inch barrel, you should get higher velocity than "published data." What was the length of the test barrel in the published data? Also, since you are using a .375 bullet, what is your barrel groove measurement? Is your barrel a .379 or .380 barrel? Have you found an accurate load for your rifle? That is more important than getting an extra 150 fps. I have a .376 20" barrel and so far RL7 has given the best results with the 220 grain JSP. I have been trying to find some AA 2015 but no one around here seems to carry it.

[Old Savage]

My 26" 30-30 gets a little more that 100 fps more than my 20" on the average with the same factory ammo - Fed and Hornady. The 26" gets the Federal published velocity.

[Yodar]

Ben T,
Longfin is right. Stick with loads that are consistantly accurate, i.e. group well, and don't try to "hotrod" the .38/55. If you will recall, the old Winchester "High Velocity" factory load for this round produced something like 1500 fps at the muzzle. Current factory loads run around 1100 fps.

I have a Winchester 94, circa 1940, that was restored (nicely figured wood, case hardening, blueing, Marble tang sight) and rebarrel to .38/55. The barrel is 26 inches long and the groove diameter slugged out to 0.375". I shoot 240, 250, and 265 grain cast lead, gas-check bullets 0.376" and 0.377" in diameter. Over several years I have tried most of the usual powders: IMR-4198, RL-7, IMR-3031, IMR-4895, and H-322.

After a lot of experimenting, I have settled on 23.3 grains of RL-7, a 265 grain SAECO #373 cast lead, gas-check bullet from Mt. Baldy, in Winchester cases primed with WLRs. Overall length of the loaded cartridges was 2.496". Average muzzle velocity for one of the better 5-shot groups was 1489 fps and the 50-yard group measured 13/16". Moving out to 100 yards, it will keep 5 shots in 2 3/4 inches (4 shots in 1 1/2 inches) if I do my part. This load works well in my rifle but it may not in yours so you will have to do your own load development.

I have not had much luck with IMR-3031 unless the loads were very mild, around 1200 to 1300 fps. Twenty-five grains of IMR-3031 behind a 240 grain Laser Cast RNFP gave 1278 fps and a 1 3/16" 5-shot group at 50 yards. This load is very consistant and pleasant to shoot even in a rifle with a steel crescent butt plate.

I hope this helps. Please keep us informed as to your progress and remember no "hot rodding".

[Hobie]

IME, the current RL-7 is optimum for the 255 gr. jacketed bullet.

[BenT]

The barrel is a new and slugs at .375. Usually most of my loads are below published data because of most of my leverguns have 20' barrels and most data is listed with 24'. I don't have any other guns with a barrel this long and my only thought was that a slower burning powder would get the most use out of a longer barrel and maybe build less pressure. But I don't know. I'm not hot rodding but doing some load development.

I'm looking for a load around 2000 fps with 200gr sierras. I want somewhat flat shooting out to 150 yards for deerhunting. This shouldn't push the pressure envelope. I'm just fishing to see if anyone had luck with slower burning powders. So far H322 and H4198 seem to be on equal footing as far as accuracy. But I keep hearing people being happy with varget in their 30-30. But as it sits right now H322 and H4198 is what I will continue to develope. But I think I might purchase Ranchdogs new soon to be available 235 gr mould. Then I will develope a cast load. Thanks for your input.

[longarm4146]

I really like XMP-5744, it's kinda in the middle of the burn rate spectrum but its pretty clean, and not positional sensitive espicially in lead bullet, light to medium loads. I use it in my 45-70s, 38-55s, and 40-65 with loads in the 1200-1300 fps range and it does not require any filler to be consistent. Yuo'd have to look at Accurates load data for jacketed bullets for the type of hunting loads your looking for to see if it would be applicable. good luck.

[Last Spike]

Good thread. I'm hoping to try some Blackhorn 209 in my 38-55 and other leverguns. Got some data from the Western Powder people and need to contact one of the dealers up here to get the powder shipped out my way.

[Bluehawk]

I like AA 5744 too and most of my 38-55 loads are with that
That said 2400 and 4759 are EXTREMELY close to the burning rate of Black Powder and do very good work in lots of straight walled cases

[Hobie]

The barrel is a new and slugs at .375. Usually most of my loads are below published data because of most of my leverguns have 20' barrels and most data is listed with 24'. I don't have any other guns with a barrel this long and my only thought was that a slower burning powder would get the most use out of a longer barrel and maybe build less pressure. But I don't know. I'm not hot rodding but doing some load development.

I'm looking for a load around 2000 fps with 200gr sierras. I want somewhat flat shooting out to 150 yards for deerhunting. This shouldn't push the pressure envelope. I'm just fishing to see if anyone had luck with slower burning powders. So far H322 and H4198 seem to be on equal footing as far as accuracy. But I keep hearing people being happy with varget in their 30-30. But as it sits right now H322 and H4198 is what I will continue to develope. But I think I might purchase Ranchdogs new soon to be available 235 gr mould. Then I will develope a cast load. Thanks for your input.

H4198 31 gr., H322 32 gr., RL-7 31 gr., IMR 3031 33 gr. all under the 255 gr jacketed bullet all give .30-30 pressures and very usable velocity of about 1875-2000 fps from a 22 inch .375" bore. The lighter bullets were never as accurate as the 255s in either this barrel or in my old (and departed) Marlin 1893.

[BenT]

Hobie , I will have to agree I don't think these 200gr shot as good as the 220gr I was using in another rifle. But I have a bunch of them and I'll find an accurate load. I also was reading Ken Waters last night and he stated that any powder slower than 3031 didn't perform well. So that answers that question. I'll play with H322 and H4198 and see what happens. Thanks for the input .

[Hobie]

For me, both H4198 and RL-7 gave better groups and velocities and apparently at less pressure than H322 and IMR3031.

[44LVR]

I"ve had real good luck with 31 1/2grs of 3031 and a 275gr GC cast bullet sized .379. Haven't a clue to velocity but she shoots through both sides of a bull elk

44

[Old Time Hunter]

AA1680 while still a fast powder, it has shown quite a substantial jump in velocity without signs of high pressure. My go to powder has always been the H4198, but 31 grains is the limit on it with 1900 to 2000 fps using a 220 grain bullet.

[1886]

It seems that 1680 gets considerable air time on other forums with respect to the .375 Win. It seems to the big time velocity champ. I spoke to Mic about AA1680 and it's application in the .375 Win. and the .38-55 in modern guns. Mic tells me this powder is best avoided in these rounds. He says the pressure curve is all wrong. RL-7 is at the top of the list. Best of luck. 1886.

[Old Time Hunter]

1886, The reason I brought up the AA1680 is that after experimenting with RL-7, H4198, and IMR4198 (they are not exactly the same) and shooting competition with my .375 Win/.38-55, and after thousands of rounds, if I want velocity I go with AA1680. If I want consistancy I go with H4198 ( I can be plus or minus a half of grain and the performance difference is non existant). The thing is, at 31.5 grains of H4198, I am starting to see pressure signs, hard ejection, primers starting to move, etc. Yet my chrono has only moved from approximately 2000fps to 2050fps with a 220 grain bullet. At 2k fps, I am fine for comp with a set range of 50 yards to 150 yards. RL-7 is all over the board, I would need a different load for each range. AA1680 allows me to increase the velocity to 2200 fps, without any hint of high pressure, therefore giving me consistant performance from 50 yards to 200 yards (even placed 2nd when stretched to 250 yards). My only grevience regarding the AA1680 is that half a grain either way and you are way off on your POI's. Don't know anything about pressure curves and such, just what happens at the other end.

[1886]

O.T.H. not faulting you for mentioning AA1680. As I stated this powder receives glowing reports on other forums. Many seem to prefer this powder. I asked Mic about its application with respect to the .375 Win. and the .38-55, I ask a lot of questions. He strongly recommended against this powder. Just passing the info along. I do not know much about pressure curves either. I am just parroting what I was told. 1886.

[Grizzly Adams]

H335 works well for me in the 38-55. Anyone else use it?

[Bronco]

Howdy,
One of the fun things about reloading is trying out safely different components. I did a lot of experimenting with various powders and found that part of the fun going to the range and seeing what you get . Don't have a 38-55 though, it is on the want list!!
John